TheTrainMain posted:

Hiya! I was considering purchasing a K-line New York Central Hudson (K3270-5343S) and I was wondering a few things...

 

1. Can I install ERR cruise in it?  YES

2. Is there a way to replace the Railsounds board with one from another later TMCC locomotive (New York Central 2-8-2 Mikado JR, w/TMCC (6-38609). I just really think that the sounds from this locomotive would compliment the hudson beautifully.   With ERR I think so, but I don't think you could buy this board from Lionel.   I would check out the sounds ERR has first.

3. How would one install a super chuffer, so that I can have 4 chuffs per revolution, and fan driven smoke.   Easy, you also need a chuff generator

4. If I do get a super chuffer in the locomotive, can I use an MTH smoke unit?  Yes if you change the heating resistors so you don't  blow out the R4LC board.

Please let me know if you know the answer to any of these, Im not very experienced in the field of modifying locomotives  

 

superwarp1 posted:

TheTrainMain posted:

Hiya! I was considering purchasing a K-line New York Central Hudson (K3270-5343S) and I was wondering a few things...

 

1. Can I install ERR cruise in it?  YES

2. Is there a way to replace the Railsounds board with one from another later TMCC locomotive (New York Central 2-8-2 Mikado JR, w/TMCC (6-38609). I just really think that the sounds from this locomotive would compliment the hudson beautifully.   With ERR I think so, but I don't think you could buy this board from Lionel.   I would check out the sounds ERR has first.

3. How would one install a super chuffer, so that I can have 4 chuffs per revolution, and fan driven smoke.   Easy, you also need a chuff generator

4. If I do get a super chuffer in the locomotive, can I use an MTH smoke unit?  Yes if you change the heating resistors so you don't  blow out the R4LC board.

Please let me know if you know the answer to any of these, Im not very experienced in the field of modifying locomotives  

 

 Thank you so much! The board I can buy from lionels replacement parts service, what is a chuff generator? Does it come with the engine?  And how would one change the resistors on an MTH smoke unit? Sorry Its just Ive never done these kinda things before and Im kind of lost and confused.

If you run DCS at all you may want to consider a PS-3 upgrade instead. I converted mine to PS-2 a few years back and it performs like a champ. The MTH smoke unit fits inside the boiler perfectly.

Rod

Rod Stewart posted:

If you run DCS at all you may want to consider a PS-3 upgrade instead. I converted mine to PS-2 a few years back and it performs like a champ. The MTH smoke unit fits inside the boiler perfectly.

Rod

Certainly much more cost effective plus you can load almost any whistle you want.

Pete

As there are SO many K Line products out there with a need for this upgrade or flat out repair of a burned out motor driver board. I wish someone would do a step by step video on this.

Note that the detection device is deferent between the K line flywheel reader and a ERR board... so you may have a few extra wires.

Well just remember you can ALWAYS improvise!

The majority of K-Line Hudsons don't have Cruise so the reader is a non issue. Adding Cruise to K-Line is a simple 20 minute job. Adding fan driven smoke is the time consuming and potentially expensive part. You can buy MTH Hudsons for nearly the same price as the K-Line Hudson before mods and have all those features already.

Pete

Rod Stewart posted:

If you run DCS at all you may want to consider a PS-3 upgrade instead. I converted mine to PS-2 a few years back and it performs like a champ. The MTH smoke unit fits inside the boiler perfectly.

Rod

Im sorry, I hope I dont sound mean here, but I dont have any interest in MTH’s electronics. The only thing I like about MTH is some of their models, and their smoke output. I would rather if someone could help me with the lionel upgrade Id like to do, so if any of you can help please don’t hesitate to help

J Daddy posted:

As there are SO many K Line products out there with a need for this upgrade or flat out repair of a burned out motor driver board. I wish someone would do a step by step video on this.

Note that the detection device is deferent between the K line flywheel reader and a ERR board... so you may have a few extra wires.

Well just remember you can ALWAYS improvise!

But the locomotive doesnt have a tach reader because it doesnt have cruise to begin with.

TheTrainMain posted:

superwarp1 posted:

TheTrainMain posted:

Hiya! I was considering purchasing a K-line New York Central Hudson (K3270-5343S) and I was wondering a few things...

 

1. Can I install ERR cruise in it?  YES

2. Is there a way to replace the Railsounds board with one from another later TMCC locomotive (New York Central 2-8-2 Mikado JR, w/TMCC (6-38609). I just really think that the sounds from this locomotive would compliment the hudson beautifully.   With ERR I think so, but I don't think you could buy this board from Lionel.   I would check out the sounds ERR has first.

