Gargraves vs Fastrack Economics

For me personally, after extensive research for my new layout, i've decided to go with Gargraves track + RCS switches (and some prefab RCS curves as i'm leary of bending GG track) . While Lionel fastrack is a BIG improvement over the old tubular rail system, of which my old layout was built, it is still not nearly as flexible when it comes to custom designs. If youre going with a table top style, pre-fab type layout, i would think it would suffice and look great to boot.  But if your thinking of custom curves or gradual changes to straights of any sort, it will be limiting.  Elec hookups with GG or RCS would mean more soldering versus "plug-play" of fasttrack.  DZ switch machines can be added or subtracted without removing the switch.  I find this nice as i plan to install mostly manual switches but if i find reach problems later, or just want to add remote capability, they can be added without changing the whole switch. Also great to replace if one fails.  For signal activation with GG or RCS, you'll need separate infrared devices or isolated rails. Hope this helps.

On the question of cutting FasTrack, the best method I've seen is to leave the factory ends intact (so that the mating plastic tabs can still snap together) and cut a section out of the middle using a mitre or table saw with a slow feed rate.  Epoxy the two cut ends back together, discarding the middle section.

Before applying epoxy, 3 FasTrack outside rail pins with the bottom tabs removed can be inserted into the rails to maintain alignment through the cut.  I'd suggest not using any of the middle rail track pins, but use an outside rail pin in the middle.  Some have also used regular O gauge tubular track pins, crimping them in place.

FasTrack joining pins can be purchased directly from Lionel Customer Service or salvaged from other track pieces.  For even better electrical continuity across the seam, jumpers can be soldered to the folded rail tabs underneath the roadbed.

This method can be used with straights and curves.

On the question of FasTrack switch replacement, most of the parts have been available from Lionel Customer Service as well.

@SteveH posted:

On the question of cutting FasTrack, the best method I've seen is to leave the factory ends intact (so that the mating plastic tabs can still snap together) and cut a section out of the middle using a mitre or table saw with a slow feed rate.  Epoxy the two cut ends back together, discarding the middle section.

A far cry from taking a piece of Ross or Gargraves to my chop saw and hacking it at the desired length.

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

A far cry from taking a piece of Ross or Gargraves to my chop saw and hacking it at the desired length.

True, just saying how the best way I've seen to cut FasTrack, not comparing to GG/Ross.

I'd be interested in knowing if you change your mind once you finish ballasting your expansive layout.

@SteveH posted:

I'd be interested in knowing if you change your mind once you finish ballasting your expansive layout.

Just the quiet running convinces me I made the right choice.  Remember, I had a ton of Fastrack previously, and the din when running was significant!  Without a doubt, Fastrack is the nosiest track I've personally ever used!

@gunrunnerjohn I do recall that you used to run FasTrack before your recent layout.  Just enjoing the banter.  Personally, I like the noise of the trains running on it.  I've been running on FasTrack for about 10 years and still like it for a number of other reasons as well.  That being said, I appreciate others do prefer quieter operation and the additional benefits of GG/Ross, especially the Custom Switches available from Ross.  To each their own.

It would have been way more challenging for me to build my layout with Fastrack, having the ability to bent the track to whatever route I desired really made a huge difference.  Also, stuff like the curved switches, numbered switches, double-slip switches, and 4-way yard switches are simply not available for Fastrack.

I am using Ross sectional track (similar to Gargraves), not because Gargraves isn't good but because I felt more comfortable with sectional track and not using flex track. I have helped someone work with gargraves flex and it isn't that hard to work with if you have a modicum of patience, there are plenty of videos on you tube on how to do it, people use a variety of methods.

The track is easily cut, even though people say it isn't optimal, I have been using a fine tooth hacksaw and was able to cut the track easily and cleanly.

If you like the flex track, then my recommendation would be that with Ross switches. Last I checked, Ross had one of the better prices on Gargraves flex track, too.

The dz1000 or 2500 switch machine is easy to put on or remove, it is a couple of screws and a link from the switch machine to the throw arm.  I am not wiring them for command control, but from what i understand fasttrack remote switch machines have command control capablity built into them, with dz1000 or 2500 from what I know you have to interface them to an auxiliary control module to control them via command control.

In terms of wiring, you can do what most of us seem to do and solder the power wires onto the rail. Some people use the Gargraves power pins (basically a wire soldered onto the track joiner), other people do things like put a spade lug into the bottom of the tubular rail (between the 2 halves) and the wire is connected to that.

