NJ Transit's Derailment April 3rd

HI

I use to use New Penn station to commute to the city from Summit, NJ. The setup they have (Amtrak, NJ trains and LL RR) is a bottleneck under New Penn station. This mess will take a long time to clean up, repair and get back to normal operations. My best guess is by Sunday they should be back to normal operations, unless the Governor get involved.

it appears there is damage to a double slip near the yard throat. NY Penn's trackwork is among the most complex anywhere. no wonder it prevent access to 8 tracks/platforms.

don't see how the Governor will influence anything. this is a direct result of 40+ years of Congress underfunding Amtrak, and deferred maintenance as a result.

Everything you stared is correct however I was listening to the news this morning on the radio. Governor Christi is withholding a 65 million payment to AMtrack. Also he is directing the NJ attorney General to see what other legal action can be taken against Amtrack. The mud slinging has begun with this unfortunately accident. 

Unless Congress gives Amtrak adequate funding this is going to happen again and again. I live on LI and use the LIRR occasionally. They are bad enough on their own, throw Amtrak into the mix and it can be a nightmare sometimes. How a national railroad can be responsible to maintenance into and out of one of the busiest rail hubs in the country is beyond me. The station is used by three different commuter lines, with the LIRR being the busiest. East side access to Grand Central can't come fast enough. 

Is there ANY commuter railroad that is well run ??  Most are bottomless pits where they keep throwing money.  Possibly it might be that the NYC/northern NJ has reached its limit in sustaining life.  Possibly Congress, in all their "wisdom" thinks those operations already get enough tax dollars.  Let the riders pay.

Kris, mud-slinging is right. Last night a TV political ad by wanna-be-governor Phil Murphy attempted to cast Christie as the reason behind the accident.

Forget legal action against Amtrak, direct it at Congress.

Forgive my lack of understanding here. How do the policies of NJ Governor "Shamu" Christie affect track maintenance in Manhattan?

Arthur P. Bloom posted:

Forgive my lack of understanding here. How do the policies of NJ Governor "Shamu" Christie affect track maintenance in Manhattan?

The state of New Jersey, i.e. NJT, makes monthly payments to Amtrak for the use & maintenance of Amtrak trackage, that they (NJT) use.

I think it is unlikely that Congress will adequately fund Amtrak.  Congressional priorities seem to be elsewhere.  Amtrak will just need to limp along as it always has.

What really needs to happen is to build a second tunnel from NJ to Penn Station.  The present tunnel was built by the PRR in the 1930s and is single track in both directions.  It is amazing that this tunnel has lasted so long.  They are going to have to shut one or other of the bores for extensive maintenance someday and then there will be a real traffic jam.

Perhaps a new tunnel could be at toward the top of the infrastructure list if the Congress can get the will to fund new projects. 

NH Joe

A new electrified freight tunnel from NJ to Brooklyn would be nice, too.  Interchange with the NY & Atlantic, a bonus.  A boy can dream...right?

I seem to recall that a new tunnel from Manhattan to NJ was being discussed. Straight to Brooklyn would make more sense.

The tunnels and track work opened in 1910. The thirties is when the overhead electrification took place.

I would think that a freight tunnel to Brooklyn to allow usage of the natural deep water by the docks would be a plus, but the PA & RRs seem to prefer dredging around Newark. If nothing else it could be used as an emergency evacuation route, not getting off the island during an actual emergency as things stand now.

Amtrak owns the infrastructure.  They charge NJT and the LIRR rent.  When the derailment occurred, a friend from high school who works for Amtrak at Sunnyside posted to Facebook: "no problem!  We got this!"  That was days ago...

Jon  

Wick Moorman made a press release for Amtrak taking ownership for both this derailment as well as the one on March 24th. The earlier one was due to misaligned rail, and the later one due to a wide gauge condition as a result of defective wood ties.

The Penn Station issue has been a pass the buck for 40 years!! And I doubt it will ever change. It was not built for the traffic it handles. The one advantage to living in White Plains is Metro-North. Metro North really does not have any operating issues. It has a spacious terminal, Grand Central, and it is the only railroad that uses it and it is the owner. Trains run on time in about 93% of time and your in mid-town. There is such a need for another tunnel under the Hudson but who is going to pay. Right now the Port Authority is rebuilding LaGuardia, funded by NY, NJ and the US Gov't. Amtrak is underfunded and will continue to be. The infrastructure here in NYC is mediocre at best...

Cincytrains posted:

The Penn Station issue has been a pass the buck for 40 years!! And I doubt it will ever change. It was not built for the traffic it handles. The one advantage to living in White Plains is Metro-North. Metro North really does not have any operating issues. It has a spacious terminal, Grand Central, and it is the only railroad that uses it and it is the owner. Trains run on time in about 93% of time and your in mid-town. There is such a need for another tunnel under the Hudson but who is going to pay. Right now the Port Authority is rebuilding LaGuardia, funded by NY, NJ and the US Gov't. Amtrak is underfunded and will continue to be. The infrastructure here in NYC is mediocre at best...

If you want an eye opener google what the Port Authority takes in on bridge and tunnel tolls in a six month period.

Probably not suitable for discussion on this forum as to where the money goes.

Anyway, back on trains, anyone want to dig up stats on the traffic (in number of trains if possible or number of people) that Penn Station has carried each year since it's built.

Would be interesting to see the number of trains per year and the number of passengers handled.

Rob, go back and look at what the Pennsy carried in and out of NY Penn during the war years. I'd bet traffic levels were at least as high as they are today.

I believe the Diehl book: 'The Late, Great Pennsylvania Station', and the Jonnes book: 'Conquering Gotham' both cite traffic figures from those years.