Menards Boxcars (pics, video)

Thanks for the video, they look A-OK.

 

I guess it would be fair to say that Menards has captured the $20 boxcar market. Even RMT can't match that price.

 

  Bill T

Great review. I've been thinking about pulling the trigger on these. When buying 10 of these Menard's offers one heck of a deal.

Nice review Lee.....I think the size is scale but the X-29 prototype......which is small and steam era car. Thx

Thanks Lee, I've not seen a good "side by side". What a bargain

From what I can see, these cars might be the best value in the industry.

hello guys and gals........

 

Does this car come with stamped metal frame or is it plastic ? Do they have the "Santa Fe" road name ?

 

Tiffany

 

They have a stamped steel frame and diecast trucks. Have not seen any AT&SF yet.

Thanks Bill T...........

 

Tiffany

How long before someone complains about the "Built by Manards"?

I received the two I ordered today as well. The packaging threw me a bit, but then I never bought a train car for the box.  I am pretty much in agreement with Lee's review, a good value for the money. 

 

One thing I would like to add is that I tested mine on o31 curves.  What I really liked is that in the curves the ends of the cars were much closer than most other cars I own. They looked really good in the curves . The other interesting thing was that trucks make a different sound. It's kind of a metallic sing-song noise.  It sounds fine, just a little different.  Also they didn't pop open in tight curves with a moderate load behind them, something that can't be said about other inexpensive cars I've tried in the past. 

 

Again, overall a good value for the money. (although I could do without the big Menard's logo on both sides)

Hello guys and gals....

 

i just looked at menard's webpage and noticed the boxcar frame is stamped steel and has 

 a stamped steel beam very much like Williams boxcar frame so i am thinking Williams/

 Bachmann is making these cars for menards. Check the pictures closely to the Williams

 boxcars and compare to the menard's boxcars and the bodies too. Its not a bad thing 

 because they are offering them at much better pricing than Williams/Bachmann boxcars

 for the same thing.

 

 

 Tiffany

 

It's not prototypical, but the logo actually isn't really out of proportion to the other lettering. The boldness of the font just takes over the text area visually. It could have easily been much worse with an increase in point size.

 

 The logo, and prototypical built date use, should make any legal complaints pretty weak. But I kinda thought that too, just was not that funny till I read it.

I never even noticed the build dates till I was in my twenties, and didn't realize they were accurate till I noticed some MPC dates and realized a many cars were over ten years old, but "brand new" when I got them. So I at least like its build date is there right now   

A few months ago a poster with inside knowledge of Williams / Bachmann / Kader Industries { Bachmanns parent company } stated that the Menards boxcars are not manufactured by Kader Industries. If that is accurate then a Chinese company has cloned the Williams boxcars.

 

When Menards can have the boxcar manufactured and shipped from China then sell for $20 you have to ask why are other company's traditional type boxcars are priced for $40 to $70.

 

A photo comparison of a Williams boxcar ( AT&SF ) and a Menards boxcar ( NP ).

 

 

    Bill T

"When Menards can have the boxcar manufactured and shipped from China then sell for $20 you have to ask why are other company's traditional type boxcars are priced for $40 to $70."

 

Bill, I would suspect the reason for this is that Menards is not a devoted train company, with an entire vast product line from their own tooling and dies, without a dealer and distributor network, or a service department, and many of the other costs that companies like Lionel and MTH have.

 

I'm not saying I like it. I'm just saying they are two different scenarios. Although the hobby is fortunate to have someone at Menards who is a train fan, with deep enough pockets to have the ability to contract these products being made. And since Menards is a department store chain (from which they draw their revenue), their situation is different from Lionel, MTH, Weaver or RMT for example.

 

You can bet that the $50 list for a separate sale Lionel starter set car (with tooling long paid for and minimal assembly costs) are purposed, not over the actual cost of producing the car, but over Lionel's overall projected financial need for a particular financial year. Remember, Lionel has to also answer to their investor - as well as then the consumer.

 

The investment capital costs of consistently bringing out new product from totally new tooling - with the related engineering costs - is something Menards does not have, and gives them an advantage.

 

Though I am with you, in that when I buy a traditional Lionel starter car, I want to pay for the actual costs of that car, and not subsidize the costs of high end development and tooling.

