John Rowlen's Detailed Passenger Cars with Preiser 65602 Unpainted Seated People - A growing Collection

I own one or two of John's master works - they are exceptional!  Thank You John.  Jim Pagel

@John Rowlen posted:

OOPS! I made my picture files too big. I will correct that soon. I am using my I phone and chose too large a file size. It is taking a long time to load pictures tonight.

Actually, I find them much too small!  Case in point, I guess this is supposed to show me something, but I really can't make out much but white tables.  The biggest image is 640 pixels wide, I'd make them at least 1024, and my standard is 1280.

Gunrunner John,  As always, you are correct.  In my effort to show all the cars, I had to reduce the picture size to keep them under the file size limit for a post.  Here are a few of the pictures in a larger size.

After the Rio Grande Ski Train passenger cars, I will be showing the Amtrak III seven car set.  I want to do that set because the Amtrak III StationSounds Dining Car is going to Lionel Service for a sparking truck under the electronics in the Kitchen section of the car. You know my experiences have been filled with out-of-the-box repair needs. But by now that is to be expected. Enjoy some bigger pictures.

Sincerely, John Rowlen

The next passenger train is the Amtrak III seven car set.

BAGGAGE CAR:  I painted the floor with a dry brush method of four colors mixing as i draw the 1/4" paint brush across the floor in straight lines. The colors are sand, yellow for highlights, light brown and medium brown.

This car is fun to detail because I use Woodland Scenics 2722 "Train Personnel", 2752 "Bicycle Buddies", 2757 "Depot Workers & Accessories", and 2766 "Misc. Freight".

The goal is to have the figures seen through the open car doors. Here are the pictures that will give a better description than words can give, Half of the car is mail sorting and the other is suitcases and freight.  I painted some grain sacks to serve as mail bags needing sorting at the desk inside the car.

The next post will be the Baggage Car without the body shell.

John Rowlen

Amtrak III Baggage Car continued.

Here is the car without the body shell installed.  The pictures show most of the details gathered near the opening doors.

I included a picture of the interior as it came from the factory.  Another shows the addition of the floor painting using four colors: sand/buff, yellow for accents, light brown and brown.  I used a 1/4" flat brush to draw the paint across the floor from one side to the other in as straight a line as I could.

I have noticed at the Introduction to the television show, "In the Heat of the Night", that one baggage car door was open on the moving Amtrak train.  Could have been from the humid heat of the night.

Have a good evening.

John Rowlen

Nice work.

I like the sacks of flour and the free standing wood shelves.

Thanks for sharing these. Always nice to see somebody's super-detailing projects. I'll start the countdown now on the time until @Allan Miller suggests you write an article for the magazine, haha.

Thank you for the comments.  I put a picture of the Amtrak Baggage Car factory interior in the prior post to show some of the details that Lionel included.  This opening door baggage car is my favorite because  . . . I can open the doors.

Amtrak III StationSounds Dining Car:  The third picture in the small photos is the Dining Car without Seat backs.

I cut 1/4" white Plastruct strips into seat backs.  I first paint the long strips with the tan paint, (a mixture of flat white and Earth brown with a touch of red in it,)

Next, I cut them into uniform seat backs using a jig I made of Plastruct sheets.  (Cutting them squarely is always a challenge.)  I use an Excel knife to score the straight cut several times, and then break off the seat back from the long plastic strip.  Since the seats backs are already painted, I can glue them in place, centered on the back of the floor cube.  (I need to make sure the back is pushed against the floor and not tilting side to side or back to front on the cube.) See the photo of the finished painted interior.  I do touch-up the tan seats with an additional coat of paint to fill-in the gaps between seat backs and cubes.

I probably should say I paint the bottoms of the tables brown and the tops white for a table cloth.  I usually use two coats for the brown and four or five for the table cloth.  The bright LED lights will really expose a poor paint job, The oil used in the plastic-molding process needs one coat of paint to secure it in place. There will be bleed-through of the plastic's original factory color.

And now the Diners are ready to eat.  I try to make logical family and conversation groupings in all my cars.  The people should seem alive and enjoying their travel by train.

I use Preiser 65602 Unpainted 24 Seated People and a very hard to find Preiser 68209 six pack of 1/50 Seated People. These six people are just small enough to easily fit between the seat and the table bottoms. I have found some similar six people available from China, but the blanks are no longer available as unpainted stock.  I will say more when I cover painting the Preiser 65602 figures.

