Help with engine/passenger coach sizes

IMO, visually, you'll be happier with 15" and 16" passenger cars on the O36 curves.

That's what i was thinking too. Will they look ok being pulled by a  17.75" loco? And only Lionel makes 15" passenger cars, correct? The only sizes I've seen from MTH are 16" and 18".

Roughly O scale coaches come in 60 or 72 foot models these range from 15 to 16 inches for the 60 foot cars and 17-18 inches for the 72 footers, O-27 coaches run around 12 inches in length.

The first thing is to choose your locomotives these come in O scale, Semi-scale, and O27. You want to proportion the coaches to the locomotives. O-27 coaches look out of proportion to O scale locomotives (too short) while O scale coaches look out of proportion to O-27 locomotives these coaches being too long for the locomotive.

O-36 track is a small step up from O-27 so being somewhat conservative in size is the safest bet. That would mean either a semi-scale locomotive with 60 foot coaches or a smaller O scale locomotive like a set of F3 or F7 models with 60 foot coaches. Or if desired an O-27 set with O-27 or semi-scale locomotives with 12 inch O-27 size coaches. These make the run over the track look more distant if the overall layout doesn't allow long lengths of track.

My layout is around the room 14 by 12 so it isn't really big nor is it small. The mainline curves are O-72 so that can accommodate O scale pretty easily. I have locomotives that range from O-scale to O27 and passenger cars that are 60 foot scale and O27 sized. The 72 footers look too big on the layout, the 60 footers are a little more proportional to the layout, these only run with the post war Lionel F3's, GP9s, Trainmasters, and the Williams O scale Alcos. I have a set of 72 foot Madison's that run with the old Lionel 773 Hudson I keep this train to 6 cars as it takes up a lot of rail. I have several O-27 size streamliner car sets; one runs with the repainted to Brunswick green Lionel 681 in Pennsylvania fleet of modernism scheme that I painted onto Lionel's O-27 streamline cars, an original 1950 yellow Union Pacific anniversary set with the add on pair of cars, a 1990's Northern Pacific 6 car set set pulled by an A-A pair of K-Line Alcos, and a couple sets of generic silver Lionel 12 inchers for hooking on other, mostly steam, locomotives of O-27 size as I feel like making up those type trains.  The look of O-27 mixed with O scale looks jarring to my eye so operating sessions are either only O-27 or O scale. The only place where O-27 and O scale cars get mixed is with O scale freight operations as I model the transition period so a freight car size mix is common to that time thus looks as what I'd expect to see but these get O scale cabooses. When running O-27 locomotives for freight operations only O-27 cars and cabooses are used.  

Bogie

On my 032 and 042 gargraves track I only run Railking and 027 Lionel,  it looks and feels right, although the articulated Railking engines swing out with a lot of overhang on the tight curves. 

I model scale size trains so most of my streamlined cars are 21" and heavyweights are 20" for the most part.  However, I do have trains to run at events for smaller sized layouts.  My simple rule of thumb is that the locomotive should simply be in proportion to the cars.  It just seems to visually work.  I have a Railking CNJ Pacific that pulls Williams 16" heavyweights.  It looks great on 042 and will run on 027 if I need it to. 

If you are looking at Amtrak, the MTH Railking F40PH is proportionately correct, but just a bit smaller than the Premier version and is nice for pulling shorter length cars.  As for selection of cars in Amtrak, there are plenty to choose from in the 15"-16" range.     

Not all passenger cars were 80'. Some were 72', as well as 60' etc. I personally like the looks of 60-65' pulled by scale steamers. To each their own. That's why we have such great choices in our hobby. DaveG.

Awesome thanks guys, that clears some things up. For reference I plan on running only Lionchief plus and Railking 17" engines so I will definitely stick to 60' cars.

I did want to buy a Williams engine due to their cheap prices but I'm not sure if they are scale or semi scale. Although I would guess an 18" long engine would be considered scale?

look at lionel's  baby Madison cars.....they look right at home behind semi-scale locomotives such as railking, or for an example, an old lionel 2046 small Hudson. those cars look good on 036 curves.......

Williams engines vary in scale fidelity.  The SD90 / Dash 9 are actually compressed horizontally as are the older FP45s.  The Genesis locomotives are a hair tall, but also compressed horizontally.  The scale GG1 is only 1/2" short from an actual O scaled GG1, but so are the Weaver and MTH versions.  The Alco PAs are a little short as well but not overly so.  The F units, GP units and the Train Master are more or less scale as is their 44 toner.  The E33 electrics compare favorably to the slightly more detailed MTH ones.  Their Metroliner set is fun for small layouts.  They are 15" cars, but now that I have an Elliot Welz set, I like that one better.

