MTH v K-Line Bombardier Passenger Cars

K-Line for the sole reason that they are 21" while the MTH cars are only 18".  I assume you are referring to the double level commuter cars?  I don't know in terms of physical details which on is more accurate, but if you have room for the 21" cars, they are much more in scale with the locomotives.  If 18" is your preference the MTH cars are nicely done, just compressed on length.  K-Line cars are at a premium now which also may be a deciding factor. 

Bombardier built several other passenger cars including the Superliner IIs, Comet II and Horizon cars, and several other cars mainly for export.  For a period they were the go to passenger car builder after Pullmans Standard exited the business after building Superliner I cars and Budd stopped building railroad equipment a short time after the ill-fated SPV 2000 cars were built.  Just a little extra trivia for fun.

Enjoy your search!

I have the MTH 18" cars.  I have kinda' limited myself to 18" for passenger cars simply because of the 23 x 12 layout is really not big enough for truly huge stuff to look good.  My maximum curve is around 90" diameter, and the smallest is 72".  21" passenger cars look OK on the 90" loop, but kinda' silly on the 72" curves.

@emdalco01 posted:

Hi

Can anyone tell me who does the most accurate and scale version of the 21” Bombardier passenger car and why?

MTH or K-Line?

Thanks Daryl

K-line is the only MFG that made the 21" Lossenge cars as well as the Superliner II cars so far. Both are selling at their premiums on Ebay and hardly seen on Auction sites. Keep in mind that K-line cars are made of Aluminum while MTH shortened 18" cars are made of plastic - if that really matters to you.

The only savior is IF Lionel would step up to the plate and make the lossenge as well as Superliner II cars full scale length. However keep in mind they would be made out of Plastic and realistically MSRP around the current prices of used K-line Aluminum cars @$200.00 ea

Golden Gate Depot would make the most realistic 21" lossenge and Superliner cars if enough people e-mail Scott Mann to do so and be prepared to spend over $300.00 PER CAR!

I have a set of each in Metrolink -- 21" K-Line and the 18" MTH. The MTH 18" cars are better done than the K-Line 18" cars as MTH uses a compression that maintains the proper window count and door placement. However, the K-Line 21" cars are pretty much right on the money. The one down side is the disc brakes -- K-line puts a solid disk on the outside of the wheel, while MTH actually has discs that snap onto the wheels. It's a small detail, but for anyone who has ridden on one of these cars it's a prominent feature. The visual issues with the MTH cars is that they're not much longer than the locomotive. This would also be more visible if, like me, you're running Metrolink and added an Atlas NJ transit Comet leased car to your train as shown on the right of the water tower.

Both cars feature a lighting switch for the cab car that turns on the headlights for push mode, while the MTH cab car has a "flash" option for the ditch lights. K-Line uses bright white LED's which mimic the SERIOUSLY bright headlights on the prototype. MTH also had a 2-car add-on set for their cars. Personally, I'd love to have a second set of 21" K-Line cars to set up an "Earthquake Special" 8-car train that ran out here in So. Cal. after a freeway bridge collapsed.

I prefer the MTH version in my own opinion.  My layout cannot handle the look of a  21 inch passenger set as space would not allow it.  I do like the MTH version because of the flashing ditch lights.

Thanks kindly for all your replies.

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

I have the MTH 18" cars.  I have kinda' limited myself to 18" for passenger cars simply because of the 23 x 12 layout is really not big enough for truly huge stuff to look good.  My maximum curve is around 90" diameter, and the smallest is 72".  21" passenger cars look OK on the 90" loop, but kinda' silly on the 72" curves.

John do you have any photos of the cars on a 72” radius curve? Thats as wide as l go unfortunately.

Regards Daryl

I have two sets of the K-Line 21" cars. They are beautifully done and very accurate. I would love to see them offered again. Lionel says they don't have the tooling so my guess is Bachmann got it and I don't see them making 21"cars any time soon.

Hi Will

Thanks for the photo they certainly do look like very cool cars.

l’d be 2 railing them but l’m concerned that 21” cars will look way too big for my 72” radius curves.

Daryl

I don't have any photos of them right now on curves, but they looked a lot better than the only 21" cars I have, some K-Line Daylight cars.  The 21" cars really hang out on O72.

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

I don't have any photos of them right now on curves, but they looked a lot better than the only 21" cars I have, some K-Line Daylight cars.  The 21" cars really hang out on O72.

