list of 2- vs 4- chuff locos

If you listen to a real steam loco running at high speeds, you don't really hear individual chuffs.

Edit:  Based on discussion below, I withdraw this statement.  I leave it posted so HW's & Webmaster's comments below are in context.

RJR posted:

If you listen to a real steam loco running at high speeds, you don't really hear individual chuffs.

Really?????      I guess it depends on what you consider "high speeds", because both SP 4449 and UP 844, with their 80 inch diameter drive wheels, still exhibit quite distinctive exhaust "clicks" at over 80 MPH.

"clicks?"

RJR posted:

"clicks?"

Yes. When the valve gear is properly "hooked up" with the correct throttle setting, the exhaust sounds blend into VERY sharp "clicks" at speeds over 80 MPH.

Garrett, why not check with Gunny John, as he is doing some new stuff with how he picks up the chuff sequence, and from what I've read, he does it off one of the main drive wheels. I believe that most pick ups come off one of the tender wheels, but I may not be right with that. A couple of my smaller engines with adj to 4 chuffs sounds like a machine gun ratcheting!........................Just Sayin..............................Brandy!

We could start compiling a list.  I think this is correct for what I know (or not know).

1) All Lionel TMCC pre-RS5 engines are two chuffs.

2) Early Lionel TMCC RS5 engines are 2 chuffs; late are 4 chuffs.  I know my PRR Y3, and early RS5 engines, is two chuffs.

3) Other manufacturer engines with TMCC, such as Atlas, 3rd Rail, and Weaver, varied in number of chuffs.  Like Lionel, early ones had 2 chuffs but recent ones are 4 chuffs; some have a switch for 2 or 4 chuffs.  This is where a list would be handy.

4) LionChief Plus engines are two chuffs.

5) All PS-2 and PS-3 engines are multi-chuff, so you can have 1, 2, 4, 6 chuffs maybe 8.  Need to check my DCS remote.

6) I think a lot of Lionel pre-TMCC engines are 1 chuff.

Except for LionChief products, if you have a TMCC 2 chuff engine and want 4 chuffs, there are folks on this forum that can upgrade it for you.  I've had gunrunnerjohn and Alex_M upgrade all my older engines to 4 chuff. 

Anyone else want to add (or correct).

By my calcs, that's about 22.4 chuffs per second at 80 mph with 80" drivers.  In some ways you're right, HW:  a V-8 auto engine, 4-cycle, idling at 600 RPM makes about 40 "clicks" per second, and if you listen at the end of the exhaust pipe, you can to some extent still hear the individual clicks.

RJR posted:

By my calcs, that's about 22.4 chuffs per second at 80 mph with 80" drivers.  In some ways you're right, HW: 

Thanks.  I've listened to that sound thousands and thousands of times, over the last 40 years. 

a V-8 auto engine, 4-cycle, idling at 600 RPM makes about 40 "clicks" per second, and if you listen at the end of the exhaust pipe, you can to some extent still hear the individual clicks.

My current solution for chuff generation is this small tach sensor board for installation on the motor.  It has a simple calibration that will allow you to pick any chuff rate you like, and if you are not happy with the sound, just rerun the calibration and pick a different rate.  They'll be available in a few weeks, they're in production now.

gunrunnerjohn posted:

My current solution for chuff generation is this small tach sensor board for installation on the motor.  It has a simple calibration that will allow you to pick any chuff rate you like, and if you are not happy with the sound, just rerun the calibration and pick a different rate.  They'll be available in a few weeks, they're in production now.

Will this work with the odyssey one speed control?

Gunny, that looks and sounds better than the other pick up that you were working with on the wheels, and like you say, a person can tune it to their ear of choice!............Thanks for showing us your latest invention. Better be careful or you might end up like Mike Regan, and working for the "Big Company"....

How will this work with the "Super Chuffer/Light Control"....... I've never installed the one I got from you very early on, and my Pennsy 2-10-4 is a 2 chuffs per. I didn't like the idea of magnets, or your light set up, off the wheels.

Your latest invention with the tach strip on the flywheel, seems the best of the best, or at least would give a minimal amount of problems.

Like you say Gunny, there is no job easier than the one I think that Gunny can do!...................................  

RJR posted:

If you listen to a real steam loco running at high speeds, you don't really hear individual chuffs.

Really?  Here's NKP 765 at 70 mph.

Turn up your volume and just listen to this! After the whistle stops blowing at the beginning of the clip, you'll hear that classic, rapid-fire, Baker-timed machine gun firing!

If you cannot hear individual exhausts like this, even at high speed, the engineer doesn't have her hooked up right. In other words, if she sounds like a jet engine with just a steady roar at the stack, that's not good.

Thanks, Rich.  Certainly can hear the chuffs.  Maybe your last sentence is the reason I recall otherwise from years past.  Within the last year or so, I saw/heard a video of the Challenger running and it did seem like a steady roar.

On the same subject, quite a few years ago I rode the East Broad Top, and was disappointed not to hear any chugging at all even though I was right behind the tender.  I attributed it to an engine designed to pull limestone-loaded trains having just 2 cars to pull. The video of 765 showed it pulling quite a load.

Both Hot Water and Webmaster have made reference to the engineer's actions.  Proper settings would make a good educational subject for another thread.

MDuppy posted:

Will this work with the odyssey one speed control?

Certainly, the picture you see is the Chuff Generator installed on an Odyssey I locomotive!   It doesn't interfere in any way with the Odyssey I speed control.

Brandy posted:

How will this work with the "Super Chuffer/Light Control"....... I've never installed the one I got from you very early on, and my Pennsy 2-10-4 is a 2 chuffs per. I didn't like the idea of magnets, or your light set up, off the wheels.

 

I never really liked fooling around with the wheels either.  I thought about this for some time, finally decided to just make one and be done with it.  It's specifically designed to work with the Super-Chuffer, so that's not an issue at all.  This simply replaces the existing chuff switch and gives you a programmable chuff pulse tied to the motor revs.  It also adds an optional ground light output that you can wire up to control ground lights, they turn off around 10 scale MPH, and come on when going slower or stopped.

If you have a model they are easy to hear.  After buying Legacy steam, you become aware of the TMCC with two chuffs.  Lionel did a few TMCC with 4 chuffs.  These were the last done.  I have the Hiawathe 4-4-2 TMCC with 4 chuffs.

Legacy has 4 chuffs.  I would listen to Rich.  Always go with a guy who has been there and done that.