027 trains are still fun! Photos of my own creations... more added 12/27/20

And now for some more photos. First below is my most recent finished project. The original brake wheel stand was broken off, so I changed that. And it was missing the searchlight dome cover, so I made one from the plastic from a milk carton, along with this clear ribbed plastic stuff that is really made for kitchen shelf covering. Now some might argue the Disney figures are completely unprototypical. Depending on your feelings about the Penn Central... I have a friend who jokes the Penn Central was a Mickey Mouse operation, so maybe it's more realistic that it seems. 

Next below is prototype and fantasy combined. I like the Norfolk Southern Enviro scheme that was used on one single engine, the 999. Norfolk Southern has no Alco FA's, but I do. I realized finding decals for the "wave" part of the white striping was going to be impossible. And doing an identical paint mask on each side was going to be a huge challenge. So I did a simplified version of that scheme and added a zero to the unit number, though I still have to make the number boards for this one.

Next is a shorty Lionel plug door box car. I know it's the wrong shade of blue for CSX rolling stock, but I like it over the dark blue that is normally used. RMT had issued one of their 2-bay hoppers in the CSX Coke Express scheme. But the RMT version had white lettering. I looked high and low to find a photo of that car with white lettering and could find none. So I did my own Coke Express hopper and stumbled upon this shade of blue. I knew it wasn't right (those hoppers were black) but I liked it. So then I did this box car also. We 3-railers are a funny breed, aren't we? Somethings bother us, even though they're accurate, and other things that aren't accurate, we like. Well... maybe NOT all of us. 

This next one was inspired by a fantasy paint scheme MTH put on a Lehigh Valley steamer. This one below was one of those Lionel late 1980's DC only starter set engines. Aside from the paint scheme, I added weight to the engine, so it can pull a train now. I also added a headlight, handrails, some other details and moved the drawbar from the tender to make the engine and tender closer.

Next is a K-Line flat done up for NS. For some reason, K-Line had a thick round mounting on the body, where the trucks attach. I used a Dremel and sanded down the thickness of those, so that the car sets lower to the track and looks much better. I don't remember where I got the bars running along the deck surface... I cut them down from something... they hold items like these Tonka tractors in place. But I can also now put a whole variety of items on this particular flat car, which I like the flexibility of.

Next below, a Lionel woodside reefer. Aside from repainting, I also cut down the body mounts where the trucks get attached to the car, so that the car rides a little lower to the track and looks better with my other smaller more 027-ish rolling stock.

I might have posted this one on one of the Saturday Switcher threads. On my local division of the Norfolk Southern, there's some tight curves that the bigger engines just cannot maneuver through. So some Alco FA's had to be put into service. This was one of the older K-Line unpainted, molded plastic colored engines, either a Pennsy or Southern from one of the starter sets. Looks good to me now.

I have also been gone for many tears ( Health issues, amputations, etc.) and this is the first post I have read. Color me inspired! Thank you sir...

Brian

Glad you started this thread too. You are so right buying those old relics and making them look like new. I’ve been doing it for years in “Scale” now you have encouraged me to do some O27 for some reason  these days I’m leaning towards O27. I really like what you did with the NH Piggly Back. Two years ago I wouldn’t even look at O27 now its at the top of my list. This is why I love this “O” scale over HO and others. Hope to see more of your work 

Brian, your restored, repainted and renovated trains look great.

Although I prefer O Gauge with 031 and wider curves to 027, I also prefer traditional sized trains to Scale sized trains because of my medium sized layout (35 feet long and to 3 to 4 feet wide around the walls of 2 rooms in my basement). Traditional enables me to make trains with more cars to traverse my reverse loops.

Now if I had a large layout (50 feet by 20 feet or larger without reverse loops), then I would go for scale over traditional. For instance, I recently became a member of NJ Hi-Railers Club (layout is 185 feet by 30 feet without reverse loops) and scale size with huge locomotives and trains with 50 plus cars looks awesome. Arnold 

brianel_k-lineguy posted:

@Lionelski, nice work. You know, I've been tempted to try your elongated SP caboose project. Years ago there was an article in the OGR magazine about doing that very same project. I thought, wow, that'd make for a good "027-ized bunk or crew car. The Wabash caboose looks good too!

My whole point in doing this thread was to encourage people to try their hand at fixing up older trains. There's plenty of beaters out there and plenty of well worn common train items that don't have much collector value: All great candidates. If I found something that WAS actually worth money, I'd try to sell it so I could then buy more beaters or common stuff to repaint.

Many years ago at my first YORK show, some guy was giving me grief over repainting trains, telling me they were all collectibles and worth money. So... I pulled a well-worn gondola out of my purchases bag and told him I'd sell it to him for $500.00. He laughed and said, "That's not worth $500.00! That's a $5.00 train car, at best." I then laughed and told him he'd just shot his initial argument full of holes and then went about my merry way, looking for more candidates for repainting.

