Bought a 1964 773 Hudson and noticed it does not go very fast. Is that the nature of the design? Noticed the operating instructions with cars may need up to 20 volts. ZW transformer at 20 volts no danger of locomotive leaving the track. I have other Lionel era Hudson"s (783,784,785 etc some run faster than others same condition. All greased and oiled not to excess. Your thoughts.
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Yes, they are geared slower, (more scale speed) than other smaller postwar steam engines. As the motor and axle bearings get broke in, it will start running a bit faster.
The lower gearing is one of the many appealing things about the 773 and other 700E-based 1:48 Hudsons. They were not based on toy locomotive DNA.
A well-broken in 700E-type Hudson can be a very nice, smooth, even slow-ish, runner. Not can-motor/cruise smooth, but the more you run them, the better they get.
I totally agree that the low gearing of the 773 is a big plus. It enables this premium Postwar steamer to run at prototypically slow speed hauling a substantial load (such as a long freight train), or, if one is in the mood for a fast passenger train, just give it plenty of voltage and amps.
In the video below, my 1965 version of the 773 is flying around my 031 curves pulling 3 Madison heavyweight NY Central passenger cars with the transformer throttle set at about 15 volts and 3 amps:
Love the puffs of smoke from the old fashioned smoke pellets generated at this high voltage and amps.
This locomotive is, by far, my #1 Postwar steamer.
I hope sometime tomorrow to post a video of this 773 hauling a long freight consist at prototypically slow speed. Arnold
What a great video!!!! Yankee Stadium with Mickey Mantle, Roger Marris, Yogi Berra, Whitney Ford, etc. My favorite team in childhood and teenage years and a Lionel Train going by Yankee Stadium. Thanks for your little world in paradise when things were simple.
On my simple layout 12x16 with 096 and 072 curves I watch my Postwar 675, 726 and 736 when they go fast with the little wheels like beating it self to death with different gearing. So I slow them down and to be easy on them. Then I watch the 773 the 1965 version going so graceful and slow with the big wheels and the big puffs of smoke almost puts me in a dream world 60 years ago. I can run it at 20 volts and never worry about it jumping the tracks on 096 curves.
Also who makes the smoke pellets for the postwar Lionel locomotives now? I am getting low on my Lionel ones.
To the original poster: Your 773 is working as designed. The slower speed is a GOOD thing! Tables at train shows are littered with too-fast trains of all vintages, with no really good way to improve their operation. If you want a faster Hudson, I'll gladly trade you my 2046 or a Williams reproduction straight across ;-)
My experience with the 783, is that despite having a "large stack" motor, it runs like its postwar predecessor. I..e, it takes a LOT of voltage to get moving, and has a fairly muted top speed. After that initial offering, MPC messed with the motor: they changed the bearings, perhaps the windings too. The result is that my grey 785 definitely runs faster at a lower voltage. It also seems to slow down more on curves and grades, which is NOT a good thing!
Enjoy your new train. I wish that Lionel had made a traditionally-sized steam loco with the smooth performance of the 773!
The 773/700E Hudsons were amazing accomplishments for Lionel. No doubt about it. They have a majestic stance to them. Deepest respect for the Lionel 773/700E series Hudsons.
Oddly, I find myself drawn to the postwar non-scale steam offerings of Lionel? I don't know why, but I tend to like their fore-shortened and chunkier lines. This includes their "Baby Hudson" (Berk body on a 4-6-4 frame) and the Baldwin "ATSF" Hudson. However, my all time favorite "non scale" Lionel steam engine is the Berkshire, hands down. I think Lionel hit it out of the ball park on the Berk. Burly, good proportions, great runner.
However, to me the 773/700E's are the aristocrats of the Lionel pre/post war steam offerings.
Andre
The prewar 763 is also geared for slow speeds. I'd say my 763 is a smoother runner than my 773 but very similar as far as speed goes. I can't comment on the 783 but like others have said, I've heard some aspects of it got tweaked.
@Ted S posted:To the original poster: Your 773 is working as designed. The slower speed is a GOOD thing! Tables at train shows are littered with too-fast trains of all vintages, with no really good way to improve their operation. If you want a faster Hudson, I'll gladly trade you my 2046 or a Williams reproduction straight across ;-)
My experience with the 783, is that despite having a "large stack" motor, it runs like its postwar predecessor. I..e, it takes a LOT of voltage to get moving, and has a fairly muted top speed. After that initial offering, MPC messed with the motor: they changed the bearings, perhaps the windings too. The result is that my grey 785 definitely runs faster at a lower voltage. It also seems to slow down more on curves and grades, which is NOT a good thing!
Enjoy your new train. I wish that Lionel had made a traditionally-sized steam loco with the smooth performance of the 773!
Ted, the most obvious reason you 785 is easier to get moving vs. 783, 773, etc, is the magnetraction, ……the engines with the solid steel wheels have to overcome that drag made by the magnetic field……I’ve taken 783’s etc, for customers, and beat the magnet out, and they think I’ve performed some kind of miracle,……nope, no miracle here, I just released your brakes!…..😉
Pat
Did you get all the magnets, there are usually 3 or 4.
The majestic 773 at prototypically slow speed hauling northeastern boxcars:
Arnold
@harmonyards posted:Ted, the most obvious reason you 785 is easier to get moving vs. 783, 773, etc, is the magnetraction, ……the engines with the solid steel wheels have to overcome that drag made by the magnetic field……I’ve taken 783’s etc, for customers, and beat the magnet out, and they think I’ve performed some kind of miracle,……nope, no miracle here, I just released your brakes!…..😉
Pat
The 785 also has 2 thrust bearings in the motor for smoother starts. Lionel only put 1 in the 783 and there were complaints about binding. My 785 took hours of running to break in but it is quite smooth now.
If a 783 takes a lot of power, it needs tuning. I did put in a double thrust bearing motor also. There were a few "quality" problems during assembly with the 783. My 783 at 18V max speed can derail from a O36 curve. This is after tuning. For fun I compared the power use of various Lionel postwar engines, including a 1950 773. If your engine is in good condition, it should run well.
With the magnetraction, some of the 783 had the 2 rear magnets by the rear wheels rubbing on the wheels. They are supposed to be close, but not rubbing. Another assembly problem that may need to be corrected.
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