Scale Strasburg Products from Lionel

Where does PRR 1361 reside these days?   

@artfull dodger 1361 is owned by the Railroaders Memorial Museum in Altoona, Pa. There's a lot of drama and complications surrounding the restoration that I won't go too in depth on. To summarize recent news, a group of accredited preservationist (including Bennett Levin) took control of the restoration as of 2018. They are planning for the construction of a new welded boiler to avoid the FRA compliance issues of the original boiler. Other than that announcement in May 2018, there hasn't been much communication to the public about the restoration. A small group of volunteers are working on cleaning/fixing small appliances. The tender has also been sand-blasted and primed. Personally, I wish that the group could provide more consistent updates like the group restoring Santa Fe 2926. 

1361 does not have any connections to Strasburg other than their machine shop doing contract work on it's wheels awhile back. I was happy to answer your question, but want to keep this thread centered on the topic of Lionel's scale Strasburg product tease from the 'Virtual York' event. There are defiantly more people interested in 1361 who might enjoy a separate thread discussing it!

GW 90....now you are preaching to this choir of one!

I couldn't remember were she was "staying".  I know there has been way to much "drama" about stuff.  Should be interesting to see what big L has in mind for Strasburg relate stuff

@Prr7688 posted:

I know they have the tooling for CN moguls so maybe a legacy CN 89 in Strasburg livery. If so, I'm hoping they offer more than just that.

Apparently, you didn't get the word on the Legacy Moguls.  I suspect you don't want one of them unless they fix the issues from the last fiasco!

I have the MTH Strasburg 4-4-0 to pull my Woodside coaches, but I'd love to see Lionel or MTH make the #90 and #475, I'd buy one in a heartbeat!

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

Apparently, you didn't get the word on the Legacy Moguls.  I suspect you don't want one of them unless they fix the issues from the last fiasco!

I have the MTH Strasburg 4-4-0 to pull my Woodside coaches, but I'd love to see Lionel or MTH make the #90 and #475, I'd buy one in a heartbeat!

Haha, I have heard the rumors about the moguls but always like to pretend there won't be issues with anything I purchase in the future!

I was never really sold on the MTH 4-4-0, I'm not a 'rivet counter' per say but do like things to be more or less prototypical. If my memory is correct, the 4-4-0 was painted to resemble Wilmington and Western 98 when it was owned by Strasburg in the early 1960s (It made it to the property but never operated there). Being born in the late 90s, the only engines with the Strasburg road name that I'd be interested in purchasing are ones that I have actually seen operate there. I would also be interested in a PRR 1223 or 7002 because they would go with the other Pennsylvania rolling stock that I have (and they look amazing with the pin-striped tenders and cabs). 

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

...I'd love to see Lionel or MTH make the #90 and #475, I'd buy one in a heartbeat!

I'll double up on that in case they're watching!

@Prr7688 posted:

I was never really sold on the MTH 4-4-0, I'm not a 'rivet counter' per say but do like things to be more or less prototypical. If my memory is correct, the 4-4-0 was painted to resemble Wilmington and Western 98 when it was owned by Strasburg in the early 1960s (It made it to the property but never operated there).

I can't disagree, but I can't get any of those more prototypical choices right now.

Too bad the Lionel Strasburg #89 offered in the 2011 Signature catalog was not avilable with Legacy. Definately would have bought one if it was Legacy.

http://www.lionel.com/products...comotive-89-6-11268/

I know someone on Facebook who works for the Strasburg Railroad and he told me that Lionel was there last year getting all sorts of information about the #90. Seems to me a scale brass hybrid version of the #90 may be what Ryan was referring to!

I hope they don't make one priced out of the ballpark...

@N&WGuy posted:

I know someone on Facebook who works for the Strasburg Railroad and he told me that Lionel was there last year getting all sorts of information about the #90. Seems to me a scale brass hybrid version of the #90 may be what Ryan was referring to!

That would be awesome! I've always been confused by the term brass-hybrid: does this mean it would be unpainted or they would offer a 'pilot' version' as well as painted versions of that?  I wonder if it would be released as a visionline or legacy product? (If visionline then what would be the 'vision' feature?) The reason I wonder about that is because it seems most Lionel hybrid brass have been visionline(?) 

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

I hope they don't make one priced out of the ballpark...

Agreed! I supposed they could use the tooling to produce Decapods in other roadnames to try to keep the price down. This way they could sell more 'engines' from the same tooling. In that case, sales from the Strasburg version won't be the only money going towards paying off the tooling which would allow for them to sell it at a lower price. Hopefully this won't be a visionline as that would drive the price up. 

@Prr7688 posted:

I wonder if it would be released as a visionline or legacy product? (If visionline then what would be the 'vision' feature?) The reason I wonder about that is because it seems most Lionel hybrid brass have been visionline(?)