You also could in theory connect fasttrack to Gargraves track, there are adapters out there, but not sure about the way that would look.

If you are thinking of switching over your current investment won't totally be lost, given that you haven't used it , you could probably sell it and get back a fairly good portion of it (I don't know how available fast track is these days, if there are shortages might mean you can get a better price but I don't know how the supply is).

@bigkid posted:

but from what i understand fasttrack remote switch machines have command control capablity built into them, with dz1000 or 2500 from what I know you have to interface them to an auxiliary control module to control them via command control.

Actually, the DZ-2500 is a command capable switch machine, at least they are on my railroad.

@Justaguy posted:

Goodday All,

Been lurking here for some time & have learned a ton of stuff from many, bought stuff from some & look forward to reading the forum almost daily.  Now I have a conundrum of sorts.  Hoping the wise men & women of this forum can provide me with some guidance.

I have invested in & quite familiar with Fastrack (still need much more) & do NOT have an operating layout. Retirement is near & I am now at the starting point.  I have found a couple layouts (courtesy of Ken-Oscale's postings) that I am leaning towards.  One design had numerous small Fastrack sections to 'make things fit' in several parts of the layout, well that got me to thinking about the additional dollars.

One particular section was 29-1/4" & it required 9 pieces of Fastrack to complete & the cost was about 40 USD just for that section (all straights!). I figured why not just cut 3/4 of an inch off a 30"section of Fastrack (way less joints in the track too)?  Looking at Fastrack I realize that was more of a PITA than 'just' cutting 3/4" off that piece.

FT makes small "fitter" pieces for connections that actually make things easier, rather than more complicated. Lionel publishes a guide that  shows what pieces are necessary to cover certain distances which can be a great help. I don't consider cutting FT to fit and removing and replacing the pins to be that much of a PITA. Bend the underneath tabs holding the rails and push the rails up and away from the track and remove the pins and replace where needed. Couldn't be easier. Cut the track with a nice chop saw, like from Harbor Freight.   

Then I looked at Gargraves track & with the Phantom flex (item 101) I could purchase 50-37" pieces for about 500 USD. The layout has 120 feet of track total (including switches).  I have NO problem with building things, using tools & very good at McGyver'ing stuff to work.

IMHO, most people choose Gargraves over FT not because of the cost or ease of installation, but because of the noise and look.

I realize that using Gargraves track can be more time consuming & will require ballast (additional $) at some point, but that can be done at anytime.  I do not consider this extra time 'work', it is playtime when it comes to model railroading so time spent is enjoyable time not labour (yeah I'm Canadian).

Not being familiar with Gargraves other then what I see & read online, my questions are;

1. Is it really that simple? I mean can I use Gargraves Phantom flex for straights? Bend as needed for curves? Cut as needed for 'fillers'?
2. What am I NOT considering? Electrical hookups? Special track pins? Nuances I am not aware of?

              Again, IMHO, FT is easier to install and hook-up electrically. The outside rails of FT are connected together underneath so you have two                  ground points, but Gargarves has nothing like so you will have to roll your own. You can make your power connections to FT with some                  female connectors and crimps whereas Gargaves typically requires soldering. 

1. Looking at Ross switches with DZ1000 or DZ2500 switch machines I believe that the cost is about the same as Fastrack remote/command switches, is this the case?  Apparently it is easier to replace a DZ switch machine on a Ross switch than replacing a Fastrack switch (Ross switch does not have to be removed?).

              That's assuming the issue is with the machine and not the actual switch. In addition, since you already have a Legacy system, hooking up                a Lionel command controlled switch is a piece of cake.

1. Regarding Fastrack, is there a tool to cut/punch the holes in the track bed & keep the pins anchored as they are before the cut?

              Cordless drill and appropriately sized bit.

I do have Lionel Legacy Command system which I will want to use so please take that into consideration.

          I'm not advocating that you should go with FT - all I'm pointing out is that if the sole issue is ease of installation and noise is not a factor, I              think FT wins.

Finally if you have read all of this I thank you for your time & hope for some insight from those of you with the knowledge I need.

