How on earth do you take this motor off the truck !

I've never worked on this. The only help I could offer is either the mount is stuck from years of being in there, or there's some type of wedge system on the top of the truck?

I had a MTH motor that had the screw removed and still was stuck. I accidently jarred it loose while trying to figure it out. I got lucky!

Sorry, if I'm off on this as I'm only guessing from here. Maybe Norton or others can help?

See if the screw with the red arrow is accessible from above.  Also, look closely at the end where the green arrow is for screws.

Thanks Guys .................well I'm in John..........following the "red line" route.

Both the positive and negative connections (one to roller and one to frame) must be removed.

I only had the positive (roller one) removed.  They are accessed from the top......and hidden under a bunch of wires.

Now to remember to put the bushings flat side down (one can see the flat side in the pics).

Don't plan on retiring John..........too many of us in training !

Don't you just love how the truck also comes all apart to take it off?

When you're putting it back together, the flat sides REALLY have to be in the proper place, and that's sometimes a PITA to get them all in and the thing back together while holding it in place on the chassis.  One of the worst truck designs I've seen, what a major PITA!   Atlas uses a similar design in that time period, must have licensed it from Lionel.

I have to say that MTH has it in this department, one screw.  The Lionel Liondrive twist-off trucks are fine as well.

You are correct there John........everything came "tumbling" out.

I plan to get this back together tonight while my memory is still good !

Here's another one for you.........and I have no idea of the purpose.

At ...............  12 - 3 - 6 - 9 on each wheel there is a rubber "nib" that goes from the bottom of the wheel (the traction tire would cover it) - thru the wheel and flush with the other side.......

It will actually move back and forth thru the wheel.

Thanks again.........

The truck you have is very similar (except middle wheels) as the one on page 9 of this supplement.  This helped me get one back together.  Don't forget the bushing #13 that centers the motor worm gear.

https://www.lionelsupport.com/...7/Main47complete.pdf

While you are at it, don't forget to check that the two screws #22 on that drawing are tight; the ones that hold the can motor to the truck. I had to take one apart a few months back because these two screws had loosened and the motor had come loose from the truck.

Worst truck design ever.

Rod

We can always look back at some designs and wonder what they were thinking.

I've worked on plenty of cars that were not built for simple maintenance or part changes. Some cars in the eighties were like that. Some were simple.

I always think to myself, how did the design hold up over the years. That's what matters to me.

I left HO scale because I couldn't stand to work inside of them.

Engineer-Joe posted:

I've worked on plenty of cars that were not built for simple maintenance or part changes. Some cars in the eighties were like that. Some were simple.

 

Like the first V-6 powered Chrysler mini vans were you could not service the rear bank of plugs or injectors????? 

Thanks Gents for all the tips.......getting this back together is really wearing on me... 

Had to take a break and check in here.

And I can tell you all one thing that is most certain...................

I won't be doing this again.................. talk about baptism by fire !!

Any ideas on the question of the rubber "nibs" thru the wheels ??

Thanks

Dave

Just out of curiosity, what was the status of the grease in the gearbox? I have a similar locomotive and I was wondering if it was worth the time and effort to re-grease the gears.

Well ..................back together and working..........an absolute PITA.

Karl.......after all that, the grease was still good and enough of it.

It made it easier to change the traction tires.........but on the second truck (which I will not take apart) I believe I can slip new ones on without taking anything off...............tomorrow !

My opinion........if your engine is running well I would just but a little grease on the gears and let it be.

But if you decide to "go in" check out the pictorial that STEIMS posted..........will give you an idea.

I will probably leave mine alone since it doesn't have a lot of run time. This thread does provide plenty of information in regards to how the truck is assembled. Thanks. 

Thanks!  I have started to approach this twice and stopped saying nothing could be this difficult, so glad you proved me wrong. I have a new motor with a healthy magnet but opted to glue the old one back together in place. It works OK but now that I KNOW it can be done I'll be waiting for the most boring and patient day  ( or 2 ) to give this a third try.

Ernie

I have no idea what the rubber nubs poked through the wheels are for.

Rod Stewart posted:

While you are at it, don't forget to check that the two screws #22 on that drawing are tight; the ones that hold the can motor to the truck. I had to take one apart a few months back because these two screws had loosened and the motor had come loose from the truck.

Worst truck design ever.

Rod

Engineer-Joe posted:

We can always look back at some designs and wonder what they were thinking.

I've worked on plenty of cars that were not built for simple maintenance or part changes. Some cars in the eighties were like that. Some were simple.

I always think to myself, how did the design hold up over the years. That's what matters to me.

I left HO scale because I couldn't stand to work inside of them.

AMCDave posted:

Engineer-Joe posted:

I've worked on plenty of cars that were not built for simple maintenance or part changes. Some cars in the eighties were like that. Some were simple.

 

Like the first V-6 powered Chrysler mini vans were you could not service the rear bank of plugs or injectors????? 

Soo Line posted:

Well ..................back together and working..........an absolute PITA.

Karl.......after all that, the grease was still good and enough of it.

It made it easier to change the traction tires.........but on the second truck (which I will not take apart) I believe I can slip new ones on without taking anything off...............tomorrow !

My opinion........if your engine is running well I would just but a little grease on the gears and let it be.

But if you decide to "go in" check out the pictorial that STEIMS posted..........will give you an idea.

So was this truck designed by a graduate from the same school as the Fukushima Daiichi plant engineers? Many of these things are so poorly engineered it is clear no one with any repair ability had any input. How did anyone ever approve designs where the locomotive has to be disassembled to remove the side frames to change a tire?

Compared to the Lionel Odyssey F3s consider this one easy. Some of the screws in the F3s are Loctited in and being Phillips (JIS??) its real easy to strip the heads.

Pete

Remember guys, the two screws for the motor mount are pretty universal, and I've had a few instances where those were loose.  Whenever I have occasion to have the motor off a truck, I always check those.

gunrunnerjohn posted:

Remember guys, the two screws for the motor mount are pretty universal, and I've had a few instances where those were loose.  Whenever I have occasion to have the motor off a truck, I always check those.

Ditto that John!

We have a saying in our house: "Life is too short to drink bad wine!" These trucks are right up there with that philosophy. 

Rod