former catenary poles

placing code 100 rail (upsidedown) through the rail connectors on the underside at 90 degrees of the horizontal limbs above center rail of track below worked flawlessly in 2005.

shaping, bending, cutting cross wires, and soldering is a delicate procedure.

it's only one connection at a time, 36 inches each section, until all unified.

one ZW side handle for overhead power, the other ZW handle for track power.

result: one electric run overhead, the other train steam or diesel or even another electric center rail powered yeild Two locos run on same layout fashioned originally for one train at a time traditional operation.

will post possible progress.

leroof, at it again!

. 

hope all is safe and well for everyone this Easter Sunday.

Question: the square horozontal arms I use are made of K & S 1/4 brass.

might anyone know who makes a end cap to fit over square 1/4 inch openning?

thank you for any leads, links.

repaired a dozen funky worn catenary poles today!

tomorrow I will solder the code 100 rail connectors. 

Beautiful work Leroof I have always liked operating catenary wires and will be following along with your progress. Years ago I bought out an entire K&S display rack and extra stock from a hobby shop going out of business. That purchase has served me well over the years the material being used for numerous projects.

I'm not aware of any 1/4"  i.d. brass caps for the end. Have you considered maybe snipping the ends and folding it in like a box and soldering the seams...or maybe cut some small slugs of 3/16" solid square bar and solder it inside the end to give it a finished look.

the three tables (doors) will utilize 35 catenary poles which I will have ready for measurement and placement.

there is a possibility that I will start the bending ( 031 curves mostly ) and feeding of the code 100 scale rail this week. I plan on doing one table at time. i remember most of the return loops were easy to apply over head. the two cross tracks were a bit more challenging to cut fit and solder. Where these rails meet must be perfectly level to accomodate pantograph smooth crossing and transition. 

So, it was worth it in 2004, I am equally excited about the 2020 application.

These things have a 7mm hole in them which might work. You could solder the small holes closed. 

https://www.etsy.com/ie/listin...-12-raw-brass-square

GMAN24.

gotta love all K&S stuff! 

you raise some interesting possibilities. thank you.

while thursday through Sunday in my county  in Maine was spent without power due to a freak April heavy wet snow storm and high winds, today I was able to gain some progress.

the hero's at CMP worked tirelessly to restore power by Saturday night.

right now we are entering another high wind velocity storm 55mph + in this coastal region.  oh well, I can continue this project when all is clear! 

in the mean time, i am thinking about an expansion (4th table just like in 2004 ) with an overhead wire encircling the outside through some extra bridges. 

wind kicking up, lights dimming! gotta go... 

to be continued.

There was something very familiar with your photos that I couldn't put my finger on . That was until I found and old article that I had torn from an old  Classic Toy Trains magazine from January 2003 .  I aways thought it was a great layout and it had catenary !

Good morning everyone, breezy and sunny this a.m. still have power for now.

while looking over space requirements I noticed some possible layout design woes, Not the catenary, but its the compact nature of my layout, a series of 031 return loops. 

now if I am able to add a couple of passing sidings, or 4th table,  I may traverse the layout with two dedicated locos/trains with some provision for space dedicated courtesy.  Simply stated, before setting up overhead I should do some clear assessment of the basic plan, make some improvements or expansions first, not after installation of overhead power! 

today, I will (juggle) continue refurbishing poles, placing code 100 rail connectors ( with low heat solder) and then cleaning the poles of any left over flux.

while doing this task ( and multi other home schooling, chores, daily family stuff) I am looking over layout alterations weighing pros and cons. 

have a great  safe day everyone.

 35 catenary poles, one semi hollow door with homosote top (painted that green like those before) are in  Standby Mode.  two metal sawhorse type Stands for door, locking latches found (used to fasten doors together)  needing to check on track switch supply in the event of expansion. 

the day's mental  tasks just got a bit more complex!

 reminding myself not to get overwhelmed with extraneous hypervigilant distractions (no matter how much fun they are).

