MTH 6 volt power supply issue

I have one of those in my hand, the resistors are for the middle jack to support LED's, the outside jack should still have 6V on it.  If not, drop me a line and I'll send you a working one for the cost of postage.

Thank you John, I see there is a spot on the board for another connector that is fed directly from the 6 volts, but it's not used here. I don't have the unit in front of me right now, but I will have to see if the current limiting resistors were moved to the wiring, as this one socket appears to feed both the incandescent and leds. I will probably take you up on your offer. I've already ordered some replacement mica for the heat sinking (old one fell apart). You can expect a DM from me soon.

Thank you again!

Bobby

2 75 ohm resistors in parallel when sourcing an LED like markers.  Otherwise a jumper installed to drive a 6V bulb.  Why out, who knows but looks like someone removed vice damage.  G

George, they're 150 ohm resistors in the one I just sent him.

Thanks gents. Looking closely at the unit this 6V board only powers the two 433 bulbs. The leds come off the ps3 board. You can see in my second pic where the trace for the regulator out pin had lifted off the board (heat I'm guessing) and there was some copper in between the ground and output pins. My attempts to scratch it clean are visible. It's such a simple circuit, yet so many problems. It's working again, but I'm going to install Johns board because it hasn't seen so much drama, along with a ptc for each bulb. I also see one of the paper washers in the bulb socket twisting and not staying centered. I'm guessing that may be the culprit that started the issues. I don't think there are many (if any) parts available for this unit. I may have to install a generic socket.

Bobby

I am confused now.  PS-3 trolley is all LEDs no bulbs unless track power.  I don't think a CV board is used in those trolley, but longtime since I worked on one. G

George, I never took note of the model, I was just keying off the 6V CV board which I recognized.  However, seeing it's a PS/3 model, I also wonder what the CV board is used for.  I wonder if someone has been in there hacking at the wiring?

A 433 is an 18 volt heavy duty bulb. It is the one used like in Lionel's O gauge 2500 series passenger cars. The bulb may be the issue.

Hi gents, I'm at work presently, but I'll post some better pictures after I get home. Unfortunately I didn't take any full "before" pictures other than this one. I say this because the wiring was a rats nest. Since it's my first mth I assumed this was normal. I've since cleaned up the wiring. I just scanned through the manual pdf and found the b/w picture I'm attaching. It's slightly different than mine, but the two bulbs are there. Presently the only led lighting it has are two directional headlights and signage boards on either side of the roof. I admit I was surprised how bad the lighting looks with these two bulbs. When running only the front and back of the side sillowette windows are lit. The center is dark. For a Christmas trolley the lighting is very unexciting. Just this morning I ordered some 5V led strip lighting for the inner roof that I'm hoping to replace the bulbs ( warm white and some colored leds to experiment with). I'll toss in 1 or two dropping diodes at the output of John's 6V board to power them. I should mention that an all other aspects I really like the trolley. I've added a switch for the dcc/dcs selection and have been enjoying the station stop sounds and announcements during testing.

Bobby

Well that picture is the PS-2 3V board.  I am still confused.  Did you upgrade this to PS-3?  Are you guessing at the Model number?  Is this something your putting together?  If you have bulbs in your unit the trolley was a PS-1 or PS-2.  Either way, the PS-2 or PS-3 board can drive all the lighting.  Bulbs for PS-2 and LEDs for PS-3.  The CV board does not need to be in there.  G

Thank you everybody for your insights and assistance. The model of the trolley is 30-5174 and can be found here:

https://mthtrains.com/30-5174-1

Along with the downloadable manual, which is the exact copy of the manual that came in the box with the trolley (Pics attached). On page 35 of the manual it talks about not needing to replace the leds, but also says you may need to replace the interior bulbs. For whatever reason, this ps3 manual uses a ps2 trolley for the photos in its descriptions.

I also found a youtube showing the exact model trolley I have, and it exibits the same lighting issues I've been experiencing. Namely, bright at the two ends and dark in the middle. He does a good job of explaining why this is so.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=...N0bWFzIHRyb2xsZXk%3D

Hopfully this will help clear up any questions.😁

Bobby

PS: Ignore the connected board to the left of the trolley. It is a Bluerail board that was allowing me to control the trolley via bluetooth. I'm still deciding if I want to make it part of the trolley for good. Also, sorry about the upside-down pic.

mp,

Well, it certainly does have two giant light bulbs!

If they were suppose to be interior lights they could be driven off track power.  Don't know if that is factory with CV board.  Sure seems odd and more cost when the PS-3 board could light the interior and more.  G

@GGG posted:

If they were suppose to be interior lights they could be driven off track power.  Don't know if that is factory with CV board.  Sure seems odd and more cost when the PS-3 board could light the interior and more.  G

I agree. The only thing I could come up with was they wanted them purposefully dim. Or maybe full brightness made too much heat (pretty thin plastic). I really wished they had done more led lighting inside. The bluerail app shows many dcc functions available for controlling a locomotive (if it were a full fledge loco). The function outputs were certainly available. Perhaps it was rushed to get it out for the holidays.