The only time there has been a brass hybrid vision model cataloged was the Southern Pacific 4-8-4 locomotives in the 2020 volume 1 catalog.

Brass hybrid means that only some of the locomotive is brass, this allows for the benefits and locomotive specific details of a fine brass model but with the smooth running characteristics and modern features of a die cast locomotive.

@SGP posted:

The only time there has been a brass hybrid vision model cataloged was the Southern Pacific 4-8-4 locomotives in the 2020 volume 1 catalog.

Brass hybrid means that only some of the locomotive is brass, this allows for the benefits and locomotive specific details of a fine brass model but with the smooth running characteristics and modern features of a die cast locomotive.

So lionel offers brass hybrids that are painted in addition to the pilot versions of the locomotives? 

Sure, the pilot version is just one variation.  Personally, I have no use for the pilot versions, so if that's all they offer, they missed for sure a potential customer.

Two roadnames Lionel could prototypically put on #90 are Strasburg and Great Western.  If they offer a GW l will be standing in line with a fist full of dollars like a kid at an ice cream truck!

Personally, I think that the strasburg models would not sell well when there is a $1400 price tag on them. There is a small percentage here that will buy them, but I doubt that the gift shop will retail them or the general public buy a item of such.

@Prr7688 posted:

Agreed! I supposed they could use the tooling to produce Decapods in other roadnames to try to keep the price down. This way they could sell more 'engines' from the same tooling. In that case, sales from the Strasburg version won't be the only money going towards paying off the tooling which would allow for them to sell it at a lower price. Hopefully this won't be a visionline as that would drive the price up. 

I had this thought too some years ago when the Decapod first came out from MTH.  But they are very different and would still cost over $1,000.  Not sure I feel the same way today.

Ron

If you guys can get enough people emailing 3rd Rail, you can probably get the M’s built again. I remember in The past that it was how some of the locos we’re done

It's possible that Ryan was referring to this Scale Strasburg engine:

Now being offered by the TCA is a Scale LEGACY equipped Strasburg Railroad GP7.  This scale sized and detailed GP7 features all standard LEGACY features such as Bluetooth, dual motors, smoke unit, sounds system, etc.  You can find more info on the TCA online store:

https://traincollectors.org/store/ListProducts.aspx

Stu

@NOT LionelLLC posted:

It's possible that Ryan was referring to this Scale Strasburg engine:

Now being offered by the TCA is a Scale LEGACY equipped Strasburg Railroad GP7.  This scale sized and detailed GP7 features all standard LEGACY features such as Bluetooth, dual motors, smoke unit, sounds system, etc.  You can find more info on the TCA online store:

https://traincollectors.org/store/ListProducts.aspx

Stu

 

 

I don't think that the Strasburg Rail Road even owns a GP7, let alone looking like that.

@Hot Water posted:

I don't think that the Strasburg Rail Road even owns a GP7, let alone looking like that.

The closest thing is that they leased a GP9 a few years back for freight service, however it retained the paint it arrived with and obviously wasn't a GP7.  I don't recall seeing any other diesels on the roster prior to the former NYC SW8 that they currently have, aside from the PRR 44 tonner that was retired some time ago.

Their roster of current and retired equipment is here:

https://www.strasburgrailroad....er-November-2018.pdf

@colorado hirailer posted:

Two roadnames Lionel could prototypically put on #90 are Strasburg and Great Western.  If they offer a GW l will be standing in line with a fist full of dollars like a kid at an ice cream truck!

I seem to recall that #90 is one of Baldwin's stock catalog 2-10-0 locomotives, so I'm sure there are at least a few other options aside from Great Western and Strasburg that would be plausible as well.

A Strasburg #90 is on my short list, any manufacturer's listening???

@SantaFe158 posted:

The closest thing is that they leased a GP9 a few years back for freight service, however it retained the paint it arrived with and obviously wasn't a GP7.  I don't recall seeing any other diesels on the roster prior to the former NYC SW8 that they currently have, aside from the PRR 44 tonner that was retired some time ago.

Their roster of current and retired equipment is here:

https://www.strasburgrailroad....er-November-2018.pdf

You're right, they leased Maine Eastern 764 in 2016 when their SW8 was down for repairs (maybe this is the inspiration for the number on the TCA offering?). They have obtained a SW9 since the roster was last updated but it has not been restored to operating condition yet; its ex-Santa Fe 1235. 

I know Atlas offered a SW8 lettered accurately for Strasburg 8618 a while back. MTH offers the GE 44 tonner in both Strasburg (33) and PRR (9331 and others). 

@SantaFe158 posted:

I seem to recall that #90 is one of Baldwin's stock catalog 2-10-0 locomotives, so I'm sure there are at least a few other options aside from Great Western and Strasburg that would be plausible as well.

Santa Fe inherited five BLW catalog 2-10-0's when they acquired the Kansas City, New Mexico and Orient, which became their 2565 class.

