Last Hurrah for MTH?

@Arnold D. Cribari posted:

With the likelihood of MTH, which I've never before admired more than now (fear of loss?), soon going out of business, is now the time to get as much MTH as one can?

I confess that this is the way I feel, and I have recently acted on those feelings big time (at least for me).

How about you?

Arnold

Interesting you say get as much.  I will cull my MTH locomotives and increase my Lionel steam.  I am keeping my 18” passenger cars.  They should endure electronics and parts wise.  Just my thoughts.  I also dislike the drawbar arrangement on MTH steam.

I plan to buy one or two more MTH engines (my preferred brand) that I might not have bought right now if they were remaining in business. But I did buy a new Z-4000 for my secondary layout that I would have postponed if not for the closure. What I have done is to stock up on spare parts,

MELGAR

@Bryant Dunivan 111417 posted:

Interesting you say get as much.  I will cull my MTH locomotives and increase my Lionel steam.  I am keeping my 18” passenger cars.  They should endure electronics and parts wise.  Just my thoughts.  I also dislike the drawbar arrangement on MTH steam.

Bryant, I just got my 1st Proto 3 Steamer with that new drawbar arrangement. No problem so far, but it does seem fragile and somewhat flimsy. However, I'm impressed by the detail. sounds, smoke and relative affordability of the Railking Imperial steamers.

Arnold, I think there will always be a large secondary market for MTH. Most of my steam was new/old scale K-line. Most of my MTH I bought new. There is a ton of it out there for sale. There will most likely be a jump in prices when they finally close their doors but it will settle down after awhile. Don

I was sold on MTH from the very beginning.

One of my favorite MTH Locomotives pre-dates Protosonds; it's a NY Central Mohawk L-3, one very smooth running steamer. The smoke is just OK (it pre-dates fan driven smoke), but it's big, looks great, runs well on 031 curves, and is durable, reliable, affordable and has stood the test of time. It was, and is, my poor man's 773:

I was a longstanding and regular purchaser of Proto 1 for two decades, so most of my MTH is Proto 1. IMO, all are high quality and were a good deal compared to the competition.

I have a couple of Proto 2, which are very nice,  and a few Proto 3 that are wonderful IMO.

Usually less is more when it comes to the size of locomotives because of the 031 curves on my long and narrow layout with reverse loops.

Most of my MTH is Railking, a few are Premier, and I have 1 Railking Imperial that is fabulous for my layout.

And, I've just discovered, and am now learning, DCS.

I sure hope MTH stays in business in some way, shape and form. Arnold

Who knows?  Meanwhile, whatever floats your boat .  Worrying about the future means that if things turn out badly, you've suffered twice.  If things turn out well, you've made yourself miserable for nothing.  It's a no win.  If you are heavily involved in MTH, whether conventional or command, there's no problem with buying more stuff if you are not worried about parts or service, which are a question mark.  If you are worried about parts and service availability, buy stuff that's a bargain or made by some other company, or both. 

Luckily enough for me (in MY view based on MY opinion), I divested myself of all my 15 or so MTH locs 5-6 years ago.  I kept one only - but sold it 6 months ago.

I also had two Z-4000s for 12 years which I sold five years ago.  Have to be honest:  I greatly prefer the ZW-L now commanding the layout.

So, my "last MTH hurrah" has come and gone.  And, I'm very happy with my present situation with A LOT of Lionel and Atlas.

For the past ten years, I’ve been getting MTH locos almost exclusively.  Last year after hearing about Mike’s retirement, I got more MTH locos than any previous year.  I currently have 2 on preorder.

What steamer did you get Arnold?  If it has a trailing truck and it’s possible for the drawbar to touch it, you should insulate the exposed contacts on the drawbar.  There is a plastic insulator there, but it can rotate out of position.

All comments very interesting. Now I see there are 2 schools of thought:

One is to load up on MTH now, for those very happy with their products because tomorrow there may be a lot less;

The other is to unload MTH because tomorrow there may be much fewer MTH parts.

Bob, as I mentioned recently on another thread, I recently bought the Proto 3 Imperial B&O (President Washington) 4-6-2 Pacific Steamer:

And, I recently purchased a Proto 3 Imperial Long Island B-6 Steam Switcher, which should be on its way.