Cheers, Ric

Truthfully, I had Fastrack for years, and now that I've done my current layout with Gargraves/Ross, I'll sure never go back!  I have all Ross switches, some Ross O72 sectional curves, and the rest is Gargraves flex.  It's no problem at all to use the flex for straight track, witness the following example, all the track is Gargraves flex on the yard.  I have grave doubts I could have fit ten tracks at 3.5" spacing on with Fastrack.

Here's my two cents worth relative to this discussion. My layout now is 35 years old. It measures 13x40 feet. I used Gargraves flex track for all track work and Ross Custom Switches.  Gargraves flex track is a pleasure to use. It is easy to bend and cuts easily with a zip saw or Dremel cutoff wheel. Remember, always wear safety glasses when using power tools. The secret to bending flex track is: 1. Only use new flex track. Don't buy old or used flex track except for using it for straight sections. New flex track has ties that move easily and are not all dried out. 2. When you bend flex track using your stomach or a tank water heater always reposition the ties to be equal distance apart after each bend. I used Midwest cork roadbed on top of 1/2" plywood. The track is screwed down by drilling holes in the ties and securing the track with 3/4 inch #4 wood screws. My switch machines are a combination of Z1000 and Tortoise machines which mount under the table. They are easy to install once you read and follow the instructions. If you want to read a wonderful book about building benchwork go to Amazon and put in Linn Westcott's Model Railroading Benchwork. The best part of my layout are the 2% grades that allow for hidden mainline and storage tracks where trains appear and disappear frequently. Take your time and enjoy. The bench and tack work as the most fun part along with the scenery. To discuss further feel free to call me at 847-400-7941.

Like GRJ I use Gargraves flex with Ross switches.  I'm very happy with the track and how it looks.

There is nothing economic about fastrack. It is "Easy" to use sectional track and that costs money. The use of anything else would be cheaper. 

You could do it in all gargraves or you can buy ross sectional curves and use gargraves for the straights (and flex the non-standard curves) for a lot less. If economics is what matters, factor in the cost of cork roadbed and ballast as well. Regardless, using Ross/gargraves is going to look better, and spare you the hassle of using 500 little fitter pieces (and worrying about all the conductivity of connections). Gargraves or Ross is real easy to cut to length.

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

Truthfully, I had Fastrack for years, and now that I've done my current layout with Gargraves/Ross, I'll sure never go back!  I have all Ross switches, some Ross O72 sectional curves, and the rest is Gargraves flex.  It's no problem at all to use the flex for straight track, witness the following example, all the track is Gargraves flex on the yard.  I have grave doubts I could have fit ten tracks at 3.5" spacing on with Fastrack.

Yea and 2 years to build and install with still no scenery.

@SteveH posted:

On the question of cutting FasTrack, the best method I've seen is to leave the factory ends intact (so that the mating plastic tabs can still snap together) and cut a section out of the middle using a mitre or table saw with a slow feed rate.  Epoxy the two cut ends back together, discarding the middle section.

Before applying epoxy, 3 FasTrack outside rail pins with the bottom tabs removed can be inserted into the rails to maintain alignment through the cut.  I'd suggest not using any of the middle rail track pins, but use an outside rail pin in the middle.  Some have also used regular O gauge tubular track pins, crimping them in place.

FasTrack joining pins can be purchased directly from Lionel Customer Service or salvaged from other track pieces.  For even better electrical continuity across the seam, jumpers can be soldered to the folded rail tabs underneath the roadbed.

This method can be used with straights and curves.

On the question of FasTrack switch replacement, most of the parts have been available from Lionel Customer Service as well.

Brilliant and relatively simple!

What are you missing?

1. Fastrack is NOISY - the plastic tie/roadbed vibrates.

2. Fastrack tends to develop high resistance connections, especially in the center rail and inside of switches. The switches have to be disassembled (remove the bottom) and the center rail connection points soldered. All Fastrack sections should be soldered with hookup wire to each other after they are mounted on the table top.

3. Fastrack is NOISY - much more so than Gargraves.

My 2 cents.

After getting my first "modern" Lionel steam engine, I bought a small bunch of FasTrack, since this nice loco needed something nicer (and broader curves) than the handful of original 0-27 I still had. Quick and easy.

But I didn't care for the noise level either, so I picked up some sectional Gargraves for curves (0-54 and 0-80) with some flex for the straights. I then was able to sell the FasTrack for at least what I had paid for it.

Never regretted the change. In fact, I have since gone with GG for my S scale stuff too.