Here are some pictures.  Note that the man holding the baby and feeding it a bottle is missing both Baby and Bottle in some pictures.  Some serious grinding and modifications are necessary to get this figure seated behind one of the center tables. His fat father is seated across from the young parents with his wife who uses a cane.  That's just one of the groupings I mentioned.  See how many you can spot inside the Dining Car.

Have a good evening.

Sincerely, John Rowlen

Amtrak III Dome Lounge

Another car in the Lionel Amtrak III 4-car passenger set is the Dome-Lounge Car.  The four pack includes the Baggage, Dome-Lounge, a Coach and a Sleeper.

Amtrak III Dome Lounge:  When the 4-pack arrived, the Dome Seats were installed backwards.  At first I thought that Lionel made a mistake, but there were signs that the Dome Floor may have been tampered with. Trains do get returned to Dealers. And not all Dealers inspect what is returned or would spot the seats facing the wrong way.  Nike's slogan is "Just Do It".  My slogan has become, if you really want it, "Just Fix It".

Since the posts break when removed, I took my Dremel Tool with sanding Drum and ground down the supporting post on the bottom of half of the seats.

I then glued the seats directly to the Dome Floor.  Keeping half of the seats in their original place gave me a guide for placement of the lowered seats.  Once the first side had dried, I removed the other side of seats, ground down the posts, and glued them in place.  It is important to keep the one side of seats in their original place as a guide when doing this.

All aboard!

The Dome is highly visible and gets some of my best figures.  Even if a viewer doesn't look into the main floor of the car, the people in the Dome are easy to see.

The lower Lounge gets the more mature people, like the woman smoking a cigarette.  You will find her in the women's restroom of most of my coaches and occasionally in a closed bedroom.  I am letting her sneak a puff or two in the Lounge. It has a good ventilation system.

The lower coach is divided into three areas. a smaller front coach area, the Lower Lounge, and the main rear Coach Seating.  I usually let the younger people drift to the front, and the parents with children and older adults and businessmen sit in the larger back area.

The seats are painted with tan and the storage areas and desk by the Dome stairs are painted brown.  The major modification is the lowering of the Dome Seats. This car has the high Dome Roof and would not normally have the seats lowered, but if I really want it, "Just Fix It". 

Thank you for viewing what could grow into a long thread.

Sincerely, John Rowlen

@John Rowlen posted:

Amtrak III Baggage Car continued. ...snip... I have noticed at the Introduction to the television show, "In the Heat of the Night", that one baggage car door was open on the moving Amtrak train.  Could have been from the humid heat of the night.

Have a good evening.

John Rowlen

More the train is approaching or departing the station.

Dave.  Thanks for the suggestion. The Amtrak F40PH and baggage with two other passenger cars is already moving at a good speed through Sparta. I am betting somebody jumped off the "Late Night Train to Georgia" for a food run and forgot to tell the engineer. The sad thing would be if they never miss him.

Have a great evening.

John Rowlen

Moving on to the Amtrak Coach Car. I have done so many Coach Cars in the 200 plus 21" passenger cars for my "Valley of Bridges" layout.  It gets difficult coming up with new conversation groupings. That does not include the 180 HO passenger cars I did before I lost partial vision in my left eye.

Amtrak III Coach Car from the 4-pack. (I am not going to make you sit through the viewing of the Coach from the 2-Pack.)

The average Coach gets tan (flat white with flat Earth Brown and a bit of red) on the seats, and white toilets and sinks, and that's it. Now Lionel is using white plastic for Toilets and Sinks and saving me so much work painting around them in the tight space of the bathrooms.

Not all of the Preiser 65602 people are the same size. The woman smoking a cigarette and the woman with the make-up case have tall bee-hive hair styles that make them look out of place with the rest of the figures. Fortunately, I put these women in the restroom smoking and talking.  A realistic solution.

As always, I try to tell a story with the conversation and family groups I create in the passenger cars.

Note:  I distinguish these cars as "Amtrak III" because I completed the seven Amtrak cars Lionel made several years ago. That set had a blue interior plastic.

Have a good evening.

John Rowlen

It's Bedtime!  No seriously.  But before I go, I will list pictures of the two Amtrak III Sleeping Cars.  Like the coaches, these cars have tan seats.  The original plastic interior of the Amtrak III Sleeping Car is beige, so I painted the floor two coats of red paint to match the rest of the red plastic interiors.  I do not paint vertical walls because the bright LED lights cause the brush strokes to be seen through the translucent walls.

The individual Sleeping Chairs do not line up so that a person seated back into the chair will show through the window. I have to bring them forward on the front edge of the chair to be seen.  The stateroom sofa passengers can be seen easily, but the stateroom chairs are hidden from view.

