MTH P2 Pittsburgh, Pa Street Car - One of the nicest of my O Gauge Memories!

Nice trolley, nice Isaly's car and nice memories. Did Frank investigate the  WWII Army RR battalion that was disbanded because they were so crooked and stole so much for the black market ??  Wonder if they got the Good Conduct medal ??  Love that trolley.

Great story! Kind of cool now that I know who does the announcements. My mom always loves it when Frank says, "this is the 37 Shannon"!

And its in classic Pittsburgh Railways colors.  

Michael,

   Sense you own one of these Pittsburgh Street Cars I am hoping you might be able to tell me how exactly I turn the head light back on, on the front of my Street Car.   For some reason it went out, and does not come back on when I run her in FWD.  The rest of the lights on the Street Car are on and working perfectly fine.  Do I have a burnt out head light, or is there some way to turn it back on that I have not found.

Jim P,

   Actually I do believe Frank was involved in part of that particular investigation, and in the one they made the movie about just recently, some of that Nazi stolen Art Work taken from the Jewish families, was side tracked into the Swiss Banks, Frank had a hand in the investigation that actually got part of it back.    

PCRR/Dave

Dave,

If the headlight button on the remote doesn't turn the light back on, try a Feature Reset. If that doesn't do it either, you'll have to take a look inside.

Barry,

Where is the Headlight button located for the Street Car front Light.  In the soft keys at the top under the screen?  Marked as?  Or the #7 HDLT button?

Answered my own question, it's the #7 HDLT button, now why did it not regenerate when the Street Car was moving?  It did when sitting in neutral however.

Thanks for helping me again, I appreciate the input.

PCRR/Dave

Dave,

It's the #7 button.

Barry,

   One of the great things about the engineering of these P2 Street Cars, is the brake drifting engineered into them.  I rode these Street Cars as a boy, and when they came to a stop the announcements were made just like MTH had Frank announce them, as the Street Car came to a  stop, the Car actually did a brake drift, when you thought the Street Car was going to stop, it actually drifted another 6-10 yards before coming to a complete stop.  MTH actually programmed that brake drift into the Pittsburgh P2 Shannon Street Car for owner/operators to witness, got to admit Mike got this one right on the money, including the actual Pittsburgh, Pa Orange and Sand coloring on the Street Car.   The Street Car operates smooth as glass on FasTrack and the FTCC Switches do not effect it what so ever.  Simply a great little piece of engineering, with lots of sound effects, even the people putting coins into the pay style, and the coins being dumped down into the pay box, by the conductor, is absolutely correct.  The Brake sounds are just fantastic, and because Frank rode the Street Cars as a boy also, his announcement wording, is absolutely correct in every detail.    Frank told me he had both the West Side and the East Side announcements worked up,  however MTH only had room in those days, to record sound for one side of town, the 37 Shannon, Franks home Street Car Route was used, and the 87 Ardmore was negated from the recording announcements.  I can understand now why Frank purchased these Street Cars for the Iron Horse Train Club members, they are without a doubt YunZ GuyZ, Pittsburgh Perfect.

PCRR/Dave

Dave,

 For quite some time, I had the PS2 version of the Chicago PCC and installed in it Brooklyn trolley sounds, since I couldn't find a Brooklyn PCC.

This past year, I put back the Chicago sounds, sold it and purchased the new PS3 version of the Brooklyn trolley.

Barry,

    The P3 Brooklyn trolley route announcements must be fantastic, I got to hear them sometime.  I hope the P3 version works as well on the auto-program routing, as the P2 version does, I really like how loud & clear the announcements are in the P2 version, very impressive MTH engineering.   Glad MTH finally produced the Brooklyn Version for YonZ GuyZ!

PCRR/Dave

Dave,

Unfortunately, the route in the PS3 Brooklyn PCC is different from the version in the PS2 model. The PS2 had Ebbet's Field on the route, however, the PS3 version does not.

I'll look for a 3 volt PS2 upgrade sound file to put in the PS3 PCC car. Hopefully, it will have the original route.

Hi Dave:

Yes, MTH did a great job on the sound effects on that Pittsburgh Route 37 Shannon PCC streetcar except as we have previously discussed the lack of a downtown stop.

Anyway, I thought others would want to hear what you described  with Frank Hare’s announcements and the other realistic sounds so here’s a short video of mine running on my finally completed Christmas layout.  I’ve only programmed 3 different stops for this small layout. 

BTW, you older TCA members should remember Frank as he was TCA President in 1980 and edited the TCA Quarterly magazine for many years.

And for you tinplate guys, the train on the outside loop is a wide-gauge American Flyer #4644 electric with two passenger cars.  I’ll shoot a video tonight of it running and post it as it looks better at night.