Everytime I post something about this brand of track, I always mention that it's made here, not China: for whatever that's worth.

There it is.

Mark in Oregon

PS: ...and I suspect it's less expensive, to boot.  🙂

You have some great advice above.  As others have said, Fastrack is very noisy.  I only use it for around the Christmas tree, but that's it.  Panhandle 2 (as was its predecessor) is built with GarGraves track and Ross and Curtis switches.  I use both sectional curves and have bent flex-track around some very large curves using a water heater.

Neither Fastrack or GarGraves is low cost track system any more, but GarGraves offers you more flexibility and an easier way to achieve a custom appearance.  I would not use GarGraves switches.  Ross switches with either the DZ-1000 or the DZ-2500 switch machines are a great choice.

Electrical hook-up can be done by forcing spade connectors with attached feeder wires up into the web of the GarGraves rail.  Or you can use their pig-tails (a pin with a soldered feeder); I'm using those this time around.  Or you can solder wires directly to the rail.  Because the 2 outer rails are electrically isolated from each other, 1 can be used for Legacy / TMCC and the other can be used as an insulated rail to trigger your signals or accessories.

The other (and perhaps the most important) thing affecting noise is roadbed.  I would recommend the use of a roadbed under your track.  Cork is OK, but I think Vinylbed and its successor Flexxbed are much, much better.

Best,

George

I use Gargraves and Ross however, there are many large layouts using all fastrack with what looks like great results. My Gargraves is mounted on cork roadbed and still is pretty noisy. It really boils down to what catches your fancy. Too me, Ogauge 3 rail is loud no matter what you use.

Justaguy, from your description of yourself and your skills I believe you would really enjoy working with GG flex track. It is easy to bend, easy to cut, looks great, is quiet when installed on foam roadbed and homasote or like product. GG flex is also much cheaper than Fastrack. As others mentioned, if you use the Phantom tin-plate you can solder leads directly to the underside of the rails.

I used almost all GG 37" flex pieces just as you describe. Some are left straight, some are bent around corners. I made up a couple of plywood templates for the 080 and 090 curves, they match the inside and outside dimensions at the end of the ties.  Clamp one end at the start of a curve, grab the extreme end of the flex piece and pull it around the template. I use a few more clamps to hold the track in the curve as I screw it down. As you mentioned, you will have way fewer joints this way.

There are many ways to cut the flex track. I like a Dremel with a 1 1/2 or 2" cutoff wheel on a flex shaft. I use a small block of wood as a fence across the track where I want to cut and just let the dremel hub rub the wood block. I get straight, clean cuts with almost no need to de--burr.

@romiller49 posted:

I use Gargraves and Ross however, there are many large layouts using all fastrack with what looks like great results. My Gargraves is mounted on cork roadbed and still is pretty noisy. It really boils down to what catches your fancy. Too me, Ogauge 3 rail is loud no matter what you use.

I'm curious how you made the Gargraves noisy, especially when compared to Fastrack.   I will admit, a big part of the noise suppression for my layout is the Homasote over the Baltic Birch.  I also used a foam roadbed as I liked it better than cork.  It was cheaper, easier to work with, and better at knocking down the noise.

An important point when you're fastening the track down, if you run the screws into plywood, it will be nosier.  My track screws go through the foam roadbed and into the Homasote, but not into the wood below the Homasote.

As for cost, I think you'll find that for just plain track, Gargraves is indeed considerably cheaper than Fastrack.  I bought my Gargraves flex for $400 a case, that's over 150 feet of track, 51 37" sections.  One 30" piece of Fastrack is $15 or more.  So, that's about 50 cents an inch, Gargraves cost me less than half that amount.

From the Gargraves web site.  37" (long 3 ft.) $12.75/piece  $4.25 per foot.  Add cork road bed. $.52/ft.  $4.77 

Probably quantity discount.

Paula and I started laying track 3 years ago with 3/4” plywood and 1/2” homasote on level one. We had both enjoyed trains when we were young long, long ago. To say that we knew little exaggerates how much we knew.

After a lot of study and watching plenty of videos, we decided on Ross track and turnouts along with Tortoise switch motors. We also bought a case of Gargraves to use in difficult places but the more we learned, the less Gargraves we used and most of the case was used for wall shelves. We prefer the look and way that Ross is made. This is not a knock at Gargraves or anything else.

