Perception of Trolley Cars

Not sure where your visitors are coming from.  Trolleys had designs that originally were very antique-looking, descending as they did from horse cars.  They evolved all the way up to the last models that looked pretty much like city busses.  But yours are what I think of as pretty typical.  I like them.

There are many types of trolleys and different trolleys for different stages in their evolution, so it pretty much depends on what your visitors experienced, and where.

The Western Hobbycraft trolleys, which I regard as the finest ever made in 3-rail O gauge, are based on an actual prototype and are made to scale.  The MTH models are also pretty faithful to some very widely used cars.

Chances are that they are younger than some of us, and they probably remember the PCC cars.  The Western Hobbycraft cars are scale cars.  My Chicago CTA may not be 100% prototype but looks so much like the Pullman Red Rockets that I remember that they look fantastic to me.

BTW, WBB recently brought out a Peter DeWitt car that is also scale and very nice.  The only problem for my layout is that those are single ended cars so sometimes they have to run backward.

In Brooklyn in the 1940's, there were about 525  20 year old "Peter Witt' style cars , about 200 6000 class single enders from the early 1930s and about 100 PCC cars dating from the late 1930's. There were also a handful of older cars with clerestory roofs on some lines. In Manhattan, most of the cars operating there were relatively new having been built in the late 1930's but not quite streamlined as were the PCC's.

They certainly look like trolleys in the "Trolley Museums"  I've visited.  They don't look like the trolleys that run down Market Street in San Francisco, however.

Bobby,

I see you have two of the Johnstown trolleys byWestern Hobbycraft. I can tell you they are accurate models of the real thing. I grew up in Johnstown and rode on them as a kid in the ‘40s & ‘50s.

Here’s a link to pictures of Johnstown trolleys that include the type you have and PCC and trackless trolleys as well. http://www.davesrailpix.com/john/john.htm

BTW, I have 2 of Walt's trolleys. One Johnstown and one Philadelphia.

Perhaps because they have nver seen an electrically powered vehicle that runs on tracks.When I mentioned trolleys to one lady she thought I was talking about the rubber tired vehicles that are called trolleys, I told her she should have gone a short distance from the resort town to Seashore Trolley Museum to see the real thing.

That's what I was thinking ,also.

Septa has modernized some their old PCC cars and returned them to service in Philadelphia.

About ten years ago, took a NRHS trip on Amtrac to Middeltown, pa.

While at the Middletown and Hummelstown Railroad noticed they had about a dozen

or so SEPTA PCC trolleys. Don't know what their final fate was.

As others have said, most who remember Trolleys will no doubt have a picture of PCCs in their heads. The semiconvertables and safety cars in Bobby's pictures had their hay day in the teens and twenties and were being replaced by PCCS in the 2nd half of the 1930s. Some cities retained fleets into the 50s mostly for crush times (holidays) or converted to work cars

As for interurbans, of the ones that survived the depression, most were gone by late 40s early 50s

Bobby;

FWIW, your trolleys look pretty much like I remember the Third Ave Trolley (er Rail System) that I rode as a kid.  I don't remember the PCC cars.  I think that by the time they came out, NYC was in the process of getting rid of Trolleys and EL Trains.

I wish the WBB trolley could be had in two rail.  Any chance it might be built by WBB?  Odd-d

Train pop

TARS did not buy PCCs but rather built their own design modern car around that time. A lot of these went to war torn countries in the 1940's when TARS ceases car operations in Manhattan.

PCC's of the B&QT did operate into Manhattan over the Brooklyn Bridge to a Loop at Park Row. The 7th ave car operated PCCs over the bridge and closed out the service in 1950.  PCCs were not on any routes that were operated over the Williamsburg Bridge. These were mostly Peter Witts.

I remember my father taking my brother and I on the trolley cars over the 59th Street Bridge from Queensborough Plaza, the last days of the Third Avenue Railway, and the street cars in Brooklyn. LIRR Steamer, your posts bring back memories.

