yes Norton it went back to the dealer they sent the chip back to be re burned I would think Lionel would still do that with a known factory defect. so far luckily that is the only Lionel item that I have had that ever needed warranty . MTH choice of locos was always much more interesting to me but I did not like the electronics. the few I had I converted to TMCC. the problem with TMCC Legacy and DCS is that they are proprietary systems with no third party manufacturers other than electric railroad company. if the systems were open or licensable it would mean more choices in the 3 rail control world. the spinoff company that was to continue the DCS production has gone silent and I am guessing the lack of electronic components has put that on hold or maybe even dropped.
I posted the known problem just to give the OP a heads up. If he hasn’t committed yet he could contact Lionel and ask if they would handle the repair despite being out of warranty or ask the seller if the repair has been made and if not use that as a bargaining chip.
Pete
And yes it is the Depew Lancaster rs11.
@Norton posted:If this was the engine you are considering then you made the right choice.
These came from Lionel without the ability to assign a unique engine ID. You would have had to use ID #1and since its no longer covered by a warranty and only Lionel can correct this you would be stuck.
No doom and gloom here, simply a fact.
Pete
That isn't a warranty issue, that is a known manufacturing defect. They should honor repairing it. Did all stores send their stock in for updating and also contact customers?
@BobbyD posted:That isn't a warranty issue, that is a known manufacturing defect. They should honor repairing it. Did all stores send their stock in for updating and also contact customers?
No idea. Many customers sent them back themselves. My LHS, Gargraves, took care of that for myself and Rick. Good reason to support your local train store.
Pete
@Norton posted:No idea. Many customers sent them back themselves. My LHS, Gargraves, took care of that for myself and Rick. Good reason to support your local train store.
Pete
That's great. Unfortunately ours did not. Did Lionel request all stores send theirs back?
Gargraves just sent the board back for reprograming. as Norton said we are fortunate to have a good local Lionel Rep.
@Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4 posted:I have to agree. Not everything is all bells and whistles. You can't beat solid construction.
I'm gonna agree with Dave's agreement to Pat's post. 🙂
The (newer) Lionel locos I have are TMCC-era from the turn of the century; all are solid runners with little or no issues.
"Bells and whistles" are icing on the cake but only if the cake works. Otherwise, what's the point? 🤔
Mark in Oregon
My "bells and whistles" are working fine. 
@harmonyards posted:And this is where some of us have gone, …..you mention the older TMCC equipment, …we find this stuff nearly bulletproof, very well made, and easily (and sometimes inexpensively) upgraded,…..steam locomotives from both mfr.’s from around the turn of the last century, are extremely robust as far as hardware is concerned,….the vast majority of the time, we can upgrade a TMCC locomotive to more modern cruise, smoke, and update the chuffs, and still never reach what today’s locomotives cost!…even with purchasing the engine!!…..I’ll happily surrender whistle steam for heavy duty construction, 4 chuffs, good sounds, & fan smoke….all in a locomotive I can run the dog snot out of, and never wonder or worry,….
Pat
Yes. I'm even questioning the need for sound, now. If we had had proper gearing, even "cruise" would be unnecessary. You can imagine how often "chatter" in the cab gets my time.
I do prefer TMCC to transformer control, even with straight DC polarity systems.
@gunrunnerjohn posted:My "bells and whistles" are working fine.
That's awesome...and what's better is you know how to repair those circuits (or design better replacements)! 👍
Mark in Oregon
Legacy. Hands down.
For diesels, it's somewhat of a toss-up for me. OTOH, for steam as a rule, the Legacy sounds are way above what MTH does. It's a mystery why MTH hasn't spent more time with the audio installations with steam, even in large tenders, it's a basic install with cheap OEM speakers. Lionel usually has a acoustically designed baffle and fatboy speaker or speakers.
@D500 posted:Yes. I'm even questioning the need for sound, now. If we had had proper gearing, even "cruise" would be unnecessary. You can imagine how often "chatter" in the cab gets my time.
I do prefer TMCC to transformer control, even with straight DC polarity systems.
Cab chatter for me is not unless I want to hear it. I think one of my newer engines I ran through part of the dialog, but not even half of the back and forth. I just wanted to hear what was said when I hit the buttons for it. That was enough. I doubt I would run through the dialog for anyone other than young children. Being that I have no kids, and all my nieces and nephews are grown, not much of an audience unless my great niece and great nephew pop down.
I'll agree with John that Lionel still has the edge on steam sounds overall. MTH has improved to the point though that if I want the model I'll buy the engine. With diesels there are MTH engines that I actually think sound better than what Lionel has!
I have thought the MTH use of stationsounds in their passenger engines a better alternative to having to spend more money on a $tation$ound$ diner. Not to mention you can in many cases change the route of a particular named train to suit the area of the country you model like the Empire State Express vs the Mercury or Southwestern Limited.
Pete
Lionel, TMCC and Legacy, have been in use by operators on my 1600 sq ft waybill-driven NHRR layout. Often I have as many as 10-12 people, with few problems. I have motive power by Lionel, Atlas, K-Line, Weaver and 3rd Rail.
MTH innovated with good sound, then sat on their innovation laurels. Lionel chose the continuous improvement model, building some of the most highly detailed, accurate O scale models available short of brass freight cars.
Further, MTH left customers “hanging” twice:
The first time they made a decision to abandon Proto 1 customers by failing to make Proto 2 “backward compatible.” All the corporate excuses ensued… Lionel didn’t go that route, and all systems are compatible. Lionel also licensed their tech to Weaver, 3rd Rail, K-Line, Atlas. They made money, encouraged competition, and broadened the reach of the hobby.
The second time was the fake “going out of business” notice, encouraging quick sales while …. Again, leaving customers just wondering. Enough said on that.
Disregard me once, shame on you, disregard me twice? Noooooooooooo.
I agree with John. There is plenty of room in the tender for a better speaker and baffle. I've done plenty of speaker upgrades in these steam engines with greatly improved sounds and plenty of happy customers.
On the topic, I have found a nice "free" supply of perfectly sized speaker baffles. Go to to your local Taco Bell and and ask the clerk if you can have a few of the little cups they put nacho cheese in.
@Don Sierakowski 111617 posted:The first time they made a decision to abandon Proto 1 customers by failing to make Proto 2 “backward compatible.”
Proto 1 is strictly a conventionally operated system. Proto 2 & 3 can also be operated conventionally which essentially makes them backward compatible. What backward compatibility is missing?
If you look through the commands available for the variable channels on the TIU, you will find commands strictly for the PS1 engines....