Alabama, Tennessee & Northern 401 at Age of Steam is a catalog 2-10-0, although with a smaller tender. 

Seaboard Air line also had some catalog 2-10-0's.

Gainesville Midland 2-10-0 208 is on display in Winder, Georgia. Sister 209 is on display in Gainesville.  Both are ex-SAL locomotives.

Rusty

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

A Strasburg #90 is on my short list, any manufacturer's listening???

Yeah, mine too. I recall Ryan mentioning it at one of the open houses a year or so ago. I also recall talking to him about that and other decapods in general as I had only ever known of a few. I believe I said besides 90 I would be curious to see what other Railroad's in the US had them as others were Russian that I knew of.

I was doing a little a little research, and Strasburg 90 is a Baldwin class 12-42F. This locomotive, with some variation, seems to have been used by Seaboard Air Line and the Alabama and Tennessee as well as others. A few are on static display today, and the photos all closely resemble #90. So both MTH and Lionel have several locomotives that they can model from this particular decapod mold. 

I would Buy a scale MTH #90 and #475 in seconds. 

@SGP posted:

The only time there has been a brass hybrid vision model cataloged was the Southern Pacific 4-8-4 locomotives in the 2020 volume 1 catalog.

Brass hybrid means that only some of the locomotive is brass, this allows for the benefits and locomotive specific details of a fine brass model but with the smooth running characteristics and modern features of a die cast locomotive.

Only the Gs1 locomotives are brass hybrids. Lionel already has die cast tooling for the other versions.

I believe the "brass hybrid" terminology refers to a brass boiler and tender shell as well as details mounted to an existing die cast chassis that Lionel already has tooling for.

The brass hybrid ATSF Mikado uses the same chassis as previous Legacy light and heavy mikados. The Brass hybrid GS1s will use the same die cast chassis as the other GS models.

The brass tender and locomotive "shells" allows Lionel to offer a unique locomotive without the heavy investment in new tooling to make it in die cast.

Lionel has never offered a small decapod like #90, so it would be entirely new tooling from the ground up. Whether or not the shell is brass depends on whats a better investment as it pertains to the chassis, and future decapod offerings.

What was the "Mogul Fiasco?"  

@Gregcz1 posted:

What was the "Mogul Fiasco?"  

Ok, I just got an email saying this was my 100th post and congratulations....where are the flowers.... balloons and cake???  Anybody???

LOL

@Gregcz1 posted:

What was the "Mogul Fiasco?"  

You might try the OGR Search function for all the threads on that Lionel "fiasco", concerning the 2-6-0 mogul models.

@Carl Peduzzi posted:

I was doing a little a little research, and Strasburg 90 is a Baldwin class 12-42F. This locomotive, with some variation, seems to have been used by Seaboard Air Line and the Alabama and Tennessee as well as others. A few are on static display today, and the photos all closely resemble #90. So both MTH and Lionel have several locomotives that they can model from this particular decapod mold. 

I found a little more about 90 on another (older) thread: https://ogrforum.com/...44#56475281999863444 

To paraphrase, it says 90 was one of 22 light Baldwin decapods (class 12-42F) built between 1924 and 1933. It does not list the purchasers of all 22 but says that at least 2 went to the Georgia, Florida & Alabama RR. 

The Mogul "fiasco" had nothing to do with the design. It had to do with Lionel's response to the issue. They left out a miniscule bushing in the siderods. Replacing the bushing allows it to run as well as their TMCC predecessors. 

Lionel could do very credible #89. They could use the cylinders from the Harriman 2-8-0s and replace the tender. The final touch would be to straighten the left side walkway and replace the compound air pump with a single stage. Unlikely they would do the last point though but who knows. 

Pete

@Hot Water posted:

You might try the OGR Search function for all the threads on that Lionel "fiasco", concerning the 2-6-0 mogul models.

Since someone was using the term "fiasco" loosely, I didn't think that would be the best word to do a search as it may have been called by another name...or not have one at all.

Tibit time:

Strasburg modified #90 by removing the second sand dome located between the steam dome and the cab. 

Strasburg also removed the smokebox extension, which was needed because of the low grade coal the Great Western used.

Rusty

The Age of Steam Roundhouse crew shared this writeup about the 2-10-0 in their collection.  They also briefly discussed some of the history of 2-10-0s in general.

https://www.ageofsteamroundhou...aKZhse5FhRoCQqd3qdPA

@Rusty Traque posted:

Tibit time:

Strasburg modified #90 by removing the second sand dome located between the steam dome and the cab. 

Strasburg also removed the smokebox extension, which was needed because of the low grade coal the Great Western used.

Rusty

Yeah, I don’t see MTH or even Lionel modifying a mold to be that accurate. And at them moment, as I am not as strict as some with accuracy, I would just be happy with a #90 that is even 80-85% accurate and comes pretty close to being scale. Some will disagree with me, but I am looking at something really close is better then nothing.