The Railking Imperial line of Proto 3 steamers is ideal for me and my layout because of the fine detail, excellent sounds and smoke, DCS features, and ability to negotiate 031 curves.

For those who are interested in getting more brand new MTH, some of our Forum Sponsors have some MTH product for sale, but my impression is that it's going fast. Our wonderful sponsors (all have been great for me to do business with) will appreciate your business and you are very likely to be a very satisfied customer purchasing from them. (If you buy from them, you are helping to stimulate our economy a little, LOL).

I love Landsteiners's attitude, which is not to worry about things like MTH's future.

To put a positive spin on this thread, which always pleases our fine moderators, I would love this thread to go in the direction of celebrating the MTH we already have, and are in the process of getting. That's what I shall focus on.

As I've said before, I love it all, particularly Postwar Lionel and modern MTH and Lionel, but at the moment, I feel great gratitude for MTH that I have and will soon get.

No question in my mind, that having a strong MTH for all these years made Lionel and the others better, and made many of us experience much joy and happiness. Arnold

@Arnold D. Cribari posted:

No question in my mind, that having a strong MTH for all these years made Lionel and the others better, and made many of us experience much joy and happiness. Arnold

@Arnold D. Cribari I completely agree with this sentiment!  It's the thing that makes me MOST sad about MTH closing!  (BTW... until 2020 I was exclusively MTH PS2).

What Landsteiner said about worrying +1!

I just received an MTH Railking PRR GP9, a model that was on my bucket list for a long time. This engine joined a fair number of other MTH engines as, like Bob, I’ve purchased MTH engines exclusively for about the past decade. I had no qualms buying the PRR GP despite knowing it was in MTH’s last catalog nor would I have any worries about purchasing additional MTH engines, either used or - NOS.

Curt

“And, I recently purchased a Proto 3 Imperial Long Island B-6 Steam Switcher, which should be on its way.”

Arnold, you’re going to love that little switcher. I purchased the same PS3 Long Island in 2019 (NOS) from my local dealer and I find myself compelled to run it almost every session. It’s a real hoot. The mth imperial railking scale line was the best value for the money in ogauge, in my opinion. So sad to see it go.

@Bryant Dunivan 111417 posted:

Interesting you say get as much.  I will cull my MTH locomotives and increase my Lionel steam.  I am keeping my 18” passenger cars.  They should endure electronics and parts wise.  Just my thoughts.  I also dislike the drawbar arrangement on MTH steam.

Totally agree re your drawbar comment.

Pat

I have a large collection of both Lionel and MTH engines. In recent years, I had cut back on my purchases of MTH engines, as I found that they had a significantly higher percentage of problems than my Lionel engines. For example, the drawbar/disconnecting tether issue on their steam engines was a significant problem for me that was never resolved by MTH. I also have a number of MTH first generation diesel sets and never liked the cumbersome and ugly connectors that were used by MTH on their F3s and F7s. That said, after MTH announced they were closing, I purchased two MTH Maine Central Powered F3s and an MTH GG-1 from their recent catalogs. I also have several sets of MTH Premier passenger cars, which are terrific, and I may purchase a couple of more sets. Almost all of my freight cars are Lionel, Atlas, Weaver and K-Line. I purchased very few MTH freight cars over the years, other than several cabooses.

Pat

This brand new MTH RailKing Scale Washington Terminal RS1 ( just received late last week ) is probably my last new, from the factory, MTH hurrah!  IF money were not an object, there would be numerous brand new MTH hurrahs!! LOL!  

Over the years I've purchased many MTH locomotives ( some Premier and many RailKing)  brand new from the factory and some pre-owned MTH locos as well.  I've also purchased a fair amount of MTH Premier rolling stock over the years.   Although I own locos and rolling stock from Lionel, K-line, Weaver, and Williams,  MTH seems to dominate my roster.   I'll continue to purchase MTH products on the "pre-owned market" after MTH is no more.  IMHO MTH is/was the "best bang for the buck"!  I along with thousands of others am HUGLEY grateful for their overall contribution to our hobby and will greatly miss the MTH presence once the company is no more.  After May 31, 2021 the MTH silence will be deafening.  

As a two rail guy, I will miss the 2 rail offerings from MTH.

FYI, MTH announced a final run of RailKing RS-3 diesels to be released this summer. Check the MTH website for the roster. I have ordered the Northern Pacific version.

