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I like almost everything about the Legacy Berkshire (ATSF  4196 from most recent catalog) that I pre-ordered.  When it arrived some weeks back I liked nearly everything about it.  It runs perfectly - smooth and slow.  I, sounds great, etc.  

 

But at a tad less than 24 inches long, it was  considerably shorter and smaller than the 26.5 inches advertised in the catalog.  From what I understand Lionel used an old K-Line casting this time, not its own casting for a much larger Berk and just forgot to change the Berk length in its catalog.  But the shorter length turned out to be great!  After a bit of research I discovered that my model is almost exactly scale length, and also not a bad re-semblance to, the later 4100 ATSF Berks.   The 4100s were quite a bit smaller than many Berks built later on.  

 

But one feature on my model bothered me a lot: the cab was way too small.  Cabs differ, yes, but whether a big or small loco, whether it had small or big drivers, etc., every other scale steamer I have has a scale 6'10" to 7+ feet of cab headroom - every one.   This Berk has a scale six feet - and barely that.  I'm definitely not a rivet counter, but it just didn't look right among my other locos.  The first photo below shows one example, comparing it to the tiniest scale-size steamer I have - the shifter. 

 

The second photo both shows my Berk compared to my scale Atlantic (lower part of the photo) and demonstrating the too-small cab, and identifies where I determined the deficiency was (circled red in the photo of the real 4199 and the photo of my model): the actual cab extended nearly a foot farther up above the back edge of the boiler than on the model.

 

I've been delayed by having to replace track, but have that project well in hand.  So today I took off the afternoon from that work to finally fix my Berk (last two pictures) - building a  "cab cap," and attaching it and filling etc., then repainting/blending the paint, all in only five hours of work. The new cab has a scale 6" 11 inches headroom.  It now looks realistic - both closer to the prototype, and more in line with my other scale locos.    

 

Berk 4196 back to back with my new Shifter, which is scale size.  Its cab is quite a

bit bigger than the Berk's.

Compare to Shifter

 

Below, in the lower portion, note that again, the scale Atlantic's proper sized cab

dwarfs the Berk's.  At the top, the real 4199.  Red circles compare the cab roof

height above the back edge of the boiler.  The model is nearly a foot "short" here.

AAA cab ridge Berks

 

I wrapped the whole loco in a bag to protect it, then cut the back of the cab roof off and

sanded the roof rivets and ridges smooth, etc.  The made a curved "cap" by gluing

many thin layers of styrene in a curve over the roof.  Once hardening, I epoxied 

and screwed it down.  I made a new roof and "riveted" it myself, then glued it on

and trimmed it to the right size.

Top ready to go on

 

In profile it is still a handsome loco but now strikes the eye as not a big (but not a 

tiny loco either).  

Berk done

 

Fixed, the cab height matches that in the Photo of the real thing (and also matches

pictures of 3rd Rail models of the 4100s which I know are pretty accurate).

I'm pleased with this puppy now. 

Second view

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Images (5)
  • Compare to Shifter
  • AAA cab ridge Berks
  • Top ready to go on
  • Berk done
  • Second view
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Looks like nice modification work as always Lee. Not to "rain on your parade", heres a photo of my "k line tooled" legacy berkshire as compared to the cab height on my  Lionel scale mohawk from 2005,presumably will be the same one released with legacy from the new catalog. The mohawk is a larger model, as well as prototype, with larger drivers to boot.I'm not saying your wrong, but the s1 berk is not the only scale model with a short cab

 

005

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Images (1)
  • 005

But one feature on my model bothered me a lot: the cab was way too small.  Cabs differ, yes, but whether a big or small loco, whether it had small or big drivers, etc., every other scale steamer I have has a scale 6'10" to 7+ feet of cab headroom - every one.   This Berk has a scale six feet - and barely that.

 

This would seem to be a valid observation as it  seems logical that prototype steamers would be able to accommodate tall engineers/firemen. At only 6 feet, I'd certainly bump my head!

 

Good job Lee and thanks for the detailed explanation and photos.

 

RickO what would the scale cab height be in your Mohawk?

Originally Posted by c.sam:

 

 

RickO what would the scale cab height be in your Mohawk?

Theres maybe a millimeter( for lack of an exact scale) difference barely visible in my photo, certainly not enough to bother me. Having said, that after perusing through some online photos in all fairness to Lee, it almost appears that the prototype Santa Fe berk Lee posted may have a larger cab than the B&A version.

 

Originally Posted by RickO:

Not to "rain on your parade", heres a photo of my "k line tooled" legacy berkshire as compared to the cab height on my  Lionel scale mohawk from 2005,presumably will be the same one released with legacy from the new catalog.

 

005

Study your photo carefully, Rick O.  Compare it to the picture of the Berk I have in my photos.  Note:

a) the sand dome and a lot of details along the boiler top are com[letely different, etc.  

b) the boiler shape is all different, too - yours does not taper to a smaller diameter near the cab as mine does - in fact it looks a bit fatter toward the back.  

In other words, yours and mine are not the same tooling -- not the same model Berk. Yours is interesting -- I'd like to have one actually -- but not relevant to me with regard to my current Berk.  Still, thanks all the same.  I do appreciate the info and I'm going to try to find a K-Line Berk like yours for my collection.. 

 

The key facts to me are unavoidable: 1)  all my scale  locos have right around seven feet of headroom in the cab.  I think all steamers did - its not like they were pressed for space and a lot of people who working in the cabs were big guys - so if figures they would not have just six feet of headroom.

My model Berk, wherever it came from and whoever made the tooling, had only a bare six feet of cab headroom (max, at the center, and a lot less at the sides) even if it was exactly the scale length.  

-- >And the 4199 (the one in the photo) certainly had 6' 10" plus - I get that height working from the photo I posted and perspective geometry based on the driver diameter.  A drawing in a book my uncle had (he drove for ATSF) from 1937 lists it as what looks like 83 inches (80 something - hard to read it's so old and the print is so small - could be 88 but I can't believe it is that big . . . ).  Anyway, I am very pleased with the result.  

Last edited by Lee Willis
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