3. How would one install a super chuffer, so that I can have 4 chuffs per revolution, and fan driven smoke.   Easy, you also need a chuff generator

4. If I do get a super chuffer in the locomotive, can I use an MTH smoke unit?  Yes if you change the heating resistors so you don't  blow out the R4LC board.

Please let me know if you know the answer to any of these, Im not very experienced in the field of modifying locomotives  

 

 Thank you so much! The board I can buy from lionels replacement parts service, what is a chuff generator? Does it come with the engine?  And how would one change the resistors on an MTH smoke unit? Sorry Its just Ive never done these kinda things before and Im kind of lost and confused.

 

Don't you just love the suggestions for questions you didn't ask?

You would buy the chuff generator when you purchase the super chuffer.   You would need to remove the two resistors in the MTH smoke unit and install a 28 ohm resistor.  

If I may, I would suggest contacting Gunrunner John and having him do the install for you.  If you really want to do it yourself, contact John via email and he can give you better details than I can or anyone else for that matter. 

superwarp1 posted:

TheTrainMain posted:

superwarp1 posted:

TheTrainMain posted:

Hiya! I was considering purchasing a K-line New York Central Hudson (K3270-5343S) and I was wondering a few things...

 

1. Can I install ERR cruise in it?  YES

2. Is there a way to replace the Railsounds board with one from another later TMCC locomotive (New York Central 2-8-2 Mikado JR, w/TMCC (6-38609). I just really think that the sounds from this locomotive would compliment the hudson beautifully.   With ERR I think so, but I don't think you could buy this board from Lionel.   I would check out the sounds ERR has first.

3. How would one install a super chuffer, so that I can have 4 chuffs per revolution, and fan driven smoke.   Easy, you also need a chuff generator

4. If I do get a super chuffer in the locomotive, can I use an MTH smoke unit?  Yes if you change the heating resistors so you don't  blow out the R4LC board.

Please let me know if you know the answer to any of these, Im not very experienced in the field of modifying locomotives  

 

 Thank you so much! The board I can buy from lionels replacement parts service, what is a chuff generator? Does it come with the engine?  And how would one change the resistors on an MTH smoke unit? Sorry Its just Ive never done these kinda things before and Im kind of lost and confused.

 

Don't you just love the suggestions for questions you didn't ask?

You would buy the chuff generator when you purchase the super chuffer.   You would need to remove the two resistors in the MTH smoke unit and install a 28 ohm resistor.  

If I may, I would suggest contacting Gunrunner John and having him do the install for you.  If you really want to do it yourself, contact John via email and he can give you better details than I can or anyone else for that matter. 

Thank you for all your help! I will have to contact Gunrunner John, Id much rather have someone experienced do it instead of me. So I would just buy all the parts for it and send him the parts and the engine? Once again thank you for all your help and quick responses

You might contact him before buying the parts, so you get the right parts. If you do not have a firm in depth understanding of the job, you might order the wrong parts.

What Roy said.  Don't buy anything.  Send it to GunRunner John, tell him what you want, and let him run with everything.  He's an expert.

You'll end up with quite a bit of money in it if you want fan driven smoke, 4-chuff/rev, and cruise.  Parts for this will run over $200, and then there's the labor of putting it all in.  You have to decide if you really like this locomotive.

In my opinion, one would be better off modifying an MTH Premier Proto one Hudson. It's almost as good looking as the K-Line model, but has a bigger motor.

I have one that I purchased online that has the PS2 conversion with a MTH smoke unit. It is a fine model and I really enjoy it. Don't be so quick to discount the MTH system as it has several advantages over a TMCC setup. You can change the chuff rate, change the sounds to any locomotive you'd like, and many other interesting features that are exclusive to DCS.

Ok it seems like instead of all the upgrade I listed before, I may just do an ERR cruise upgrade, and a TMCC Railsounds upgrade and thats it, that is if I get the K-Line Hudson, I am somewhat considering the MTH Proto 1 Hudson, and doing a full TMCC upgrade, but Im sure that would be even pricier.

TheTrainMain posted:

Ok it seems like instead of all the upgrade I listed before, I may just do an ERR cruise upgrade, and a TMCC Railsounds upgrade and thats it, that is if I get the K-Line Hudson, I am somewhat considering the MTH Proto 1 Hudson, and doing a full TMCC upgrade, but Im sure that would be even pricier.

