Interior for Williams Scale GG1

Chuck, thanks for the explaination.

I don't feel like taking the shell off now but when I get the parts I'll photograph the install of the TMCC parts. I think everything including the sound board is between the motors.

Lionel OEM TMCC and RS5 boards were used along with a ERR Cruise M board so I don't know if that made a difference in the install or not.

Interior of fireman's cab

It sure is spartan in there, he's lucky he got a window!

Just took a look into the front window of my engine. I'll need to take the shell of to confirm but I think one board is in front that would restrict the installation of the interior. No way to do it in the rear due to too many wires.

The EP-5 is the one with the "ball" of wires that connect the motors to the command board.  There isn't room in the GG1.

This is a picture of an unmodified cab interior from Lionel

Cab inserts sitting inside Williams shell

Close up of insert sitting inside shell

You can see the "posts" inside the shell to keep it from slipping down to far over the metal frame.  It might be possible to get the height to match by using spacers but I prefer to attach the cab to the inside of the shell.  It would be easier than trying to align holes for chassis mounting.

This is the rear cab

modified to fit

I flush cut off the mounting posts and "nibbled" a notch in the floor.  The Shell fit over the cab without problems.  I will have to do other more serious mods to front cab and/or adjust the mount for the sound board and/or slide it forward.  I'm going to scratch build the main control panel.  I'd like to be able to see across the cab when done.  I still may cut that floor section in the middle completely out and just mount the cab "halves" on the left and right sides of shell.  It might actually be easier.

I see the seats on yours, and the one I found on the Lionel site doesn't have the seats.  Did those come with the cab or were they extra parts?

Since my GG-1 that gets the cab hasn't been converted to PS/2 yet, I have a lot of flexibility in mounting the cab.

There were "seats" on the forward cab and not the rear one.  No idea why.  I didn't see them offered as parts.  They aren't much to speak of.  I didn't order the "people" and it looks like I'll need to find some really small ones to fit

There is an X-Ray view of the prototype here:

inside view

Lionel took some liberties with the interior arrangement.  I am guessing that something was stashed between the engineer and firman sides and the control panel was used to hide it.  On the Williams engines the two can motors are just about where the main transformer (front cab) and train boiler (rear cab) would be situated.  I BELIEVE that if you were to go through either door on the engine sides you could go along a walkway between the front and rear cabs and I KNOW that you could walk across the cab locations from engineer to fireman station.  

It looks like the compartments for the main transformer and the train boiler were separate, located dead center, and each had a single doorway at the back of the respective cab.  It looks like there was an access door at the front of the cabs to get access to motor control units 1 and 3 that were located under the long hoods just in front of the cabs.  I think the front doors on the extreme ends of the hood only allowed access to the main ventilation blowers?

Thanks Chuck, that makes sense.  I figure I'll get the people with the cab parts.

Some photo's of the test interior modifications.  A control panel and a control panel installed in the shell.

temp install to see how it looks.  I've also "opened" up the fireman's side to allow "see through"

I'm modifying a Preiser 1/50 figure to be the engineer.  I'll post some more photo's tomorrow.

That's great Chuck, I just got my set of GG1 cabs, panels, and engineers.  I'm all set, and what you're doing looks great!  How did you "open up the fireman's side, do you have pictures of that?

I'm with you, I never gave mounting it on the frame a thought, I assumed I'd be mounting it in the shell.

Razor/snap saw.  One of the smaller ones.  I've just glued the engineer into his seat and will post photo's of the cab from the other side showing what was cut out.  The archway is correct on the fireman's side but they put a plug behind it.  I am guessing the Lionel version has something stuffed in the area between the engineer's side and the fireman's and that's why the engineers panel is mounted so shallow.  It looks like that panel should be swung into the area between the cabs at about a 45 degree angle.  The vertical motors are hiding where the main transformer and boiler would be on the real engine and there would have been a bulkhead an access door at the back of the cab between the two stations and another one on the front side that would allow access to the motor control units just in front of the cab.

These are the final mod's and some closeup and test fit.  It's pretty much done other than either extending the serial data line or slicing into the cab floor and installing a "roof" panel to tie left and right hand sides together once the floor is cut.  There is room and that might make installation of the cab easier since there would be more surface area to grab.  Lionel had the cab interior mounted to the frame which is why the "U" is on the bottom.

Comparison of an un modified cab with a modified one.  I cut out the back panel so you can see across the cab.

Close up of finished cab looking forward and rearward

Looking across the cab

Engineer in cab

Saws used to make mods.  These are just various "razor"/"snap" saws.  The top one is flexible and called a "flush cut".  I used that to remove the mounting pins/stanchions on the bottom of the inserts.  The bottom one is "shorty" that allowed me to slice open the plug between the engineer and fireman's side of the cab.

That's great Chuck, Thanks!   I'm saving these for my mods!

Are you doing something similar for the rear cab, just no engineers?

No crew, basically just the control panel.  These cabs came from different loco's and it's very apparent that they are salvage parts.

BTW, I saw the lighting mods you made on the upgrading a Williams GG1 thread.  Very impressive.  Putting in a detailed cab will make for an impressive model.  Good luck. 

The GG1 that I'm going to put these cabs in is a second one, I don't think I'll go back and revisit the one I posted the pictures of.  I have the #4935 that usually pulled the Presidential cars, so it's getting PS/2 (the other one has TMCC) so I'll have one of each control type.  They'll be seen on the road with our modular club.

Chuck,

Did you mount the interiors to the inside top of the shell? How?

It looks like from one of the photos that you made a bracket? Is that correct?

Could the interior have been just place in front of one of the motors on the chassis?

I'm learning a lot from your experience.  I think I'll position the cabs to clear the motors, and then mount the electronics.  Since this one is getting a PS/2 upgrade board, it's pretty small and one piece unit, so I don't see any issues in positioning it without interfering with the cabs, speakers, etc.