Bill     

Bill,

   In Frank's original announcement work up for MTH, there was a downtown Blvd Of the Allies & an Oakland stop also, they were both eliminated with the 87 Ardmore due to the limited recording space, man I do wish it all could have been indented on the recording that is for sure.   Thanks much for the short Video, great stuff!  What track did you use for the Street Car route in your layout?  Looks real nice.

PCRR/Dave

Barry,

    Man that is a bummer no Ebbet's Field in the Brooklyn announcement, why have a Brooklyn announcement without it!  Without that stop it's not Brooklyn.

PCRR/Dave

Pine Creek Railroad posted:

Bill,

   In Frank's original announcement work up for MTH, there was a downtown Blvd Of the Allies & an Oakland stop also, they were both eliminated with the 87 Ardmore due to the limited recording space, man I do wish it all could have been indented on the recording that is for sure.   Thanks much for the short Video, great stuff!  What track did you use for the Street Car route in your layout?  Looks real nice.

PCRR/Dave

Dave:

You're welcome and my street car track is Superstreets, a mix of the original K-Line and later K-Line by Lionel products.

Regards,

Bill

Pine Creek Railroad posted:

Barry,

    Man that is a bummer no Ebbet's Field in the Brooklyn announcement, why have a Brooklyn announcement without it!  Without that stop it's not Brooklyn.

PCRR/Dave

Hi Barry:

Yes, that is a major omission.  Wasn’t the team name “Dodgers” derived from their fans dodging trolleys on their way to the stadium?

Anyway, this brings back the question I had back before the PS-3 trolleys were shipped?  Do they have 9 different programmed stops like their PS-2 counterparts or only 6 per the descriptive text on the 2014 Volume 2 catalog page? 

Bill

Bill,

Yes, the original team name was the "Trolley Dodgers".

I have a PS2 3 volt upgrade file that I may use and see if that improves things.

And I thought the first SEPTA Philadelphia PS-1 engine was the best one.  G

GGG,

   You actually printed the word Philadelphia in a thread talking about a great Pittsburgh Street Car, hay we tolerate the Big Apple cause of Joe Willey Nameth's Super Bowl win, and Billy Maz embarrassing the Yanks in 60, but nothing good has come out of Phily sense Ben Franklin died, let alone a good Trolley.  You can bet some young engineer at MTH never understood about the Brooklyn Trolley Dodgers, to negate this stop from a P3 Brooklyn Trolley, some peoples children, I tell Ya!

PCRR/Dave 

Great story, having one of your best friends doing the announcements is pretty neat. 

Gregg,

    Although Frank and I were close friends he was in my fathers WWII Generation, and I am proud to say he was my Mentor in this Train hobby.   I learned a lot about this hobby & Business from Frank, he owned the Iron Horse Hobby Shop just off Rt #19 for about 50 years.  My Father introduced me to Frank, they were friends, and he became my Train mentor from then on.  Frank was a real gentlemen and very kind to my Deaf daughter Vanessa Jane, especially when she was a little girl.  Completely Deaf children are very rough with toys, they have no way of knowing when they are being hard on them, it takes them over 10 years to develop their understanding & feel for things.  I still have the original Lionel Button Frank gave Vanessa Jane, with the Lionel Girl on it, saying Trains are a Girls Best Friend.  The only time I ever saw Frank Hare angry was when one of his employees was yelling at my daughter Vanessa Jane, because she had mishandled & dropped a small Lionel engine that was on display in the Iron Horse Hobby Shop.  The employee had no way of knowing how close Frank & Vanessa Jane had become, and when Frank heard the yelling directed at Vanessa Jane he scooped up the Lionel Engine in his big hand and thru it against the front wall, under neither the window near the register.  As he picked my crying daughter off the floor, he told the employee if he ever yelled at another child again, especially this child that hears absolutely nothing, he would not have a job.  Frank never allowed anyone to fix the hole in that wall, there was always a box or something setting in front of it, from that day on.  He said it was to remind his employees that Children, not trains were his business.  My daughter is 40 Plus years old now, and she has never stopped signing, (her way of speaking), about HER friend Frank.   She dropped me some e-mail just recently, wanting to know if her trains were still safe here at the house, she might need them for the kids she is helping to raise.  

Frank was a lot more than just my friend, as my daughter say, the Hare was/is part of her family.

PCRR/Dave

In my opinion the best Pittsburgh trolley is the PS1 64 East Pittsburgh-Wilkinsburg.  The stops are perfect starting from 6th & Wood downtown, stopping at Pitt (where my mother studied), and ultimately getting to the "end of the line" in E. Pittsburgh.  And the unique voice of Lou Redman calls out the stops!

I owned the 37 Shannon for awhile, but thought that the station stops were not nearly as good as on the 64, so I sold it.