At another show, I was talking to the owner of Ross Custom Switches at a train show. I was looking over his products and admiring them, when he asked if he could help me. I told him I was a strictly 027 guy and was just looking.

To my surprise, he encouraged me. I asked why and he answered that every 027 item I buy from Lionel helps to keep them in business. Which helps Lionel to put money into the new high end scale products, which in turn, helps his business grow.

I thought that was a terrific answer, showing a great attitude towards business and a realistic outlook on the 3-rail hobby.

 

We are on the same wavelength Brian, thanks for the comments too.

At first I hesitated to post these pics here as I was concerned that you might think that I was hijacking your thread, I'm glad that you did not feel that way.

Excellent work!

Some tinplate passenger cars that were a rusted mess, they required sanding and repainting. Transformed into the Spokane Portland & Seattle.

Nice work Bill. It looks like you put some kind of interiors into the cars, or maybe it's some kind of framing or treatment to the windows. 

We often see posts addressed to the train companies, when are you going to make this? Then people assume the train companies don't listen or don't care. Wrong. They have to have enough demand for a product, so that they can make a quantity that will cover the production costs. Or tooling and R&D if it's a totally new item. A lot of money these days especially given the small production run numbers that I am aware of.

So how long would it have taken for one of the train makers to make Spokane Portland & Seattle passenger cars of any kind? Never mind tinplate. It's the same question I've often asked myself, about the 027 products I'd like to see made, which is why I do what I do.

Maybe repaints don't have much value (unless it is something that someone specifically wants), but I highly doubt the original badly rusted cars Bill T. started off with had much value either, other than possibly sentimental, if even that. One thing for certain: I'm sure the cars look far better now than they did when Bill got them. And he has something he wanted in a road name he likes. Sounds like a win/win to me.

Brian,

Here are a few more if my O27 repaints:

I love one offs, custom is King. I have lots of fantasy bashes. It's a huge part of what keeps me happy. I also like the semi-scale size better than full O (shrugs unknowingly)

Recently I brokea cheapie 0-27  caboose in half by accident. So I made anothers t follow up behnd my 2cnd chrome RI&P General (when it's not doubleheading). The spotlight is a Maglight lens cap and reflector. I added a spotlightbecause seeing the black hatted gunfighter in low light is very hard. This helps (only seeing about 3v here, its very bright)

(an RI&P car)

I'll add more red/brown like on the bobber behind it "s0meday"The remaining leftover plastic  was saved after I repaired a caboose roof/ awning with a scrap piece.

I also recently shot this 2-4-2 and tanker with some etching primer to make a Nuclear Steamer for a Kusan reactor car. And a thingamagjigger car from what might be considered "rare" missle car (broken stands 😉)

Simple fun and few of my changes ever ruin even a semi-collectable   beyond revertability with standard repairs. I use water based craft acrylics mostly. It has proved to be removable in the sink years later. (I also often ask you folk who may want it before I paint or cut.  I even got a generous $150 offer for one I was simply gonna cut up  ...so ask first! 😉)

Todays fav. is my delivery trolly; Frankentrolly

Without reading all the posts....what brand and kind of paint do you use ? Thanks ...also ,any special tape ?

Nessmuck posted:

Without reading all the posts....what brand and kind of paint do you use ? Thanks ...also ,any special tape ?

Lots of variance in pants. Stick with one brand, one type (laytex, acrylic, enamel, lacquer.... chosen by plastic/metal/wood used)

Tape used is usually based on when you're pulling it and/or how strong the base coat is .   Regular masking tape can often make the best line, but it's most likely to pull up masked fresh paint/primer, especially if it stays on a long time. "Blue masking tape" or green have different levels of stickiness, read the label 😜

Cheap pinstipe usually makes for good fine line masking.

Try a topic search here (upper left menu); dozens of threads on painting in general as well as situationally themed. 

Thanks....I’ve been painting cars since 1976....Tri color Pearls, Base Coat Clear coat.....weined on Lacquer....Enamel, acrylic enamel....you name I’ve sprayed it. So was interested what you used.

This sub was a bobber tank car from a battery op. Wallmart train set. A model jeep sprue, 2-CO² pellet gun tanks, 2- magic marker ends for the prop cover/nozzles, 2-dollar store mini l.e.d. lamp arms, safty flint wheel from a bic lighter for a saw blade, Duco epoxy and a loose screw.... for the saw blade😬

Car is all fudgesicle sticks with bearing boxes stuck on.   