I have a lot of Williams from years past and I can say that they are the best running locomotives for the money.  Nothing fancy, just solid runners.  When I run on the club layout, I try to bring a few just as backup when the command control is being fussy.

dgauss posted:

Not all passenger cars were 80'. Some were 72', as well as 60' etc. I personally like the looks of 60-65' pulled by scale steamers. To each their own. That's why we have such great choices in our hobby. DaveG.

Even in the same trains this is true.  Santa Fe's stainless car fleet had 63' RPOs, 72' baggage cars and 85' sleepers and coaches.  The CNJ Blue Comet ran with 72' baggage / coaches, coaches, and observation cars while the diner was 80'.  Harriman cars such as the C-4 and C-5 series were 64', others were 72', and there was even a Harriman 30' RPO and a 30' baggage.  Funny looking cars, but a very cool ones. 

What can I say?  I run predominantly passenger trains.    I have more passenger cars than freight cars.  However as you mention, we each have our preferences for our own reasons and there isn't a wrong way to enjoy this hobby.  This is what makes it great!

harmonyards posted:

look at lionel's  baby Madison cars.....they look right at home behind semi-scale locomotives such as railking, or for an example, an old lionel 2046 small Hudson. those cars look good on 036 curves.......

I really like the baby Madison's and have looked at them before. They look awesome and the price is great too. It's just hard to find many passenger coach choices in the Alaska road name which is what i'm aiming for unless you're willing to pay almost $100 a car. There are a few more Amtrak choices but not too many either, maybe I just chose unpopular road names.

I run curves no tighter than 042, therefore run smaller sized engines and cars, Williams GG1's, RailKing PA's & FA's, RS2 and RS3, And RailKing K4s & H10. For passenger cars i run KLine 13" streamliners and Williams Madison cars. When i couldn't get the roadnames i wanted (NH & LV) i learned to paint.

I found this nice Amtrak set coming out soon:  https://www.trainworld.com/man...1-amfleet-coach-set/

Although it lists the set at a total of 33" making each car around 8", weird. It's probably a typo but it is a nice set and 0-31 so I think they should be around 15-16".

baby madisons can usually be found on the cheap......contact Jim at High Ball Graphics, have him make you some decals, and make your own set of Alaska cars....to me, that sounds like a way cool project that could be done on the cheap. Jim does great work making water slide decals, and he wont knock your socks off......then you could have the satisfaction of creating your own roster.....just my two cents.....now I'm broke...if you make a set, post them up so we can see them!

I totally forgot that Trainworld sells a bunch of regular madison coaches in many road names. Do you guys think Alaska Madison coaches would look good behind a gp9 Alaska diesel? Or should I save getting the madison coaches to go behind a steamer? 

Alaska is my favorite road name for the color scheme and because I love the state, but unfortunately they don't make an Alaska steamer that isn't all black. They do have streamlined 60' Alaska coaches at Trainworld but I don't care much for the mostly silver look.

If you can get Williams Madison coaches in Alaska RR markings - they would look great behind a GP9 - That kind of coach was used well into the early diesel era - especially on secondary roads and routes.

modeltrainsparts posted:

If you can get Williams Madison coaches in Alaska RR markings - they would look great behind a GP9 - That kind of coach was used well into the early diesel era - especially on secondary roads and routes.

Ok great, they are actually MTH Madison coaches. Not a bad price either but I may still wait for labor day to get a coupon code to make the deal even better.

 https://www.trainworld.com/man...assenger-set-alaska/

Personally (and this is just how it appears to me) i prefer Williams coaches over MTH -- When MTH does selective compression, their coaches always seem stubby as they don't seem to reduce the height and especially the width enough compared to the reduction in length. - Just my opinion though.

be careful buying older Williams passenger cars with the sheet metal trucks and plastic side frames......those trucks SUUUCK.....They don't roll worth a hoot,the Williams by Bachmann have very nice rolling trucks.

Well I was going to pull the trigger on a Williams SD90 because that's all that's available in Amtrak and then I saw this video at Trainworld: https://www.trainworld.com/man...Plus-Sound-Reading-/Surprisingly there aren't many other Williams o gauge videos on YouTube that give me an idea on how they look on FasTrack.

It looks pretty bad IMO how the wheels hang like that and I have a feeling it wouldn't look any better on 0-36. Would the SD-45's look a bit better since they are roughly an inch shorter?