This style interior has been used by Lionel since the C&O seven car set was introduced as one of the early 21" passenger cars.  Again, I make logical family groups with the babies in the staterooms when possible.

Sweet Dreams.

John Rowlen

Beautiful work, John!

Mark, It is good to hear from you. I have been away from OGR Forum and need to pour a BIG cup of coffee and go through the Blackwater Canyon Line thread.  With Mom's passing two years ago, I started downsizing my collection and painting my left-over Seated People blanks as something to do on a cold winter night.

To everyone else, . . . I was able to purchase 22 more boxes of Preiser 65602 Unpainted Seated People from Frank arts in Germany and two other Ebay vendors.  During covid, Germany did not allow Ebay transactions because they would not let returns back into Germany.

I have recently detailed the CSX Business, Rio Grande Ski Train , and Amtrak III  passenger trains. I have the eight-car NYC Southwestern Limited set interiors painted and waiting for me to paint more Preiser 65602 Seated People and install them.

Tonight I am finishing up the extra people that did not get put onboard a passenger car.  I will probably sell the extra people when my passenger cars are done.

Have a wonderful Mother Day's weekend.

Sincerely, John Rowlen

Odd when I couldn't find the Preiser Figures , I found these on the Bay, Same mold ,but some lacked the detail My guess they were seconds

Hi John- good to see you posting again. I'm sure you are thinking of your mom today. I know you were close.

Nice to see your passenger car detailing is still going at full speed. I'm planning to start adding people to some of my 13" 027 cars and upgrading the lighting. Nothing to the level of detail you do, but fun none the less.

Bob

Dave,  I have used these figures from China. At one time Preiser listed figures as out-of-production and the Chinese version of the 65602 figures appeared on Ebay. Now the blanks are selling out and only painted figures are available. The Chinese figures lack the facial detail and fine hair lines that are in the Preiser 65602 white plastic figures.  The China figures take two coats of paint to make them look better. A strange gray edge sometimes occurs where the paint edge ends. It must be a chemical reaction at the edge of the new paint. I have to account for this, and then overlap the next color of paint on the figures to cover the gray.

Bob,  Lionel had extra Coach interior pieces available from the Parts Department when I started detailing their 21" cars.  I have used up the seats in my years of detailing Lionel Sleeping cars.  The NYC Southwestern Limited Sleeper, "Cascade Elf", that will be detailed soon, had seven Coach car seats installed in the sleeper that had no seating in the larger staterooms. Two smaller rooms were also missing seats. I do not know why. Perhaps these coach interiors could be used in your passenger car project somehow.

Everyone else,  I am still painting the odds and ends people from ten 24-packs of Preiser 65602 Unpainted Seated People.  These are the larger figures that are not used as often as the parents with babies. After a while I have to stop painting because bending over the table causes discomfort between my shoulder blades.  Now I know why Preiser gets between $155.00 and $195.00 for the five packs that contain these twenty-four factory-painted people. The 24 blanks cost approximately $39.00US.

Have a good evening and a great week.

Sincerely, John Rowlen

Thank you so much for sharing and explaining your thought process. I have just begun "improving" my interiors and this is a huge help. I have done three pennsy cars painted based on original interior photos I found on the internet. I am only using pre painted figures that I cut to make fit the seats etc.

John, the photographs and videos look great!  I have 2 sets of passenger cars, one has passengers, the other set needs them.  I want to add LED lighting in all the cars and plan to add passengers then.  I added LED lighting to one car so far, and it makes a great difference.  Thank you for sharing your experience with us!

@John Rowlen posted:

Amtrak III Dome Lounge

Another car in the Lionel Amtrak III 4-car passenger set is the Dome-Lounge Car.  The four pack includes the Baggage, Dome-Lounge, a Coach and a Sleeper.

Amtrak III Dome Lounge: ...

The seats are painted with tan and the storage areas and desk by the Dome stairs are painted brown.  The major modification is the lowering of the Dome Seats. This car has the high Dome Roof and would not normally have the seats lowered, but if I really want it, "Just Fix It".

John, what is the reason for lowering the seats in the dome? Are they so high that people will hit their heads, or does it just not look good?

Bigboy25,

There is absolutely NO reason to lower the seats in the Amtrak III Dome Lounge, except the set I received had the Dome Seats installed Backwards.

It was set up with the lower level looking one way, and the Dome looking the opposite way.   I chose to correct the Dome Seating, but several of the posts on the bottom of the Dome Seats would not come loose from the floor, except for breaking from the Dome Seat as I tried to cut and knock them loose. There were signs of tampering or abnormal assembly. It did not look the way all my previous Dome Lounge cars looked.