Popsicle sticks simple wont work 😜

(etching primer green, enamel silver, craft acrylic yellow.  If you put the silver on yellow/ bad reaction; put green on yellow/bad reaction; green on silver is ok if light,..... it's a matter of how "hot" paint is wet vs how strong the skinning pull is when the other is dy. Hot= penetration ability and usually also notes a flat laying paint, which often pulls hard sideway at the undercoat to/while it flattens/dries. That causes cracking, "gator skin" )

These all look great.  I'm looking forward to refinishing some of my old stuff some day.  I've got a lot of cheap stuff (mid-80's 027 cars with the garbage plastic trucks and no springs) that I can experiment on. 

I'm really keen on finding Norfolk Southern Decals for Locos and Cars in O gauge.  Not a lot of that going around.  What did you use for your NS Loco? 

Jeff_the_Coaster_Guy posted:

These all look great.  I'm looking forward to refinishing some of my old stuff some day.  I've got a lot of cheap stuff (mid-80's 027 cars with the garbage plastic trucks and no springs) that I can experiment on. 

I'm really keen on finding Norfolk Southern Decals for Locos and Cars in O gauge.  Not a lot of that going around.  What did you use for your NS Loco? 

Jeff, if you read some of the descriptions I've written, I mention mixing scales of decals quite a bit, using larger logo HO sets like for locomotives. On the Alco FA's I repainted, those were HO sets, save for the nose decal: Somewhere along the way I found some S scale Norfolk Southern decal sets and ordered a bunch while they were available.

Many times, true O scale decal sets will be too large for some applications on smaller 027 cars, though I do use either O or S scale capacity data. Microscale has been SLOWLY reissuing some O scale decals and my advice to anyone, is to buy them when you see them. It sends a message to Mircoscale that there is a market, and you don't know how long what you want will be available.

I will offer a differing viewpoint on truck sets: I don't think the plastic ones are garbage. Certainly no worry about zinc rot. Granted, I wish the Symington style hadn't been made, but it is what it is. Though I have plastic truck sets from the Kughn era of Lionel (mid-1990's) where the knuckles no longer spring open by themselves, whereas all my MPC era cars, the knuckles STILL spring open. Obviously a difference in the composition of the Delrin plastic used.

The biggest drawback to the plastic trucks is not the trucks themselves, but the rivet mounting that is standard. The truck sets are always loose, with quite a bit of wobble: This looseness is what causes derailments when backing up a train into tight curves.

I drill out all rivets and replace them with a truss screw and a lock nut. I tighten it all the way, then loosen it just enough for the truck to swivel left to right. I haven't had a derailment in years,  when running a train backwards though tight 027 curves, even with a light 8 inch MPC car pushing much heavier cars with die cast trucks!

Good idea on the trucks.  You're right, the reason I view them as junk has always been the wobble that I get.  I'll try what you mentioned (redrilling and using a truss head screw).

Will keep an eye out for decals.  Thanks.

Jeff_the_Coaster_Guy posted:

These all look great.  I'm looking forward to refinishing some of my old stuff some day.  I've got a lot of cheap stuff (mid-80's 027 cars with the garbage plastic trucks and no springs) that I can experiment on. 

I'm really keen on finding Norfolk Southern Decals for Locos and Cars in O gauge.  Not a lot of that going around.  What did you use for your NS Loco? 

Yes, not always easy to find NS decals in O Scale. You may want to try ShellScale Decals. I bought some O Scale decals from them last year. They sell sets for NS EMD locos, NS GE locos, NS Switchers & Slugs and they can be trimmed to fit your specific application.

Nice seeing modern roadnames on 027 rolling stock. I have a smattering of 027 boxcars in railroad roadnames (for a joke, I was going to video a string of them in the middle of a consist of 86' boxcars) and would have bought them in versions like your repaints as well had they been made.

BTW, have you ever considered using Smokebox Graphics' reflective striping, for that extra-modern look in low-light conditions?

---PCJ

(now you got me wondering what an 027-ized TTX high-cube boxcar would look like. Wouldn't take too much styrene to scratchbuild one )

Perhaps a silly question, but after you paint a base color on your car do you apply store bought decals, or print your own onto some kind of decal paper and apply. If the latter, may I ask your method?

Thank you

Paul

btw - greatly enjoying the thread - thanks for sharing.

Yeah I think I'll pick some of them up.

@brianel_k-lineguy: When you apply decals, do you first spray a gloss finish over the paint base, then go back over with a matte after the decal is on?  I've read that decals want a super gloss finish to adhere best. 

To answer the last two questions. @Railrunnin, I mostly use manufactured decals. Mostly Microscale, but also Hearld King (now out of business), Rail Graphics (also out of business), Industrial Models (not doing decals any longer) and Shell Scale. I do want to give the Tichy Train Group decals a try... they've got a pretty good selection.

Again, an advantage of redoing smaller cars like I am, is the ability to take advantage of HO decal sets made for larger rolling stock or locomotives. Some of the HO decals are just too small even for 027 items.