Mantra 4 today :finish the catenary poles task first.

Hi JohnnieWalker! You have a great eye. This is spot on!

Yes in fact my layout is basically based on Peter Riddle's  in that article and from his book "Easy Lionel Layouts you can Build".  My 2004 layout had the outside siding  in table one, which I rarely used, so it was placed inside the loop as a gantry crane siding. 

Currently, in the revised layout, that table number one has a figure eight in an oval and an exit/entrance to the transition table number two.

The Peter  Riddle layout had an elevated BUDD car point to point  line plus a simple catenary on the main level. 

Thanks for your response.

Leroof posted:

Question: the square horozontal arms I use are made of K & S 1/4 brass.

might anyone know who makes a end cap to fit over square 1/4 inch openning?

thank you for any leads, links.

 

You can use a Lionel 62-3 post cap from the 151 semaphore, they come in plated metal and black plastic.

Johnnie Walker, these are the photos from 2005. u can enlarge them for viewing. 

that layout made in 2004 was sold to a friend of mine along with all the 3 rail trains.

As per the mag article by Peter Riddle,the only difference was in the first table the outside siding I put inside return loop doing gantry crane duty and the added obvious 4th table of accessories. I am on the fence about 4th table recreation. I would simplify that table to add plasticville and two working accessories, and some light towers,  definitely  the catenary too that table may take on a different configuration.

I just followed the track Using anti-derail in switches to control a different switch, and other some isolated rail "tricks"; it yields one heck of a double reverse loop  😎  

Adriatic, this layout essentially runs itself and reverses direction in multi return loops.

the second table is the transition table for which I can (022  control )open the third table for use.

in my former 4th table (2004) I isolated it for use as an action accessory table with a separate V and ZW transformer. 

currently I only have one ZW to run the three tables.

the fun will be controlling two engines on the same trackage, one center rail, one catenary power.

it is hoped that working on the catenary masts will resume in more controllable laminar schedule in the following days. 

I dug through several boxes of storage and found my

Rail Bender plus the new unopenned box of code 100 rail today!

report to follow this week.

LIONEL PARTS, thanks for the tip. I will ask you about the plastic ones.

They are the postwar ones. Imread they are a bit smaller than the prewar ones. Will they fit over 1/4 inch SQUARE tube?

Thank you.

Following along intently Leroof. Very neat concept.....now where's the popcorn?

RSJB18, while you were following intently, my 5 year old grand daughter ate All the popcorn! lol

the strongest bond is the adherence via solder to the horozontal limb, the importance of the rail joiner placement is paramount.

my Waterloo! as in Napoleon's final mistake!

the rail joiners are not only flimsy, they refuse to adequately solder! big bummer!  they certainly aren't made of the same easy to solder material as the ones I used to build the 2004 ones.

I tried low heat solder rod as in the past to avoid dismantling the other parts. I have liquid flux and know how to use it. I spent over an hour to no avail.

I will try a higher heat or different solder with some heat sinks when I recover! lol. I have about 30 masts to do!

until that time when I can succeed  or alternately find NOS code 100 O scale rail connectors with proper metals that will solder, I am forced to Exile this project.

time to regroup my thoughts and possibly intentions.

back  when resolved.

higher heat with lower heat solder and heat sinks works but after desoldering a couple of masts (dooh!) I need to find a technique that may work Everytime.

stay tuned....

Leroof,    I'm glad you are able get back to this much anticipated project.  Drat on the rail joiner metallurgy.  I'm confident that you will find a solution.

Fendermain

Fendermain! so good to see you here, long time.

I managed to succeed in soldering a couple of them, I guess finding the right heat with best heat sinks applied will help this along. so, it wasn't the metallurgy but with some regained practiced fortitude I will press on. my other concerns are the flimsy soft nature of connector. the older ones (2004) were beasts. I could accidently bang into the catenary and it would not budge. little to no repairs back in the day.

be safe and carry on, all my best to ya buddy.