Our goal was to have fun, to learn, and to try and do it well. And we have and are still doing so after many cases of track and 40+ turnouts with lots more to go. We would not change a thing except not use touch toggles to control some turnouts. They do not work well with Lionel legacy control.

Some thoughts:

Ross offers the best collection of turnouts and they look great. We have had zero problems.

Ross track matches the turnouts. We do not like the sliding ties with Gargraves.

Tortoise motors are quiet, easy to install, and we have had zero problems.

Ross offers turnout indicator lights that work well and look great. Yes, there is a learning curve to installation but after the second one, it is pretty easy.

Steve Breninson with Ross gives excellent service and has been quite helpful multiple times. He answers the phone. The wait for his Made In USA  product has always been reasonable.

If you have any questions, our e-mail address is in our personal information.

Couldn't agree more about Steve and Ross products, he's always been very accommodating.  Like you say, he actually answers the phone, what great customer support.  I used a bunch of Ross O72 dimensional track, but a majority of my track is Gargraves flex, I just found it easier to "bend" to my will.

@Bill Webb posted:

Tortoise motors are quiet, easy to install, and we have had zero problems.

Indubitably, the best choice I've personally made in the hobby.  Tortoise Switch Machines rock solid and simply the best.

@Dennis-LaRock posted:

Indubitably, the best choice I've personally made in the hobby.  Tortoise Switch Machines rock solid and simply the best.

In retrospect, I kinda' wish I had gone for the extra effort and installed the Tortoise switch machines instead of the DZ-2500's.  I was just lazy and thought they'd save me work, but I've already had to change out a few of them, hopefully once I get a trouble-free batch on the layout, I'll be done screwing around with them.

John, After about the third or fourth install you get the rhythm and they practically install themselves.  I ditched the 1/4" throw-bar hole and went 1/2"... you can't see the larger hole and the extra wiggle room for adjustment is very handy.

When I started building my model railroad in the late `80's the only track and switches I was aware of besides Lionel was Gargraves.  I used Gargraves track fastened with #2CS brass wood screws to Homasote roadbed (Homabed brand). At that time Homasote on a cost per foot basis was far less expensive than cork and other roadbed products on the market. Also I started with Gargraves switches, but moved to Curtis and then Ross switches when I learned of them and have needed to replace the existing Gargraves ones. For switch machines I used basic twin coil machines and some ground throws, but am in the process of replacing those  with DZ-1000 machines. To install 30+Tortoise machines at this point would require too much under table re-wiring.

If I were to start from scratch tomorrow (and at age 78 I'm not about to) I would use Gargraves track (on Homosote) again, with but nothing but Ross switches and Tortoise switch machines. Ross unquestionably makes the best O Gauge switches available and Steve offers unbeatable service.

I have been watching this thread and the posts made. While I agree that Ross makes phenomenal switches and Gargraves track is a favorite, some people just want to run trains. Let me elaborate.

Many will and have extolled the virtual of smooth track with Gargraves and Ross. I agree with them. Though some, like myself, don’t want to get mired in cutting track to fit or bending curves. Fastrack allows me to set up a layout in minimal time and have my trains running. And for people who have a first layout or just don’t want to commit the time to cutting and bending curves or sections of straight. And for those who want a layout that is semi-permanent, Fastrack is much more forgiving (IMHO). I can pull apart my Fastrack and reuse it in future multiple configurations. Cut Gargraves can’t always be reused for non-permanent layouts.

Im sure some may disagree with me, but for first layouts and even permanent ones, many use Fastrack to save time and work. While Gargraves and Ross are great, and I plan to use them when I make a permanent layout, Fastrack, despite a higher cost per foot, will suit many well now and possibly forever.

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

I'm curious how you made the Gargraves noisy, especially when compared to Fastrack.  

I’m sure it’s due to running the screws down through the cork and into the plywood.

No argument that you can build a decent layout with Fastrack, the question is, are you going to be satisfied with the limitations of Fastrack if you're building a significantly sized layout?  My answer came up no.

Truthfully, I didn't even consider the cost of the track and switches between Fastrack and Ross/Gargraves, that was not a factor in the decision.  Although the cost difference in building my layout between the two is likely not that great a percentage, my focus was on the ability to build what I wanted in both appearance and performance.  The much greater flexibility in construction offered by the vastly wider variety of Ross switch styles and types.  Fastrack offers nothing like the double-slip switch, curved switches, numbered switches, etc.  I feel I ended up with a superior result using Ross/Gargraves, it's really as simple as that.  YMMV, and maybe Fastrack worked out great for you.

