Pennsy 1361 Lessons Affect Long Island G5s 35 & 39

@Bobby Ogage posted:

The resolution of Federal Railroad Administration concerns resulting in the design and build of a new boiler for the K4 1361

Not necessarily a "new boiler", but a new firebox.

are likely going to effect the return to steam of Long Island's G% 35 & 39. What is the latest status of the 35 & 39?

I don't know which G5s is which, but one is at the Strasburg Rail Road shops for rebuild, including a new firebox. I believe funding is an issue.

It's always been the issue of the firebox for PRR steam.  As Jack has pointed out in previous posts, these are old machines with 1361 being built in May of 1918 and among the last of the K4s to be retired in 1957.   Most large steam was built with better and newer technology as the PRR was fixated on their failed Duplex designs and other steam follies in the Superpower era.  The "classic" PRR locomotives out of the Gibbs and Vogt era had tighter tolerances on the fire box and otherwise were very conservative designs that served long careers.   

The G5 35 boiler is currently sitting outside of the Strasburg shop pending funding for continued work.  Another side effect of the economic implications of covid. 

Both the "new" 1361 and G5 35 will eventually both be FRA compliant and fully operational some day in the not too distant future.  A prediction on my part with not much factual knowledge and an emphasis on future.

From what I understand (please correct me if I am wrong):

PRR built their fireboxes with a safety factor of 3.5 where the FRA now requires a safety factor of 4.

This would mean the PRR fireboxes need to be rebuilt with thicker steel, closer spacing of the staybolts, or a combination of the two. (How is staybolt spacing handled in the tight radius corners of a Belpaire firebox?)

Have the fireboxes on preserved PRR steam deteriorated (thinned) from their as-built conditions where they no longer even have a factor of 3.5? I realize this varies from locomotive to locomotive.   

That being said, why did the FRA choose a safety factor of 4 after 3.5 had proven itself safe on PRR steam throughout the steam-era? (I know the Gettysburg RR incident played a role into updated regulations).

Also, is there anything in the FRA rules that specifically addresses Belpaire fireboxes? I'm not familiar with the rules but I am assuming that there isn't.

@Hot Water posted:

# 39 is at SRR.

https://www.strasburgrailroad.com/engine-39/

@RSJB18 posted:

# 39 is at SRR.

https://www.strasburgrailroad.com/engine-39/

Thanks for the correction.

It seems like it would be a natural partnership between a toy train manufacturer and a restoration project, to join up for a model that is officially licensed by the engine owner (or, in the case of the T1 Trust, engine fabricator), with a small portion of the sale proceeds going to the project, and at the same time, raising awareness of and interest in the project -- which in turn, one would think, will lead to further direct donations towards the restoration.  Meanwhile, those who are interested in the restoration would likely be more interested in a model of that particular engine.  Has this been done by Lionel or MTH or anyone else in the past?

David