ODD-D 

You can look for a WBB body on eBay or at trolley meets. You can also find 2 rail trucks tree as well. The trucks and motors can also be purchased from Q Car Company or other manufacturers. Look for trucks that operate on  2 rail insulated track or overhead wire. The hunt is worth the effort.

Good luck,

Nate

Bobby

Glad it conjures the memories These were great times. We really had a lot of transportation options in those days. I can remember going to Coney Island from where we lived in Williamsburg, Brooklyn. We started out on the #61 Crosstown car which was a 6000 seri9es car. Rode this to Vanderbilt Ave and Flushing Avenue where you could transfer to the #69 Vandebilt Ave Car. This was a PCC. Rode that one to the end of the line at Park Circle where you could transfer to the Mcdonald Ave car for the rest of the trip to Conet Island. PCC's were on the Mcdonald Avenue Run. Took a lot longer than the subway but the ride was a lot more fum.

If you wanted to go to Manhattan from Williamsburg, you did not have to go to Bridge Plaza to get the street car. Cars running across the Williamsburg Bridge to Delancy street in Manhattan stopped at Bedford Avenue on the Bridge. You could get on there for 2 cents instead of the regular nickel fare up through 1947. When the cars entered Manhattan , they went to a large underground terminal with several trolley loops. You can still see this terminal from the Subway Platform at the Essex Street station on the J line.

You can get a version already converted to scale wheels and overhead operation from John Pilling. His e- mail address if RWY536@CHARTER,NET

Phooey!! Your visitors are spring chickens.  Those look like the ones my grandfather

used to operate and I vaguely remember riding up 4th Street (once the main shopping

street) to the dime stores in Louisville, Kentucky.  About all I remember was the

folding steps at the front that I guess the motorman let up and down when he opened the door for you to get on and off.

People seem to identify the quintessential trolley with a single truck Birney or the Toonerville Trolley.

This is just one of the many reasons that the Rockhill Trolley Museum and others of its like are so important.

http://www.rockhilltrolley.org/

I remember our family trip, when I was just a little shaver, to a trolley museum in CT.  Dad was nuts for traction of all types, and he and I rode all they had to offer, over and over, that day.  Gosh, that was fun.  The other three family members were done after about two rides, and just shook their heads at our interest. 

I didn't ride the trolleys at Rockhill Furnace, more interested in riding the EBT's

gas electric at the time, but I did once ride, in Columbus, Ohio, a trolley on a short

ride out and back, from "Ohio Trolley Museum?", or "Columbus Trolley Museum?", which was beside railroad tracks on the north side of the city....  Whatever happened to that museum and those cars? 

Bobby

Brooklyn did have a few Birney cars when these were first introduced. They were used on lightly patronized lines such as Kent Avenue and the Greenpoint ave line. Also they would work the shuttle routes out in the hinterlands and maybe a cemetary line. These cars were not liked well by both the employees and the public and they did not last long in Brooklyn.

I would say that most folks in Brooklyn might remember the PCC cars since it was Brooklyn that received the first of these cars produced. The other car type best remembered would be the double ender Peter Witt cars . There were 525 cars in the fleet and they ran on everyline at some point .

Those Western Hobbycraft cars certainly look like the streetcars that i remember.  Of course, i'm probably a bit older than most of the readers.  If you go to Kenosha, WI, you can ride on a PCC car, relatively recent in it's origins, including a Johnstown, PA  painted version, more than 60 years old, including riding on a Toronto car, a Chicago car, a Pittsbugh car and a Cincinnati car.  Great way to spend an afternoon before heading out to East Troy to ride the interurban line.

Paul Fischer

Queensboro bridge ran Osgood Bradley electromobiles, same as Scranton, PA, and I think Altoona, PA. 

I think the QB Bridge cars came from Massachussetts but were probably the Bradley models in your post. They were the last cars to run in New York City.

"Trolley" can also mean a "trolley Bus", a bus which is electric bus powered from two overhead wires.  SF Muni, Philly SEPTA, and the Toronto TTC do/did hve them.