Now if they really want to produce an interesting Pittsburgh car it could be the 77/54 Flying Fraction a k a North Side-Carrick via Bloomfield.

lewrail

Lewrail,

    If MTH would make a P2 version I would purchase the 64 EP/W with Lew's announcements on it also.  I got rid of all the P1 stuff a while back, however if you know where I can get the P1 64 EP/W in really great shape, I might pick it up also.  Does the P1 have the Auto-Route capability in it?

PCRR/Dave

Unfortunately the PS1 does not have Auto-Route, but it does have a wonderful air brake sound when it is put into neutral and reverse. Sounds just like those Pittsburgh PCCs did.  

There seem to be a supply of MTH Pittsburgh  E. Pittsburgh cars out there are prices much lower than what I paid about 8 years ago.

Lew

I just tonight on the "RailPicures.net"   website a beautiful photo of a restored PCC car in Kenosho, Wis.

Hi Dave,

With Christmas activity and our club's display at the Kennywood Holiday lights,  I haven't been  on the forum a lot recently and I just came upon you posting.  Thanks for your kind words.  I'm really glad that the streetcar ended up with you,  with the personal connection and good memories that it brought to you.  I hope that you got the headlight issue resolved as I don't recall that happening when we ran the streetcar at Christmas time.  Notice that I use the word streetcar-I don't ever remember anyone calling them trolleys in the Pittsburgh area when I was growing up in the 50's and 60's.  Maybe in the spring we can get together for lunch again.  Merry Christmas

Nick    

lewrail posted:

In my opinion the best Pittsburgh trolley is the PS1 64 East Pittsburgh-Wilkinsburg.  The stops are perfect starting from 6th & Wood downtown, stopping at Pitt (where my mother studied), and ultimately getting to the "end of the line" in E. Pittsburgh.  And the unique voice of Lou Redman calls out the stops!

I owned the 37 Shannon for awhile, but thought that the station stops were not nearly as good as on the 64, so I sold it.

Now if they really want to produce an interesting Pittsburgh car it could be the 77/54 Flying Fraction a k a North Side-Carrick via Bloomfield.

 

lewrail

Lew:

Yes, MTH’s PS-1 PCC model of #1713 on the 64 East Pittsburgh route was certainly a giant step forward with stop announcements and as you said those stops were very well done.  My only complaint is that Lou didn’t say “Westinghouse” when he announced the end-of-the-line stop in East Pittsburgh.  The (W) plant in East Pittsburgh was one of the largest employers during those PCC hey days and the main reason for anyone to take a streetcar to East Pittsburgh!  Also the (W) plant was the factory where the motors and the electrical equipment for 75% of the Pittsburgh Railways PCC fleet were manufactured, including those for PCC #1713.  But I’ll have to admit to being biased having started my (W) career in East Pittsburgh although not in the Transportation Division which made the streetcar equipment.  

And as already posted, the PS-1 streetcars were not programmable plus the stops were in the outbound direction only. 

Yes, the 77/54 would definitely be an interesting route to use as a model for a Pittsburgh Proto Sound equipped streetcar.  There would be no shortage of stops to include on the chip.  As a kid living in Carrick I used to ride it to Pirate baseball games at Forbes Filed or to the main Carnegie Museum in Oakland.  Once I even rode it all the way from Carrick to the Northside to meet my uncle who worked in the Sears store on the Northside.

BTW, per our discussions of a few years ago, did you ever get your PS-2 PCC programmed correctly?

Regards,

Bill

machinist posted:

Hi Dave,

With Christmas activity and our club's display at the Kennywood Holiday lights,  I haven't been  on the forum a lot recently and I just came upon you posting.  Thanks for your kind words.  I'm really glad that the streetcar ended up with you,  with the personal connection and good memories that it brought to you.  I hope that you got the headlight issue resolved as I don't recall that happening when we ran the streetcar at Christmas time.  Notice that I use the word streetcar-I don't ever remember anyone calling them trolleys in the Pittsburgh area when I was growing up in the 50's and 60's.  Maybe in the spring we can get together for lunch again.  Merry Christmas

Nick    

Hi Nick:

You’re right we never called them trolleys!  And attached is a photo of a Pittsburgh PCC streetcar in an off-the-street winter setting you will recognize for sure!

I’m glad I was able to help out in connecting you and Dave on that transaction for your streetcar.