I must agree Pat', MTH is the best for the buck.  I'm very happy with ny MTH Roster overall. I only have one PS-1 engine that locks up in neutral.  The rest are fine, no problems at all. 

I think the best comment for the good of the hobby, was with MTH in business, it improved the product from everyone else.     It there is only one big manufacturer, they may not feel as obligated to improve quality, design and product offerings

@Arnold D. Cribari posted:

With the likelihood of MTH, which I've never before admired more than now (fear of loss?), soon going out of business, is now the time to get as much MTH as one can?

I confess that this is the way I feel, and I have recently acted on those feelings big time (at least for me).

How about you?

Arnold

Sort of the opposite. First of all, there's so much Lionel stuff of great variety from the past number of years sitting on the "want list," all reasonable funds are already spoken for. More than that, with parts availability and support disappearing along with MTH, heavy investment in MTH engines seems risky. Noone wants a $500 - $1000 engine, or whatever, permanently sidelined because some part is unobtainable. Could be a lot of MTH shelf queens sitting around in the coming years.

On the other hand, as with many things, it's a risk-reward thing. If a person really likes a certain MTH engine, and will enjoy it for a period of years (hopefully), then the purchase is certainly worthwhile for them. I just took delivery of an MTH engine that's in that category, but there won't be many more, if any.

I will miss MTH because my experience with the Proto 2 and 3 Locos has been very good.I have had no problems with the new style drawbars,never cared for the diesel teather connectors.

Last Hurrah for MTH?

No, maybe in name only. Already have a new list.

"All comments very interesting. Now I see there are 2 schools of thought:

One is to load up on MTH now, for those very happy with their products because tomorrow there may be a lot less;

The other is to unload MTH because tomorrow there may be much fewer MTH parts."

Arnold, I'm doing neither of these. I'm going to keep what MTH equipment I have--which isn't much compared to most of you here--because I love it, but I'm going to wait and see what the future of MTH is, if there is an MTH, before I buy anything new.  As for used MTH items, I'd love to find a set of the Boston & Maine wood-sided passenger cars. Mike Wolf has done a fantastic job with his company, and has kept the competition on its toes, and I wish him all the best in his well-deserved retirement.

John

I'm not worried either way in the least.  I have more then enough trains than one could ever hope for.  I've purchased trains based on the models I enjoy without regard for the manufacturer.  I have plenty of MTH and have plans to upgrade some of it, sell some of it, and keep some it just the way it is.

It is hard not to worry about the future in uncertain times, but with trains I do not worry at all.  Some of my favorite pieces are 2 rail kits and models from the 1950's, some are modern, some are in-between.  That's how I keep it a hobby.  My IMP / All Nation Camelback with fairly accurate passenger car kits finally, and a correct NE style CNJ brass caboose from IMP all from the 1950's will give me years of enjoyment.  Straight DC, easy to work on and operate, and good scale fidelity.  That is train heaven for me personally.

This is my HO childhood coming back.  An MRC handheld brass top throttle pack in my hand just running trains.  How I miss the simplicity of those days.

@GG1 4877 posted:

....  I have more then enough trains than one could ever hope for.  I've purchased trains based on the models I enjoy without regard for the manufacturer.  I have plenty of MTH ...

Jonathan,

That comment also applies to me, although I continue to buy some new models that represent my railroads of interest. But I have had a better experience and bought more from MTH than any other brand. The upside if MTH ceases production is that I shall spend less on trains. The downside is that I like to get a new engine or car every so often.

MELGAR

My preference is GGD / Sunset / 3rd Rail and Scott isn't going anywhere anytime soon.  Most accurate models in the mass production realm and we sweat the details.  The process of doing a 3rd Rail project stresses me out, but the end product is so relieving at that end.  I have more of that than anything else.  However, even a surprise second hand piece is new to me.  

@Strap Hanger posted:

“And, I recently purchased a Proto 3 Imperial Long Island B-6 Steam Switcher, which should be on its way.”

Arnold, you’re going to love that little switcher. I purchased the same PS3 Long Island in 2019 (NOS) from my local dealer and I find myself compelled to run it almost every session. It’s a real hoot. The mth imperial railking scale line was the best value for the money in ogauge, in my opinion. So sad to see it go.