The last thing I wanted to do was send another item back to the Dealer. (I have been criticized for complaining about out-of-the-box issues and not accepting what I receive from Dealers.)  "We all need to learn to accept the items when they do not work, and be happy!"  I believe that is the new warranty for the future of toy trains.   As long as it is written clearly on the box, I have no problem --- "This item in the box may not work, may be missing parts or be broken into pieces." "No refunds after the first 15 minutes."

Occasionally I vent a little.  The Amtrak III StationSounds Dining Car is going back for Service for a "Sparking truck" that has the electronics on it.  It would not be a big deal, but I had to send my first CSX Business Train StationSounds Dining car back to the dealer for a similar problem.   I have several newer engines that do not work and no place to have them fixed.  All my local train stores closed a few years ago.  Is this "the future of Model Railroading"?

Talk to Me:  I actually listen, respond and look for solutions.

I have been "Talking" to the manufacturer for over ten years and you can see how effective that has been.

Have a great week. You deserve it.

Sincerely, John Rowlen

Working in Rowlen's Barber Shop: Painting hair on the men in my collection of left-over figures. (My version of the Hair Club for Men.)  The hair is the most critical aspect of painting the figures. It frames the faces and helps enhance the traits of the figure.

I am setting aside my painting for a couple of days. I will be back later in the week. I am listing a Broadway Limited passenger set on Ebay. I detailed two ten-car sets.

Have a good week.

Sincerely, John Rowlen

That’s the largest barber shop I ever saw!  😄Looking good!

Mark, If I ever lose my hair, I can paint some on my head.

I boxed up the Preiser 65602 people to take a break from painting to list some trains on Ebay. That is how I feed my face, There are 94 watchers and a good group of repeat buyers. I use Ebay because the bookkeeping is excellent, and the task of selling is very easy.  Yes, Ebay gets a percentage, but for sending sales tax to each of the 50 states, giving me seller reminders and keeping me organized, it cannot be beat,  Ebay also offers Sellers some protections from Buyers who might try to abuse the system.

I took some pictures of my Amtrak III StationSounds Dining Car before it goes to Lionel Service for a "Sparking Truck".  Every time the truck sparks, the sound goes off briefly. That can't be good for the hopefully long life of the car's sound system.

I posted a very short video of the sparks and another of the interior of the Dining Car as seen through the windows.

Have a good week.

Sincerely, John Rowlen

That is a bummer on a nice car.  The dining car looks quite popular by the passengers’ appearance

Took some time to have fun while I did two loads of wash. Ran the six remaining Amtrak III passenger cars behind my UP #3985 Challenger. Lionel did put the correct sound in it when I sent it into Service. Taking a mental break and eating an ice cream cone.  Life is good.  Or so I will pretend. You are where you think you are.  All aboard.

John Rowlen

Good evening.  Gathering up the pictures of the CSX Business Train cars that I have detailed with Preiser 65602 Unpainted Seated People.  The first car will be the "Moonlight Dome" from the 4-pack. (The "Moonlight Dome" also appeared in B&O paint in the Norfolk Southern Private Car passenger pack.)

Moonlight Dome:  The Moonlight Dome/Lounge car has not had any adjustment made to the Dome Seats. The Seats are raised 1/4 inch off the Dome Floor by the support post molded into the bottom of each Seat.  The seats were painted a tan (Flat white and Flat Earth with a touch of red.)  The people in the seats have had a quarter to a half the distance from the bottom to the belt-line ground off the figures as an average height adjustment. The man with the baby has more taken off the bottom to lower the bigger figure. The wife is seated in front and angled to look over the back of her seat.

The Main Floor is divided into a front coach, Lower Lounge and larger rear Coach area. I placed a woman smoking in the Lounge and talking to the woman with the small carrying case because these two women are larger because of their hair styles.

The man at the front of the Lounge with his hand up and his legs crossed is not a Preiser figure. It is from China and similar to a figure in Preiser's 68209 6-pack.

Once again, the man with the baby is seated, but on the opposite side and in the rear lower coach area. The wife again is looking over the back of her seat. I have duplicated these two figures in many of my Dome cars.

The interior desk by the stairs to the Dome and two storage closets in the lower front are painted brown.

As always, I tried to make conversation or family groupings in the cars.

Have a good evening.

Sincerely, John Rowlen

The second car I detailed in the Lionel 2227350 CSX Business Train was the Sleeper, "Michael J. Ward".   Like the NYC Southwestern Limited "Cascade Elf" Sleeper, it too is missing seats in the center Staterooms and two smaller rooms.