"driving in my car, smoking a cigar, the only time Im happy swen I play my guitar" 

Wednesday. So some of those repairs were a BEAR! a few I just had to "blob solder" while this day was not about precision, I must say I am glad that it for the most part worked and the hardest part is over despite being a most challenging endevour. I didn't expect any of this! placing the rail joiners was the easy part in 2004. but that was clean brass and superb railjoners.

so the deciding moment arrived when I increased my heat on the iron and used regular 60/40 rosin core solder, same flux.

some of them are funky but solid. we will see what their longevity is when run via speeding pantograph! 

next is all the cleaning of flux residue and general spiffying of cateary masts.

who knows, maybe I can start bending and placing code 100 rail this week

thanks for your patience and support,

stay tuned.

Leroof back at it.....

tomorrow I will decide where I need to run wires for towers, a couple of bigger working accessories and 022 switch controllers and the like. note: this is an important priority as it is really difficult to do simple stuff inside the catenary poles that surround the layout. ask me how I know ( see 2004 photos!)?

btw I think I will refer to them and their application as catenary Masts from here on end. 

taking a day off from this electrifying experiment.

be safe, be well to you all and families.

Leroof

Leroof posted:

LIONEL PARTS, thanks for the tip. I will ask you about the plastic ones.

They are the postwar ones. Imread they are a bit smaller than the prewar ones. Will they fit over 1/4 inch SQUARE tube?

Thank you.

They are about 0.250 to 0.270 inside .

LIONELPARTS, thanks for the info. sending you an email.

thirty five catenary masts ready for duty.

todays electrifying agenda, more planning and possibly the 4th table that will use a few catenary masts.

good day to you all.

leroof

Ready......

RSJB18, say it loud. Orville Redenbacher is light as a cloud...

100% organic awesome popcorn. just add butter and salt and watch leroof enter into the ( you know the music)  twighlight zone.

today's agenda (friday) includes a review of practical spacial relationship potentially shared by two (one center rail power, one overhead power) engines, paying close attention to the traversability (new word?) of interlooping passage. 

in other words before setting up catenary masts I need to have some passing siding installed, or some other form of polite safe  alternate route. I am still contemplating the 4th table, kind of a stretch but of some operational importance. 

this weekend, I will start bending the power rail, possibly setting up a short run to share, via a short movie. keeping positive (as the current may be) is the main objective.

Leroof, entering the basement.

Friday was a wash. no catenary stuff or layout modifications. I ran my 2055 through the return loops envisioning an electric (via overhead power) sharing same layout. note: I am so mesmerized by traditional locos running loops that I am indeed perplexed by how operating Two locos in given space will work. I explain it to myself like this, any new challenge will become a practice. 

Time and electrical flow will tell. 

Saturday, shaping overhead rail is at least planned. possible video if rail any rail is mounted.

it's Friday night and this concludes the telegraph catenary broadcast for today. we now return you to the pages of OGR forum.

good night.

After taking a train and Forum break for a while, I read this thread this morning. So good to see all the progress you have made, Leroof, on your catenary and layout. Arnold

hi Arnold! I remember my last visit to you and Westchester Toy and Train show. Topics discused included the revival of my catenary masts and a possible future installation on your Putt. It would be great to have one line of overhead in that long straight stretch of your fabulous layout! 

stay tune for stuff to evolve this weekend and next week ( up here).

have a great weekend.

going out for that daily jog now, brrrrrr, it's only 35 degrees!

video:A short 36 inch trip.

now I can continue with layout work and add the catenary selectively when ready to add electric line.

note this was a quick set up and demonstration. setting up this system  as in the 2004 application will take a considerable investment of placement stradegy and fortitude! I am happy to share the  future progress.

Leroof

the outake video!

ha ha! 

but I must say the EP5 just runs so smooth under wire.