If you really like the engine go for it.    a DCS PS3/2 board can be installed in a Kline engine also, or like stated above you can install TMCC in a MTH engine.  What ever you like and willing to spend.  There is no wrong way to go as long as your happy with your choices.

superwarp1 posted:

TheTrainMain posted:

Ok it seems like instead of all the upgrade I listed before, I may just do an ERR cruise upgrade, and a TMCC Railsounds upgrade and thats it, that is if I get the K-Line Hudson, I am somewhat considering the MTH Proto 1 Hudson, and doing a full TMCC upgrade, but Im sure that would be even pricier.

If you really like the engine go for it.    a DCS PS3/2 board can be installed in a Kline engine also, or like stated above you can install TMCC in a MTH engine.  What ever you like and willing to spend.  There is no wrong way to go as long as your happy with your choices.

Thank you for all your help through this subject The hudson is my absolute favorite locomotive ever made and I really just want to make the best hudson possible

TheTrainMain posted:

Ok it seems like instead of all the upgrade I listed before, I may just do an ERR cruise upgrade, and a TMCC Railsounds upgrade and thats it, that is if I get the K-Line Hudson, I am somewhat considering the MTH Proto 1 Hudson, and doing a full TMCC upgrade, but Im sure that would be even pricier.

It may be a trade off price wise. You will have to get a full Cruise Commander vs the less expensive Cruise M but you will also get a fan smoke unit. With a steam railsounds kit you will get a chuff switch with magnets. You could add a second reed switch to drive the fan for 4 chuffs. Not as elegant as other methods but it will work and cost peanuts. Another big plus with the MTH engine is it comes with a large Pittman motor. The K-Line only has a small Mabuchi and can only pull about half the number of cars the MTH engine can.

Pete

Norton posted:

TheTrainMain posted:

Ok it seems like instead of all the upgrade I listed before, I may just do an ERR cruise upgrade, and a TMCC Railsounds upgrade and thats it, that is if I get the K-Line Hudson, I am somewhat considering the MTH Proto 1 Hudson, and doing a full TMCC upgrade, but Im sure that would be even pricier.

It may be a trade off price wise. You will have to get a full Cruise Commander vs the less expensive Cruise M but you will also get a fan smoke unit. With a steam railsounds kit you will get a chuff switch with magnets. You could add a second reed switch to drive the fan for 4 chuffs. Not as elegant as other methods but it will work and cost peanuts. Another big plus with the MTH engine is it comes with a large Pittman motor. The K-Line only has a small Mabuchi and can only pull about half the number of cars the MTH engine can.

 

Pete

As a owner of several Kline engines where did you get your info that the Kline engine can only pull half of what a MTH can???   In my experience that's simply not true.  

I can promise you the Kline engine will pull until the traction tires spin off.   The two engines may not weigh the same and the MTH can probably pull more but it's not half.

Gary, Have you tried pulling 13 18" heavyweights? Try it and report back.

FWIW I have both engines.

Pete

Norton posted:

TheTrainMain posted:

Ok it seems like instead of all the upgrade I listed before, I may just do an ERR cruise upgrade, and a TMCC Railsounds upgrade and thats it, that is if I get the K-Line Hudson, I am somewhat considering the MTH Proto 1 Hudson, and doing a full TMCC upgrade, but Im sure that would be even pricier.

It may be a trade off price wise. You will have to get a full Cruise Commander vs the less expensive Cruise M but you will also get a fan smoke unit. With a steam railsounds kit you will get a chuff switch with magnets. You could add a second reed switch to drive the fan for 4 chuffs. Not as elegant as other methods but it will work and cost peanuts. Another big plus with the MTH engine is it comes with a large Pittman motor. The K-Line only has a small Mabuchi and can only pull about half the number of cars the MTH engine can.

 

Pete

So the $120 cruise commander comes with everything? Like everything you just listed? If not do you know where I can get all those?

You also need a Railsounds board. I think they list for around 90 bucks for steam. electricrr.com is the source. Go to their web page and you can hear the sounds of the different railsounds boards. You can also download the manuals to see if this is something you can do yourself. Very little soldering required. Mostly just stripping wires and installing in screw terminals.

Pete

Norton posted:

You also need a Railsounds board. I think they list for around 90 bucks for steam. electricrr.com is the source. Go to their web page and you can hear the sounds of the different railsounds boards. You can also download the manuals to see if this is something you can do yourself. Very little soldering required. Mostly just stripping wires and installing in screw terminals.