Bobby

Xoes anybody know what type of connectors is on the board in this picture (white)? And where they might be available? I need to order a couple to make cables.

Thanks,

Bobby

@BobbyDing posted:

Does anybody know what type of connectors is on the board in this picture (white)? And where they might be available? I need to order a couple to make cables.

https://ogrforum.com/...mth-2-pin-connectors

same in this topic https://ogrforum.com/...6#175005213453058356

Those are Molex Mini-SPOX connectors, available at Digikey or Mouser.

Molex 0022035025

Thx gents

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

Those are Molex Mini-SPOX connectors, available at Digikey or Mouser.

Molex 0022035025

Hey @gunrunnerjohn...

I've always been meaning to ask this question and hope it's not a stupid one.

How do you know or are able to identify the various plugs and sockets used on various circuit boards?

Do you have/use some kind of reference material or is it just chalking it up to experience?

I cant begin to tell you how many times I thought about asking the very question @BobbyDing asked!

@Junior posted:

Hey @gunrunnerjohn...

I've always been meaning to ask this question and hope it's not a stupid one.

How do you know or are able to identify the various plugs and sockets used on various circuit boards?

Do you have/use some kind of reference material or is it just chalking it up to experience?

No stupid questions, only stupid answers.   I still ask lots of questions if I don't know something.  I'm not afraid to admit there is a ton of stuff I don't have a clue about!

As for the connector ID's, it's a combination of knowing from previous experience and doing research to find out when I don't know.  If I'm trying to ID a new connector, I sometimes use Google images and enter what I know about the connector like the pitch and the number of pins.  Then I just scroll through the images to see if I spot it.  I've asked on various forums if I don't know as well.

The trick is to capture that information and keep it where you can find it again!

Thanks @gunrunnerjohn. Neat trick re. using Google's Image search capability! My Wife has used it to ID different plants. Seems to work pretty well.

I too have found myself creating a reference of sorts. I'm amazed how many notes, screen prints, articles, product documents etc. I've already accumulated from this hobby.   

Just an update, the trolley is better lit now with leds powered by @gunrunnerjohn' s CV board instead of the bulbs. The top roof lid still needs to be snapped in. I'm just waiting till I'm 100% sure I like it.

Well, he lighting is certainly even and complete!  Maybe turn down the intensity a bit before those passengers get a bad sunburn?

That empty socket in the CV board was bothering me. So I added something hoping to distract from the dark blob in the middle. But yeah, this might be a case where less is more. I wish there was enought room to install a dimmer pot on the bottom.

First time posting a video. Hope this works out.

My lighting boards have an intensity pot on them.

@BobbyDing posted:

Just an update, the trolley is better lit now with leds powered by @gunrunnerjohn' s CV board instead of the bulbs. The top roof lid still needs to be snapped in. I'm just waiting till I'm 100% sure I like it.

This photo that I took at the Branford Trolley Museum 2008 Members' Day might give you an idea:

And an enclosed car:

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

My lighting boards have an intensity pot on them.

What are their dimensions?

@BobbyDing posted:

What are their dimensions?

I don't understand the question.

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

My lighting boards have an intensity pot on them.

The intensity pot is the small silver thing on the PCB.

Sorry, I assumed you were saying I should try using one of your boards that you have created for powering leds in passenger cars because it's adjustable. To do so I would need to know how big it is because there isn't much available room inside the trolley. Thus my question about dimensions. Apologies if I misunderstood.

Bobby

@BobbyDing posted:

Sorry, I assumed you were saying I should try using one of your boards that you have created for powering leds in passenger cars because it's adjustable. To do so I would need to know how big it is because there isn't much available room inside the trolley. Thus my question about dimensions. Apologies if I misunderstood.

I must have really misunderstood, you stated that you were powering the LED's using my LED board!  At least that's what you said previously.

@BobbyDing posted:

Just an update, the trolley is better lit now with leds powered by @gunrunnerjohn' s CV board instead of the bulbs. The top roof lid still needs to be snapped in. I'm just waiting till I'm 100% sure I like it.

The module is 1.1" x 0.55" footprint, and with the regulator tab folded down, it's about 0.5" tall.  I normally stick them to the ceiling of the passenger cars as that's well above the sightline unless you're below the windows and looking up at the roof.

Ok, that explains the confussion. I was referring to the 6V CV board you were kind enough to mail to me a couple months ago 🫡 It's presently powering both sets of leds. I'll head back into the trolley when time allows to see about installing something to allow dimming. I did purchase a small function only dcc board so I could externally control the led lighting, but that would only work when using dcc.

Bobby