New Lionel and MTH K4's Compared

No Tuscan red on the K4s.

Well, the Lionel Legacy K4 has whistle steam, I don't think the MTH one does.   You're saying with a set, what specific model from MTH are you talking about?

According to PRR Guru, Al Staufer in his book Pennsy Power out of 500+ K-4s, at one time 3 were painted Tuscan to match the heavyweight cars on the Broadway.

Show me a color photograph of a Tuscan K4s

I have read in several references that the story of a Tuscan K4s is incorrect.

How this.

This threads kinda being hijacked.  That said.

<<<Show me a color photograph of a Tuscan K4s

I have read in several references that the story of a Tuscan K4s is incorrect.>>>

I enjoy it more believing there were Tuscan ones.  No harm-no foul.

What are you talking about there is one right here!!!

  Can't you see it?!

Looks like just another sooty black PRR steam locomotive to me!

your not looking hard enough... shut one eye and squint the other ... you'll see it.

Personally, I see the Tuscan as one ugly bugga (how's that Don?). Perhaps with a good weathering job it could be vastly improved?

If the story IS true I would imagine that the shops tried to keep them clean and shiny for passenger trains however...

Ugh!

MTH

Lionel

You decide

Oh, and the 1:1 k4, the rods sound like Santa's sleighbells

Both are very nice, I prefer the sound quality and whistle steam of the Legacy.  I have no plans on buying the MTH since I already have the one I like.

I would say the only downfall of the recently released Lionel legacy K4s is the stack smoke fan motors become very loud over time. They had a batch of bad motors but I believe they can be replaced.

It's actually not too difficult to replace the fan motors.

A funny thing I noticed in Rick's videos about the two locomotives.  This interesting "fact" popped up in the video for the Lionel Legacy K-4, I'm betting this is news to the folks at Lionel or anyone that owns one of these!

Just remember, it is always better to hear the rods, than it is to smell them!

Thanks for that nice video, brings back memories; the darned stoker screw broke as we departed Altoona, and we had to hand fire her all the way over and back to Altoona.

I learn something new everyday.

How was it hand firing the K4? 

Not too bad (plus I was 26 years younger then), since only the stoker auger was non-functional, i.e. the steam distributing table, just inside the fire door, still worked fine. All one had to do was shovel the coal up off the deck plate and place each scoop full on the distributing table, making sure you stepped on the air treadle that opened the butterfly fire doors prior to throwing the scoop full of coal. The weather was pretty cool & rainy too as I recall.

They look a bit better with some soot here and there.

Back to the original question: the first MTH K4s had the wrong size drivers. Has that been corrected, or does tinplate flange size mean you guys cannot have scale 80" drivers?

The lionel whiste steam smoke is the real eye catcher and the sound is fantastic.  the tiny front truck wheels suck as they do on all lionel engines.  why not offer scale size for us that use o72.

Thanks for the replies! Here are the links to the sets:

Metropolitan

Red Arrow

Non-cataloged Streamlined

The MTH website states the sets need a minimum curve of O42, but I find that questionable. Also, I read somewhere that the streamlined version needs O72, which is very likely given the clearance between the engine and tender on that model. Also, I believe the specs for the Lionel K4 which is currently available, is O72, so maybe the front truck wheels are different from previous ones..? BTW, I am enjoying the slightly off thread comments very much and would be happy with more. Knowing if the 80' driver issue has been corrected or not on the MTH units would be good. Thanks again.

Lionels K4 is rated for O-36, as is MTH's 'high rail version".

The radius restrictions given on the sets are stipulated by the cars more than the loco. The k4 is a short wheelbase steamer and can negotiate tighter radius than an 18"  scale passenger car.  

Having said that, the loco will look better than the cars going around the O42 minimum if thats what you have. An 18" passenger car will have severe over hang and look a bit silly making that turn.

I run my k4 on my O-48 loop and pull the 15"railking passenger cars instead as they look better going around the turns.

Also, I read somewhere that the streamlined version needs O72, which is very likely given the clearance between the engine and tender on that model.

The scale "Torpedo" streamlined K4s locomotives require O72 because the low shrouding in the front keeps the pilot truck from swinging very far.  I have the Weaver version and it definitely needs O72, it derails on O70.

I have the MTH K4 that is SL. It runs and looks great. Good chuff, great smoke but the whistle is just so-so. If it had a better whistle it would be a killer. 

I have run mine on O60 and it is just fine.

I have both MTH and the Lionel. The MTH has better detail, but the Lionel has a bit better sounds except for the chuffing, which I don`t care for, but that is my problem because I don`t like any Lionel chuffing sounds.

RickO,

That was one fantastic video on the Lionel K4, very nice layout indeed.

Sure makes me want to buy one.

The videos are awesome.  Tough choice between the two.

Might have to go with the Lionel because it has a "sunroof"!

Thanks but no thanks. That video actually belongs to another forum member, not sure if he goes by the same Pgh Train fanatic name that he uses for the video.

He has done several video demonstrations of Lionel locos, they are all first rate.