I ordered NYC Empire State Express coach interiors from Lionel Parts Department many years ago and cut out seats to glue into those center Staterooms.

I added Preiser 65602 Unpainted Seated People to the car in logical groupings.

Have a good evening.

Sincerely, John Rowlen

@John Rowlen posted:

The second car I detailed in the Lionel 2227350 CSX Business Train was the Sleeper, Michael J. Ward".   Like the NYC Southwestern Limited "Cascade Elf" Sleeper, it too is missing seats in the center Staterooms and two smaller rooms.

I ordered NYC Empire State Express coach interiors from Lionel Parts Department many years ago and cut out seats to glue into those center Staterooms.

I added Preiser 65602 Unpainted Seated People to the car in logical groupings.

Have a good evening.

Sincerely, John Rowlen

What are you using for lighting?

Dave,  The Lighting is Lionel's factory-installed LED "Flicker-Free" Lighting Bars that go up the middle of the car interior roof.

They do seem brighter than normal, but the blue interior plastic may be affecting what we see.  . . . Or the factory may have used the lights from the Heavy Weight cars that had the dark green tinted windows. It is different, but why?  What is the change the factory made?  I do not have an answer but feel that it appears different from previous 21" passenger cars.

John Rowlen

@John Rowlen posted:

Dave,  The Lighting is Lionel's factory-installed LED "Flicker-Free" Lighting Bars that go up the middle of the car interior roof.

They do seem brighter than normal, but the blue interior plastic may be affecting what we see.  . . . Or the factory may have used the lights from the Heavy Weight cars that had the dark green tinted windows. It is different, but why?  What is the change the factory made?  I do not have an answer but feel that it appears different from previous 21" passenger cars.

John Rowlen

Just asking, trying to come up with lighting for  my weaver  morning Hiawatha cars. I am also doing the full interior!

Dave, With so many older passenger car lighting systems that could use an update, I am surprised a manufacturer has not produced a "Flicker-Free Lighting" LED Kit to install in older cars. Where are the tech and marketing people? Out to lunch?

Doesn't @gunrunnerjohn sell a kit to upgrade your passenger cars to flicker free led lighting?

bigboy25,

If Gunrunner John has a flicker-free LED Lighting kit, he can post information in this thread to help all of us with lighting issues.  One day I may "people-u-late" my older passenger cars from the 60's.  Any interior seats and furnishings are also welcome to be added.  The school teacher in me is starting to show.

John Rowlen

We do indeed, both the full kit and the lighting regulators to use with LED strips for custom installs.

Full kit: Passenger Car LED Lighting Kit

LED Lighting Regulators: LED Lighting Regulator

The third car in the 2227350 (B&O inspired paint) CSX Office Car Passenger Train is the "Thomas Rice" Theater Car. The four-pack contains a "Champion M. Davis" Generator Sound Car, the "Moonlight Dome" Dome Lounge, the "Michael J. Ward" Sleeper, and the "Thomas Rice" Theater Car.  There is not much to say about the "Champion M. Davis" Generator Sound Car because it is a sealed car with no opening doors.  It has a volume control and sound on/off switch.

"Thomas Rice" Theater Car:  The car does not have a camera and that space is empty in the interior. I did add two seats by the windows in the front of the car.

The seats are painted tan (Flat White and Earth Brown with a touch of red) and brown table bases and white tablecloths.

I added people to the middle table seating and company executives discussing business in the Theater Seating at the rear of the car.  After their meeting, the seating will open up to the guests on the train.

As always, I tried to put logical conversation or family groupings in the car.  The rear Theater seating is filled with CSX Executives for their brief meeting.

I had to cut a slot down the rear Theater side wall to run the light wires to lift them out of the Theater seating area where they hung into view.  (See the second and third pictures and the wires at the rear far side wall of the Theater Seating.)  Hanging wires really destroyed the realism of the Theater Section.

Sincerely, John Rowlen

John I hear you , the flickering light have driven me nutz since my tinplate days and until  I purchased  a Big Hauler set for , at the time ,  my 6 month old son.  Their solution was a battery  mounted in a tool box under the car ,  to power the lights. Simple and effective .

   Now  I have a general knowledge of  grain of wheat/grain of rice bulbs, ect but I know nothing of LEDs except how to burn them up, and have had little luck finding lighting kits.  The prototype  train I am working on now is from the mid mid 1930's and needs to  have nice warm lighting , but not to bright as to burn the passengers to cinders , like some I have seen from lionel and mth,   Any suggestions?.....PS my thread is on the 2 rail section.