 

The only thing I personally don't like about the Menards cars is the stickers for car numbers. I've seen photos where the stickers aren't even on straight, never mind being a different type face from the other data. On the other hand, I do like the painted door guides, like on the photo you show Bill. I notice the PRR Merchandise car in Lee's photos, the door guides are the typical black.

 

BUT, for the price Menards is charging, they certainly ARE a bargain when compared to other new traditionally sized products.

LOL! Not long I'll bet!    I may have to take another look at these. I thought they would be tiny.  You could put together a nice unit train for short money. 

I'd be willing to bet Menard's train stuff is considered a "loss leader," begin sold at or slightly above or below cost. 

 

It helps keep the Menard's brand out front (look how many people are constantly praising them here...), bring business to the stores and the trains are a drop in the bucket verses everything else they sell.

 

Rusty

I would not recommend trying to remove it: Given everything I decided to try to remove them.  Iso-alcohol has no effect (didn't expect it ).  Acetone and Goo-Gone (I'd recommend the later, not the former) will remove the print, if you use a very quick and light touch.  Here, you see I removed it with a Q-tip and Goo-Gone, I rubbed it lightly and it came off fast.  Then I dabbed it dry with a paper towel.

 

 

I thought it would be nice to post, instead, a photo of it half removed, so I did just half the other side and took this photo, too.

 

About five minutes later I went back to complete the job.  By then the GooGone residue had done its magic on the paint below (the entire car is painted brown - as you can see it is cast in some sort of neutral plastic color).  This is the result even when using a light touch. 

 

But back to this photo again.  I also neolubed the wheels and trucks and coupler on this same car.  Note it in comparison to the trucks and all on the right.  Looks far better . . .

 

Advertising, loss leader, "throw back" to early hardware "standards", fun leader...yep

 Brand, and store public perception is everything for these guys right now. They have been expanding across the country too. Id never heard of Menards till about 8 years ago while traveling, and I was in 5-6 stores. All great stores, a bit more old school lumber yard feel than a "modern big box hrdw" store. When closer to me, I'll likely be there most often, trains or not. I know they're closer to me. One is closer than the train shop now, so it wont be long till I at least visit again 

 What's the biggest old school, do it yourself group outside of the public Christmas crowd, that I can think of? Hot rodders, but they great specialty shops, so that would leave us, and boaters. I think boaters just want stainless/brass hardware, tape, varnish & paint brushes. And even if "they" don't all buy, its good brand perception, especially for the Christmas crowd.

 I would have loved to have been at the meeting when train cars got brought up .

Now how do we get a group of hands on people to visit our fine store, to help spread the word?

Um, I have an idea!

Regardless of how Menards is doing it, I will support them because: a) I try to buy from anyone wanting to get into the market, to encourage they, and b) they stuff is good value, particularly the buildings and these boxcars.

 

If you examine the cars carefully, and consider other factors: how they market them, how they package and ship them, you understand they have streamlined costs a lot.  The boxes, for example, have to be noticeably less costly than Lionel or MTHs, even RMTs.  

 

Are they making money?  Overall yes, and that is probably all that is important to Menard.

Some here are tired of me talking about this.....but I will anyway.

 

A few years ago I made a post that asked why folks in the model car hobby could produce a 1/24 scale police car model with more metal, more plastic, more parts,  more detail and more paint and tampo than a $80 O scale box car, and sell it for $10, .....why couldn't someone make a O scale box car for $20. 

I got beat up pretty well. But I stuck to my guns as I work with a manufacture that has product made in China. I knew it could be done.

 

I Thank Menard's for doing what I asked about. They found a way. It may be like Henry Ford and the Model T......pennies per car...but a profit.....knowing it would lead to bigger things. 

 

No matter the motive....we should all be thankful someone new is in town. Weather you buy it or not.

 

Photo I used in original post

 

So what's in store for "Spot the Boxcar"? A quick mend plate?

Lee......have you tried using a ultra fine sanding stick?? I have some that feel like smooth plastic.....I have removed tampo with them before. Thx

Hello Bill T.........