I don't feel I got "mired" in cutting track to fit or bending curves, that allowed me do to things that just didn't work in Fastrack.

@romiller49 posted:

I’m sure it’s due to running the screws down through the cork and into the plywood.

A major factor in my noise reduction was the 1/2" Homasote on top of the Baltic Birch, not to mention the foam roadbed.  Both added up to really knocking down the noise level.

I love this thread! This may be the most helpful instructional one yet for me. As some of you may know, I have crazy amounts of new and gently used O, Standard and even some S Fastrack and various tubular rail in prewar, post war and modern gauges. I have also acquired all the odd length fastrack pieces that eliminate the need to cut / adjust straight lengths. It’s all great for my ever changing temporary layouts and my collection of rail boxes. (See my profile if you care to) I really like looking at the Lionel Corporation track boxes. They are simply pretty. I also have a fair amount of what I believe to be Cargraves straight track (both used and new) that was given to me by my employers’ father. He is like us. 😉 I’m not sure if this is stainless or tinplated. Either way, I intend to use this someday. And I hope to soon. Thank you for all of your insight and guidance that you guys are sharing.

Well, that all looks like Gargraves for sure, nice bunch of track.  If it has stiffeners under the ties, it's not flex track.  If there are no little stiffeners running the length of the track, it is probably flex track.

Here's non-flex straight track, note the runners near the end of the ties.

Here's flex track, note no runners to keep it straight.

FWIW, I used a lot of flex track as straight sections, worked fine.

@Carl Peduzzi posted:

...Fastrack allows me to set up a layout in minimal time and have my trains running.

...And for those who want a layout that is semi-permanent, Fastrack is much more forgiving (IMHO). I can pull apart my Fastrack and reuse it in future multiple configurations.

Absolutely. Since I still have some HO and N scale, I got starter sets of Kato Unitrack, in both scales. It works great for a quick test oval, etc.

Of course, the fact that it is N and HO means the much smaller size translates into track that is indeed noisier than non-roadbed types, but is " manageable". I just couldn't "hang" with the sound of the FasTrack.

Mark in Oregon

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

No argument that you can build a decent layout with Fastrack, the question is, are you going to be satisfied with the limitations of Fastrack if you're building a significantly sized layout?  My answer came up no.

Truthfully, I didn't even consider the cost of the track and switches between Fastrack and Ross/Gargraves, that was not a factor in the decision.  Although the cost difference in building my layout between the two is likely not that great a percentage, my focus was on the ability to build what I wanted in both appearance and performance.  The much greater flexibility in construction offered by the vastly wider variety of Ross switch styles and types.  Fastrack offers nothing like the double-slip switch, curved switches, numbered switches, etc.  I feel I ended up with a superior result using Ross/Gargraves, it's really as simple as that.  YMMV, and maybe Fastrack worked out great for you.

I don't feel I got "mired" in cutting track to fit or bending curves, that allowed me do to things that just didn't work in Fastrack.

I didn’t mean you got mired in working with the track you chose. I have seen your layout in pictures and it is great.  I was just trying to say that if someone is starting a layout, Gargraves might not be the best choice.
Getting a layout up and running might be more of a focus. Like I said, when I get to making a permanent layout, Ross or Atlas track will be my choice. For a first layout, Fastrack could be a better choice.
We all want a great layout. In moving toward that there are so many choices. Many of the people on this forum have a wealth of experience. In my experience, I think Fastrack might be be a good choice for @Justaguy. We need more info.

@Strummer posted:

Absolutely. Since I still have some HO and N scale, I got starter sets of Kato Unitrack, in both scales. It works great for a quick test oval, etc.

Of course, the fact that it is N and HO means the much smaller size translates into track that is indeed noisier than non-roadbed types, but is " manageable". I just couldn't "hang" with the sound of the FasTrack.

Mark in Oregon

Fastrack can be loud. Some like that, some don’t. I totally understand.

@Carl Peduzzi posted:

Fastrack can be loud. Some like that, some don’t. I totally understand.

I suspect it's partly due to the big metal wheels on 3 rail rolling stock. Some of my HO and most of my N scale wheels are plastic; so a combination of size and material has to be taken into account when discussing noise levels, I guess... 🙂

Good thread.

Mark in Oregon