HELP! What is this Williams Cab Forward device???

I would guess its a DC regulator board. May have been used for the lights or smoke unit if it has one.

Pete

OK.....but was there a DCU board?? I don't see how this thing could ever run the way it came. Anyone else????

Dave, I never had this engine but have seen both early and late Williams reverse units. They are both considerably larger than that board. You would need one or at least a bridge rectifier to make it run. What is in the engine now, just a motor?

Pete

If that was in the tender it is a constant voltage board for the marker lights. If nothing more the reverse board has been removed. Maybe because the defective motor fried it?

The motor is wired to what looks like a factory harness......but only the small 3/4" square board is all that's in the loco or tender. I'm getting a DCU board and will rewire the whole thing....maybe a new motor too.....Thanks

Williams included their own reverse boards in the tenders ( I never heard who made them) up through 1989. They could be dicey. While the 1989 Daylight GS-4’s purchased from Williams came with those, the upgrade version I bought through Scaled Tin Rail had a QSI DCRU board. In 1990, when the Cab-Forward was released (along with the N&W J, NYC Niagara, and others), the line from Williams now came with QSI-DCRU boards factory installed, as I recall. It would be neat if you could find one of those still working, as the Williams Cab-Forward could be a sweet runner.   

Dave,

I'm with Richard on this one. There should have been a QSI-DCRU in the tender. If it was rewired to run at all, there whould be a fairly hefty bridge rectifier in there attached to the motor leads. Some of those early motors had quite a bit of draw, as you found out. You are wise to replace it with a more efficient unit. Just be sure it is sized to handle the load you intend to pull. No need to overheat it! The Dallee reverse unit should be a good fit as well.

Chris

LVHR

I've used one of those big Radio Shack Bridge rectifier but there is not one on board....not sure what was going on. A buddy of mine wonder if this was old stock and the DCU board was robbed at some point to fix another unit....then never replaced???

Thanks all!

Dave, I am getting a chuckle out of this one.  Even the simple engine can have an electrical or electronic issue.

I am with Chuck that this is a CV board and the resistor is a current limiter probably for LEDs.

A similar device is also used for Smoke.  Does this have the Sleuth unit and electronics for engine lights?   G

Thanks GGG.......

All the electronics in the loco are in that photo. That tiny board is all I found. So a DCU board and new 550 motor is on the way.

What is a CV board???  It does appear to be connected to lights in the tender but that's all.

The smoke units look like Sleuth but I have not removed them but they have that rod in the center of the stack. It looks like the are connected to the same circuit as the motor was. Do you think this loco was robbed of parts at some time and never 'restored' and maybe forgotten about??

Thanks to all......

Dave, CV=Constant voltage AKA DC regulator mentioned in the second post.

Suethe units come in different voltage ratings, 5V ,12V, etc. On modern Williams they are connected to boards similar to yours but a bit more compact. Sometimes both the lights and smoke unit are driven from the same board.

It makes sense a seized motor might have taken out the E unit.

Pete

Dave,  I have one I bouught at York in 2002 for $245 and she runs as sweet as any engine in my stable,  The smoke is seuthe.  I've never opemed her up, but I will tonight and post tomorrow.  I have several of these and they all run great.  I have put DCS in my 4449, Big Boy & Challenger.  The smoke unit MTH-in the Big Boy was a nightmare, the 4449 was easy-the Challenger-I passed-she is and forever will be Seuth as she boils away for 30 minutes at a time.  My 1218 likes to blow the horn on it's own-a problem I haven't solved.  We have retired A unit firemen from N&W in my area and they tell the sound from the horm is so realistic is scary.  The Lionel devotees say they like the looks of my $300 Niagra better than their high dollar versions even tho all it does is run, smoke & blow.  I find lots of hidden value in the old Williams engines and MTH kits make it so easy to upgrade.  I pledge to do 1 per year, although I've missed a few.  Now that I've promised to look into Cab-Forward she may be next.  The position of the weights determines the degree of difficulty putting in the MTH smoke units.  I'll check that out tonight also and report in the morning.

I wonder if the locomotive had been 'converted' to run on DC instead of AC? If that were the case, then no electronics would be needed for the motor or smoke units.

I've said if many more boards failed I was going to convert all my trains to DC!!! I did not try DC after I opened the tender and was shocked to find no DCU....maybe I should have!

In reply to the photo that AMCDave first posted, the unit looks like an electronic horn or whistle device. It would appear that the circuit board was taken out if it has a can motor in it, and if you ran the can motor without a bridge rectifier in the circuit the motor is totally fried! You must replace the motor if you ran it under AC track power at all.

I have worked on a few older Williams and never saw a small unit like the one in the photo for the motor control.

Lee Fritz

True for the motor but you would still need the regulator for the smoke unit unless it was replaced with an higher voltage unit.

Pete

It won't hurt to run an AC motor on DC, but don't run a DC motor on AC.

For what it's worth, when you buy anything new or used make sure what it has inside it, especially new older stock.

Lee Fritz

The Seuthe units can normally handle up to 18V without any problems, and tend to work pretty well without any regulators. They just don't do a lot until they get enough voltage. 

Dave, sorry to hear that you had problems with the Williams engine.

Every Williams engine, whether new or used, that I have bought has worked great.

Lee Fritz

Agreed.....not a Williams issue.....someone did surgery on this one I am sure!!

Just for info, I have four brass Williams Crown series engines form the same time period.  All have QSI reversing units in tender.

Ron