Thanks Straphanger. By the way, I love your layout with the subway running  "underground." If I ever started over from scratch, I would try to build a layout with a subway on the lower level. Very cool. Arnold

@GG1 4877 posted:

My preference is GGD / Sunset / 3rd Rail and Scott isn't going anywhere anytime soon.

I will be looking to Sunset/3rd Rail for new offerings that I like and are affordable. Waiting for a GP-7 and an F-3.

MELGAR

I have some MTH Subway sets that I had wanted for years. They run great and are a lot of fun, especially my R-17 Redbirds.

It took Lionel too many years to come out with a subway set, and at twice the cost of MTH.

I'm keeping 'em!

I keep hearing how MTH locomotives will be shelf queens if the PS2/PS3 board dies. If that happens, and replacement boards are no longer available, you can install a bridge rectifier, a conventional reverse unit, or TMCC. No reason for a shelf queen because of something easily repaired like a board issue.

IMO, there is a reasonable good chance that our MTH will go up in value over the years.

Won't matter to me because I ain't selling any of mine. LOL.

No one know about MTH except Mike Wolf so why worry about it. It will give you ulcers and gray hair. As for me I am big into MTH and will continue to be with future purchases.

Arnold,

MTH brought me into 3 rail O gauge.

As a NEW HAVEN collector where would I be without MTH?

Four DL 109s; 3 EP-3s; 1 Ef3b; 3 44 toners; 3 Alco S-2s; F3 A-B-B-A; Alco FA A-B-A; Alco PA A-B-A.

I won’t be selling mine either!

The draw bar on the mth proto 3 is terrible. Out of 4 engines .I had problems with 3. I have one left . A 4-4-0 railking that I ran twice and it will not move ,make a sound or anything. I took the whole thing apart and can't see anything that is wrong. I would never buy any proto 3's again. I have alot of proto 1's and a few proto 2 and I have no problems with any of them. Only lionel , third rail, or williams brass for me in the future. John

@Arnold D. Cribari posted:

Thanks Straphanger. By the way, I love your layout with the subway running  "underground." If I ever started over from scratch, I would try to build a layout with a subway on the lower level. Very cool. Arnold

Love your layout as well, particularly the baseball stadiums. When I started my layout, my mainline was all o-31 curves like yours. I built the under layout subway afterwards when I bought my first subway. Don’t hold yourself back from doing the same. Also, now that you have the imperial b-6 switcher, you need to get the premier Long Island 44 tonner to go with it. It has the best sound of all the mth small switchers and is just as  fun to run on o-31 curve layouts like ours.  You can find it at blow out prices from many of the large retailers. Don’t hesitate to pull the trigger before they’re all gone. Trust me. You won’t regret it, particularly when you hear how good it sounds,

@Strap Hanger posted:

Love your layout as well, particularly the baseball stadiums. When I started my layout, my mainline was all o-31 curves like yours. I built the under layout subway afterwards when I bought my first subway. Don’t hold yourself back from doing the same. Also, now that you have the imperial b-6 switcher, you need to get the premier Long Island 44 tonner to go with it. It has the best sound of all the mth small switchers and is just as  fun to run on o-31 curve layouts like ours.  You can find it at blow out prices from many of the large retailers. Don’t hesitate to pull the trigger before they’re all gone. Trust me. You won’t regret it, particularly when you hear how good it sounds,

Thanks, Straphanger. I recently purchased the MTH Proto 3 NY Ontario and Western 44 Ton Center Cab Diesel and have just started running it on DCS:

The over-arching theme of my layout is to make it reminiscent of The Put, which had a 44 tonner with a yellow and white livery that looked a little like my Proto 3 model. Arnold

I think (sometimes I do) that Mr. Mike Wolf is not going anywhere soon, so no playing of taps yet.  I think someone will make him an offer he can't refuse for the balance of his holdings in MTH.

@Arnold D. Cribari posted:

IMO, there is a reasonable good chance that our MTH will go up in value over the years.

Yeah, right, probably just like K-Line stuff. 

The advantage with K-Line is that it's compatable with an existing and supported operating system (TMCC/Legacy). MTH, of course, isn't with its DCS, and if there are problems with or unavailability of DCS equipment in the future, the engines won't have much value. Hopefully whatever survives of MTH will include (as has been reported somewhere) parts and support for the DCS system, at least, assuming a company can survive on only that. It'll be interesting to see what happens.

I predict there will be products that go up in value, but also that there will be many products that will go down in value .