 

Good photos showing the differences between them .  I would like to buy one of those Menard boxcar but cannot decide which to pick LOL.

 

Tiffany

 

Tiffany

Well, I still like the two cars I purchased, however prior to this thread I didn't realize they were "clones" of another manufacturer's product.  I have an ethical dilemma with this.  One hand I certainly appreciate a good looking lower cost item, one the other hand however I have a big problem with wholesale taking of some one else's design and passing it off as your own product. Let's not forgot our Lionel/MTH history here.  

  It would be entirely acceptable to me if whoever makes the cars for Menards were making them with tooling acquired from Williams and marketing it as their own, however copying someone else's design with permission and compensation and then selling it as your own product line strikes me as theft of intellectual property.  I don't believe that the William's box car and frame design is open source info.  I work in an industrial field where I have to deal with imitation parts routinely, in some cases even being asked to provide warranty services on parts my company didn't sell and having to prove to the customer that it was not our parts.  Maybe this makes me more sensitive to this issue. 

  Unless I am missing something in this situation it seems to me that the similarities of the frame design are too obvious to ignore. I think it is a well made product but if it is an imitation of another manufacturers product, produced without permission, I will not be buying any more of them. 

  Note - I do not own any Williams boxcars myself so I did not recognize the similarities when examining the cars I purchased.

So what do you call Williams Golden Memories that have sold very well throughout the years?  I believe you can copy trains.  You just can't steal the blueprints and design information.  Nothing illegal here.  BigRail

I purchased one of the original lot of Menard's boxcars.  Pennsy.  I thought it compared favorably to a couple of RailKing boxcars I have.  Since I model steam era, the only diesel I own is a postwar 621 my daughter bought for me at a thrift store, the Menard's cars fit my roster like a glove.  I haven't bought any of the newest release, but plan to do so.

Yep, the Williams Golden Memories locos were cloned from Lionel Postwar locos. A lot of K-Lines traditional rolling stock were copies of Lionels traditional rolling stock. The boxcars from Industrial Rail were copies of Lionel and K-Line.

 

    Bill T

 

 

I have no doubt they are properly licensed and authorized.  Such business deals are common, and if done right everybody benefits: licenser, licensee, and customers.  It this case it appears to me this is what happened. .

To each his own on the removal of the manufacturer's name but the question occurred to me, do you also take off BLT BY LIONEL, too? The manufacturer's name looks better to me than a residual splotchy blob.

 

going out on a limb here...

I don't mind the Menards logo on the side, and I even like the date.

It is fun to look back on some of my PRR Lionel 18024 box cars & look at the date, remembering where & when I purchased them.

 

Thank You Menards...

I agree with Lee.  These Menards box cars have been on the market long enough that if there has been any illegal use of Williams’ intellectual property, I think Williams would have taken legal action by now and we would have heard about it.

 

The Other Bill T

I've been waiting for that to come up.

I only recently starting following Menards.  I did not know they previously made these boxcars.  If this has been going on for some time and is not a legal problem I am glad to hear it.  As I said, given all the problems I've seen in my professional life I take proprietary design more seriously than some others may do.  thank you for bringing me back to reality.  (Although if I am correct I reserve the right to post a separate topic with nothing more than "I told you so" in the header )

Last year I purchased a PRR boxcar from Menards.  I decided to buy three more.  They arrived yesterday.  I think they will look excellent on my ceiling level loop around the family room once I complete it next winter.  I like more detail on my normal view layout, but they can't be beat for the price.

 

 

Video

     Lets take the "MENARDS BOXCAR" apart and then take it for a ride.

Gary

Gary,

 

I thoroughly enjoyed your video - thanks for taking the time to make it! I see you have a YouTube channel and I will definitely have to check out more of your videos!

 

-Mark the Menards Train Guy

Lee,

   By any chance did you purchase the new Menards Military Box Car.  Do you have any close up pictures of her that you can post.  I want to order a couple, but want to see one close up 1st.

PCRR/Dave

Gary,

Yes, I agree with Mark the Menards Train Guy.  I have watched some of your other videos, but need to watch the rest.  Thanks for making them!

A while ago, I was told that Menards rolling stock is produced by Golden Wheel Die Cast, in China.  They have a very nice web site.