Merry Christmas,

Bill

MACHINIST,

   Nick good to see you are still participating on the OGR forum, and yes the light came right back on when using the #7 HDLT button, when the Street Car sits in Neutral, I will see what happens again, when in motion some time.  I owe Bill (WFTTRAINS) big time for spotting your For Sale post on the OGR, for the P2 37 Shannon Street Car, with Franks voice in it.  I had missed it completely and Bill knew I was looking all over for one at the time.  The P2 Street Car has the Auto-Route announcements and is seriously cool.  I put her on the lower rails of my layout running around the village, and let the auto-route function make the Street Car look like it is making stops thru out the town.  The people who live around here, want to see & hear the Street Car as much as they want to see our Trains.   Everybody on the east side of town wants me to get the P2 with 86 Ardmore/Turtle Creek/Pitcarin announcements, when I tell them there is no P2 version of that Street Car they tell me I have to get MTH to make one, don't think they understand I have no input with MTH.   The Street car in the original Pittsburgh colors is a real big hit with the people here.  Maybe you guys should put one in your Kentwood layout, moving thru town!  

Thanks a million for the memories Nick.

PCRR/Dave

Hi Bill,

    Thanks for the great snow picture of our Pittsburgh Street Car, and you bet here in Pittsburgh there were no Trollies, we rode the Street Cars in our Pittsburgh area.  Bill some how I am going to steal that incredible winter Street Car picture and use it from time to time, with your permission of course, might even have one made up and framed for the Christmas layout.  

Thanks much for making everything possible.

PCRR/Dave

I have several of my PS2's programed in the auto mode to stop at 7 stations on my layout.  But some have a strange habit of reversing direction at the end of the line and backing to the start point. That's because I hit the wrong button while programming and am too lazy to reprogram them.

lewrail

Incidentally, if you pick up the MTH Pittsburgh or Red Arrow Brill trolleys, you'll hear my dulcet tones announcing the station stops...  ;-) 

Mitch

MMM,

   That is great, did not know your voice was on them, Congrats!

PCRR/Dave

Guns,

    John if I picked up a P1 with Lou Redman doing the East Pittsburgh/Wilkinsburg Stop Announcements, could you make it into a P2 with the Auto-Play Routing Function, like the 37 Shannon, I now own.  Would love to have both the east and west Street Cars in P2.  With Lou Reman doing the East Side announcements, that would be something to add to our Christmas layout also, but I want the auto-Play Routing function with it.  The P1 Street Car, as LewRails indicated, does exist, can you upgrade one for me to P2?

PCRR/Dave

@WftTrains posted:

Hi Nick:

You’re right we never called them trolleys!  And attached is a photo of a Pittsburgh PCC streetcar in an off-the-street winter setting you will recognize for sure!

I’m glad I was able to help out in connecting you and Dave on that transaction for your streetcar.

Merry Christmas,

Bill

Hmmm.. I think that is the old Walnut Grove Elementary School (West Mifflin School District) on the far left and Lincoln Place in the distance. That stretch of the 56 route was popular for photos.

Sorry to bring up an old thread, but a another post I made this morning has me thinking of the Flying Fraction again, only with a "Cordic and Company" set of recordings (as an option) instead of station stops.

@Pine Creek Railroad,

As a former Pittsburgher (left in '74), let me chime in and say that yes, we never called them 'trolleys', they were 'streetcars'.  I grew up in Kennedy Township which was way out in the sticks back then, not now.  There were no streetcars in our area, we had to go downtown to see them.  We used to go downtown on the Schaffer (sp?) bus a couple of times a year with my mom (she didn't drive).  I think one time we nagged her into taking us on one, a cool ride for sure but gosh was it decrepit.

BTW, your "... nothing good has come out of Phily sense Ben Franklin died... " would be almost correct if it weren't for cheesesteaks.  Also, your Isaly's car was cool.  That was the place to go for ice cream and chipped ham!

@texgeekboy posted:

@Pine Creek Railroad,

As a former Pittsburgher (left in '74), let me chime in and say that yes, we never called them 'trolleys', they were 'streetcars'.  I grew up in Kennedy Township which was way out in the sticks back then, not now.  There were no streetcars in our area, we had to go downtown to see them.  We used to go downtown on the Schaffer (sp?) bus a couple of times a year with my mom (she didn't drive).  I think one time we nagged her into taking us on one, a cool ride for sure but gosh was it decrepit.

BTW, your "... nothing good has come out of Phily sense Ben Franklin died... " would be almost correct if it weren't for cheesesteaks.  Also, your Isaly's car was cool.  That was the place to go for ice cream and chipped ham!

To be fair, I think the use of Streetcar only vs streetcar/trolley was generational. By the mid to late 70's and beyond, we  had the "Jolly Trolley", "Terrible Trolley" and of course the Neighborhood Trolley from Mr Rogers Neighborhood. Once PATransit started the PATrain, there were references to PATrolley as well. We knew that places like Kennywood and West View were historic "trolley parks".   Once the streetcars began to disappear from the streets, we went to see them at the Arden Trolley Museum. So, at that time, the terms became interchangeable in use more frequently.

There are quite a few Isalys cars, in tinplate and modern, from MTH.

"Yeah. Pittsburgh is the best city in Pennsylvania,  I'll tell ya! I know that!" --Rick Tocchet