Pete

What if I want to buy a diffrent sound board from a diffrent tmcc engine through lionels replacement parts service? Will that work?

That is much more involved. The new electric RR board is a single board. The Railsounds boards that Lionel sells are two separate boards plus a motherboard that the first two plug into. Electric RR includes a speaker, baffle, and chuff switch. Lionel is all al a carte.

If you got the K-Line engine you would only need the Railsounds board as the other two are already in the engine.

Lots of trade offs.

Pete 

Norton posted:

That is much more involved. The new electric RR board is a single board. The Railsounds boards that Lionel sells are two separate boards plus a motherboard that the first two plug into. Electric RR includes a speaker, baffle, and chuff switch. Lionel is all al a carte.

If you got the K-Line engine you would only need the Railsounds board as the other two are already in the engine.

Lots of trade offs.

 

Pete 

So if I wanted to use the board from lionel Id have to buy all the other boards from lionel? Is it possible? 

TheTrainMain posted:

Norton posted:

That is much more involved. The new electric RR board is a single board. The Railsounds boards that Lionel sells are two separate boards plus a motherboard that the first two plug into. Electric RR includes a speaker, baffle, and chuff switch. Lionel is all al a carte.

If you got the K-Line engine you would only need the Railsounds board as the other two are already in the engine.

Lots of trade offs.

 

Pete 

So if I wanted to use the board from lionel Id have to buy all the other boards from lionel? Is it possible? 

You can do that. They sell all the boards needed plus the cables, speakers, etc. Given that it sounds like you haven't done this before consider that electric rr gives you everything required including instructions. With Lionel you will have to know all thats required and either order or fabricate the required parts or send it to someone who knows what is required.

Pete

Norton posted:

TheTrainMain posted:

Norton posted:

That is much more involved. The new electric RR board is a single board. The Railsounds boards that Lionel sells are two separate boards plus a motherboard that the first two plug into. Electric RR includes a speaker, baffle, and chuff switch. Lionel is all al a carte.

If you got the K-Line engine you would only need the Railsounds board as the other two are already in the engine.

Lots of trade offs.

 

Pete 

So if I wanted to use the board from lionel Id have to buy all the other boards from lionel? Is it possible? 

You can do that. They sell all the boards needed plus the cables, speakers, etc. Given that it sounds like you haven't done this before consider that electric rr gives you everything required including instructions. With Lionel you will have to know all thats required and either order or fabricate the required parts or send it to someone who knows what is required.

Pete

Oh in that case I may just do the err and in the future add the railsounds that i want.

Norton posted:

TheTrainMain posted:

Norton posted:

That is much more involved. The new electric RR board is a single board. The Railsounds boards that Lionel sells are two separate boards plus a motherboard that the first two plug into. Electric RR includes a speaker, baffle, and chuff switch. Lionel is all al a carte.

If you got the K-Line engine you would only need the Railsounds board as the other two are already in the engine.

Lots of trade offs.

 

Pete 

So if I wanted to use the board from lionel Id have to buy all the other boards from lionel? Is it possible? 

You can do that. They sell all the boards needed plus the cables, speakers, etc. Given that it sounds like you haven't done this before consider that electric rr gives you everything required including instructions. With Lionel you will have to know all thats required and either order or fabricate the required parts or send it to someone who knows what is required.

Pete

I just listened to all the steam sounds, and none of them really have whistles I like, is there any way to change the whistles? If not I guess I’ll have to go with medium. I’ll save the mikado sounds for a later date when I have the time and money to send it to someone

I'm keeping ours new-on-the-shelf as an original non-upgraded example of the locomotive which put K-Line out of business ... by Lionel.

THETRAINMAN........  I have the same K Line Hudson and did the ERR upgrade in the TMCC and RS offered by ERR.  I am very well pleased, the installation is very simple and straight forward.  The hardest part IMO is the installation of the reed switch on the tender wheel.  But, with John's Chuff Generator and Super Chuffer, it is all the better and you can set your chuff rate.  It is more cost, but if that is what you want........    The ERR medium steam is the correct sound for a Hudson, and it sounds better installed than on the web site sound bit.  I, too, really like the detailing and feel of the K Line scale Hudson, and I have pulled 12 of the K Line alum 21" CZ cars, plus the 18" CZ baggage and a Lionel Burlington baggage car.  The Hudson pulled them no problem, and this is with changes in grades.  Really a nice engine and easy to upgrade with ERR.

