Lionel Traditional vs O-Scale

Reply to a really old post, that is not really a reply,

my question is can a newbie tell if Lionel Car is traditional, or scale or standard o by the numbers?  

I posed a similar question here last Fall.

I had been looking at a Lionel PRR E-6 model# 6-28005, from 1999, which was (and still is) listed by Lionel as "traditional scale": I assumed that meant more along the lines of "027"-size. As it turns out, this particular model is full size O scale 1:48. So I guess you can't always tell in advance, even by Lionel's own literature...which makes no sense to me.

BTW, it's a great engine! 

Mark in Oregon

CATDADDY,

The short answer to your question is NO, product / box numbers do not distinguish traditional, scale, or Standard O rolling stock from each other in Lionel products.  For other manufacturers, the story is somewhat different.  With MTH, for example, any product numbered 20-xxxxx is probably going to be scale sized, but not necessarily scale accurate.  Further, MTH rolling stock products numbered 30-xxxxx were originally equating to Lionel traditional size equipment, but then MTH started adding "scale" sized product to that line as well.  Old K-line products had a numbering system that was supposed to distinguish between traditional and "scale" size, but I don't know how well that distinction was maintained.  For purposes of this discussion, Atlas makes, I believe, only O scale sized equipment, but they maintain a numbering system that distinguishes between 2-rail and 3-rail equipment.  3rd Rail also makes O scale sized equipment that runs on both 2-rail and 3-rail track, but I don't know if their product numbering system reflects that difference.

Even those manufacturers that specialize in O scale sized equipment, as opposed to traditional or standard O, don't necessarily produce a true scale product because of the compromises required to run their equipment on both 2-rail and 3-rail track.  Bottom line, only way to truly determine scale accuracy is to obtain product dimensions important to you and compare to prototype.  For a lot of us, close is good enough.

Hope this helps a little.

Chuck

Yes it does, I have been buying things I like and I notice the different size cars. Behind the right sized locomotive things look right, a different combination draws attention to the gauge/scale visual differences.  As this old cat has started into the hobby with lionchief products, there even seems to be some differences there. 

I am having fun figuring it all out and this forum is great.

Not only is the traditional (PW) F3 less than scale height and slightly less than scale width but so are the extruded aluminum passenger cars that go with it so beautifully, enough so that pairing a Santa Fe GP7 (scale width and height as well as scale hood width) with a consist of extruded aluminum cars a la the Grand Canyon train is a glaring mismatch to me.

The train that ran from Williams Junction to Grand Canyon and return. Can't do it using Lionel equipment.

Lew

PRR1950 posted:

CATDADDY, ...snip...  Atlas makes, I believe, only O scale sized equipment, but they maintain a numbering system that distinguishes between 2-rail and 3-rail equipment. ...snip...

Atlas' Industrial Rail (do they still offer it?) seems to be somewhat smaller than true scale, at least the trolley seemed to be.

I believe the entirety of Industrial Rail's product line is of traditional 'undersized' dimensions. Certainly their ore cars, most likely the log cars, and definitely their cabooses.

The tank cars could be a question mark, even though not intended to be scale-dimensioned models any moreso than the rest of the line, the prototypes they are based upon came in a variety of sizes that could make them a close match sizewise, as are the postwar Lionel cars they doubtlessly are copies of.

---PCJ