Thanks John

I don't have pictures of them on 72" curves, but in this one, the inside curve is 81"and the outside is 99".

@Will Ebbert posted:

I don't have pictures of them on 72" curves, but in this one, the inside curve is 81"and the outside is 99".

Thanks so much for the comparison photo Will.

Wow the cars even hang over 81” curves. They would probably look totally silly on my 72”.

Daryl

It comes down to personal preference, but I don't mind the overhang as much as I mind the under scale cars.  I grew up on a passenger railroad so I saw 85' passenger cars most of my life as they ran less than a 1/4 mile from my house and I spent my teen years trackside nearly every other day watching former ATSF, PC, and BN heritage coaches running and then the Comet IIs and Arrow IIIs when it was electrified.

No one seems to mind the overhang on a Big-Boy or a GG1 on 072 and while they are articulated, the pilots swing out as far as the center of a car would.  On the old Paradise and Pacific railroad before the club got the new building, there is a tree that certain lumberjack cut down on an 072 curve.  The lumberjack was the running board on my Williams Challenger.   For my perspective it is all about angle of view as shown below.

072 Inside curve on the Paradise and Pacific.  Yes and interesting choice in motive power and cars on a western themed layout.

El Capitan running on the TCA Desert Division Trailer (072 five rail gargraves track)

Yes, this looks ridiculous.  Almost Overhead shot of PRR M&E train with 50' reefers followed by 60' baggage cars and finally an 80' rider coach.

Same curve with the El Capitan and mostly 85' cars from a different angle.  Not nearly as objectionable.

Hi Will,

I'm close to buying my Bi-level Bombardier coaches, but I'm still tossing up between 18" or 21" long.

I now have 84" radius curves and have done tests with floor mock ups with trucks correctly spaced and the 21" cars still seem to overhang the rails a lot and it looks like the end vestibules will not line up.

Is there any chance you might take some photos of the overhang of the 21" coaches on your 81" radius curve and also how closely the end vestibules line up?

Regards Daryl

While I think the 21" cars look great, I found they do look a little cramped on my layout.  I ended up using 18" cars as my standard.  I have curves from O72 to O99.

Great timing Daryl! I'm actually at my parents house and able to photograph the old layout haha. Here's some pictures of the diaphragm gap as well as showing how much they overhang the rails on the O-81 curves.

Thanks so kindly Will.

You’re a legend mate.

Clearly the 21” cars are too long.

I’ll have to go for the 18” cars.

Thanks again.

Thanks John

I agree the 18” cars will be much better looking on the 84” curves.

Daryl

I had two K-line cars and a MTH (all cab cars) which I recently sent out for painting.  Obviously the MTH is 18", but much to my surprise the K-line cars were two different sizes, one was 18" and the other was 21"  Hadn't notice until I got them back.  Both were Cal Trains and the boxes were the same size, but each were different product numbers and different sizes.  Doesn't matter much to me as they will all find a nice home in the service of NJT   Just wanted to give a heads up for people looking for the K-line cars, be sure you are getting what you want as they do come in different sizes

I own a set of 18" MTH bombardier cars in the Northstar Livery. They are extremely well detailed and feature the different lighting options on the cab car. Very satisfied with the product!

Did you really mean to disable playback?

I have a set of MTH and K-Line cars (MTH F59PHi). The K-Line cars are available in 18" and full scale length. The K-Line 18" cars aren't as accurate as the MTH cars because the doors aren't properly located and the window count is off. The K-Line full-length cars require at least 27" Radius (O-54) but look better on larger curves, especially when being pushed. The other K-Line advantage is they have LED headlights in the cab car.

The MTH cars' shortcoming is that they're only 18" and are barely longer than a scale F59PHi that pulls the train. The MTH cars have more accurate brakes and the option of flashing the ditch lights (constant flash vs. horn-activated) on the cab car. The MTH cars also have Kadee mounts (I put Kadees on mine and they work fine on 36"/O-72 curves).

My personal preference is the K-Line cars and at some point I'll put Kadees on mine. I bought the Metrolink set as I sometimes rode them when I lived in San Bernardino and I added an Atlas New Jersey Transit Horizon car as Metrolink leased some for that line. Here's a photo and video:

Not...

              even...

                                  close.

Consider this comparison as K-Line being in front by "3.1 inches " at the 1973 Belmont Stakes.

Unfortunately K-Line didn’t have a chance to make theirs in Tri-Rail, but MTH did them and they’re super nice.

thanks!

- Mario