Jesse     TCA  12-68275 

And, with the ERR cruise you do not need the strobe tape on the flywheel.  The ERR uses EMF feedback from the motor to determine cruise.  I purchased my Hudson from a seller on The Forum at a nice price, so doing the upgrade was also well worth in total expense.  I once owned the MTH PS1 Hudson, but sold it, and I prefer the K Line version with upgrades.  But, then, I do not use DCS and prefer Command Control for all my engines.  Just a preference, matter of choice, but I am well pleased with it and have converted many MTH to ERR TMCC/RS.

Jesse   TCA   12-68275

texastrain posted:

THETRAINMAN........  I have the same K Line Hudson and did the ERR upgrade in the TMCC and RS offered by ERR.  I am very well pleased, the installation is very simple and straight forward.  The hardest part IMO is the installation of the reed switch on the tender wheel.  But, with John's Chuff Generator and Super Chuffer, it is all the better and you can set your chuff rate.  It is more cost, but if that is what you want........    The ERR medium steam is the correct sound for a Hudson, and it sounds better installed than on the web site sound bit.  I, too, really like the detailing and feel of the K Line scale Hudson, and I have pulled 12 of the K Line alum 21" CZ cars, plus the 18" CZ baggage and a Lionel Burlington baggage car.  The Hudson pulled them no problem, and this is with changes in grades.  Really a nice engine and easy to upgrade with ERR.

Jesse     TCA  12-68275 

2 questions, do I need the reed switch? Doesnt the TMCC version of the K-Line hudson already have a chuff switch or whatever it is called in it already? and where did you put the antenna for the TMCC signal?

Yes, if you have the 5343 TMCC version, it has a "cherry switch" installed.  However, it is in the engine and will require a dedicated line/pin in the tether for carrying that signal to the ERR RS board in the tender.  It can be done with installing a multi-pin tether between the engine and tender that has adequate connections.  As for the antenna, I utilized the entire die cast tender shell as the antenna.  It is done by insulating the tender shell from the tender frame entirely.  That is the most difficult part of the process, but is easily possible with tape to insulate the shell and frame fitting and make use of nylon screws to attach them together.  The mounting screws are 6-24 type, and difficult to find... at least I had a time doing so.  The 6-24 screws are not as common as 6-32, which also can be used, just be careful to not twist off the screw head as they can be difficult to install with the thread differences.

Hope this is of help to you.  My Hudson was the conventional version, so use of the reed switch in the tender was necessary at the time.

Jesse    TCA   12-68275 

Just to add to what Jesse said, if you get a K-Line engine with TMCC already installed, the antenna is the railing and insulated from the engine shell. To get cruise you only have to replace the motor driver board with an ERR Cruise M. To change the sound you can use any RS4 board that suits your fancy and Lionel has available. 

The engine has a puffer smoke unit and does two chuffs per rev. If you want 4 chuffs you will have to swap out the puffer unit with a fan smoke unit and then figure out a way to generate the signal for 4 chuffs. Many here have adapted GRJ chuff generator and super chuffer.

Pete

Norton posted:

Just to add to what Jesse said, if you get a K-Line engine with TMCC already installed, the antenna is the railing and insulated from the engine shell. To get cruise you only have to replace the motor driver board with an ERR Cruise M. To change the sound you can use any RS4 board that suits your fancy and Lionel has available. 

The engine has a puffer smoke unit and does two chuffs per rev. If you want 4 chuffs you will have to swap out the puffer unit with a fan smoke unit and then figure out a way to generate the signal for 4 chuffs. Many here have adapted GRJ chuff generator and super chuffer.

Pete

What if I want to use a rs5 chip? Im pretty sure the mikado I want to use is RS5 as it has later non giberish crew talk. 

This video is basically want I want to do except with a K-Line hudson, not a 700E:

https://youtu.be/D5hIjAGUW74

The guy on youtube replied and told me what I need so I might try to go with what he did. I probably will wait till closer to christmas to purchase this engine so I guess I'll update this when I make my purchase, whichever hudson it is. Im also considering the Hudson with the Vanderbilt tender due to its cheapness, however it has the inaccurate tender, and Id need to get a new motor for it, but its a backup thank you all for your help on this subject!

Trainman,

I have the K-Line Hudson with RS and TMCC for sale if you are interested. 

Here is my email...  goh8100@aol.com..thanks