I think the color saturation on screen printed decals is the best. I have tried to use a laser jet, using the blank Microscale stock, but never had good results with that. I've since read that a special blank decal film is made by some companies especially for laser jet printers. But you still cannot do white lettering, unless you use white decal stock and print the background color around it... no easy task to get a computer printer to perfectly match a paint color, other than black. There are a whole bunch of various videos on YouTube about printing your own decals on a laser jet, the pros and the cons.

The yellow Conrail caboose on the first page of this thread, I did make the decals on a copy machine, using Microscale blank stock. I couldn't find a large enough CR logo in black. I printed out what I wanted on blank paper and then taped the Microscale stock directly over the printed area on the paper, making sure I was feeding the paper thru the machine the correct side up. I also did this when the machine was first turned on, to avoid any melting damage to the copy machine.

The Looney Toons circus car on the first page also, had color decals I had made for me, along with black decals I again printed on a commercial Xerox type machine.

@Jeff_the_Coaster_Guy, Yes that is correct. Decals won't adhere well to anything but I gloss surface. When I can, I use gloss paint. Sometimes the color I want is in a matt or satin finish, so then I put a coat or two of gloss on after the painting is done. I'm using spray cans, so it pays to be flexible. I've used this rust colored primer that is pretty darn close to a Tuscan red color. So there's an example of having to gloss coat after painting. After decaling and any detail painting is done, then I put on a couple coats of a flat clear non-yellowing finish.

RailRide posted:

BTW, have you ever considered using Smokebox Graphics' reflective striping, for that extra-modern look in low-light conditions?

I didn't know about that product. I should add it to my decal list on page one.

When I had a larger layout, I had a crossing gate with a vehicle waiting that had headlights, sort of like Menards is now offering. I had a couple locomotives with actual reflective striping on the frame. So when the train went by that, it was pretty cool.

I would be very proud to run any of these repainted cars on any of my layouts. 

The pigment count of screening ink is very very high. It's a pastey ink too vs  liquidy. (closer to art oil based tubes of paint)

Nessmuck posted:

Thanks....I’ve been painting cars since 1976....Tri color Pearls, Base Coat Clear coat.....weined on Lacquer....Enamel, acrylic enamel....you name I’ve sprayed it. So was interested what you used.

Same here, hot rods/buggies mostly, industry, and new home too.  Keep the "heat" of the paint in mind and go for it.

  Smaller pigment/effect is used in good model paints compared to "off the shelf". (a small metal flake sprayed onto a model looks like 1/16" flake job on the little car)

Model spray paint cans tend to be thinner, and lay flatter too (like a lacquer lays flatter than enamel and is normally thinner too)  (auto-vs houshold paints also have different finishes sometimes, auto needs more chemical resistance)     Flatter means less loss of detail.

Mixing paint brands is always iffy. Sometimes it works out though. Like today...

This is a Duplicolor satin Burgandy AND Rust-Oleum ruddy brown primer, both sprayed at once, brown then red then brown then red, no dry time.  I got lucky and they mixed well, giving me a closer match to Lionel RI&P red/brown than either paint alone. (I'm using hobby foil to guild the boiler on this bash shortened, bat. op., semi scale toy O engine...it will pull two lighted old west coaches (and it will likely get a tether to their rollers and a 3v regulator chip /bridge reg. to run off the track) It also has a slip clutch to protect it's creeper gearing.

Like a few others here on the forum like Choo Choo Charlie, I have always have some project going on. So here's some recent ones of my own. Captions/descriptions below each photo.

As the tooling investments from the train companies are lop-sided to the scale end, sometimes you have to take matters into your own hands. I've always wanted a deep well container car that would run on 027 curves, and not look out of place with other "027 scale" rolling stock.

This is a converted short MPC era flat car that I made new sides for. The ladders are cut down from longer K-Line metal ladders and the other suggested details and from little things that I had in my scrap box.

The bottom container is one of the short Lionel ones used in a pair for the traditional flat cars. I cut the bottom off and it inserts to the flat car surface via a piece of foam... the same kind of foam I use for my giraffe car actuators.  The container on top has the wheels and mountings removed, and sits on the lower container via some thin foam pieces. I have to print out the J.B. Hunt Intermodal decals for this container.

I never intended this to be a precise replica, though I did consult actual photos of the real thing. I instead wanted to make a replication, like I mentioned before, with painting in watercolors. I'm actually really happy with this one. And it clears everything on the layout (which I intentionally considered as I worked on the car).

I will always have affection for the Lehigh Valley. Lionel did a LV dump car sometime in the late 1980's, but it was a rather drab looking car in unpainted plastic. So I decided to repaint one in a little more exciting scheme, also making my standard improvements to these cars. On each side of the black dump base, you might notice in the photo, two pieces of wood on each side, that I cut and glue in place to add additional support to the plastic tabs on the car itself.

Probably not many people here take notice, but prices are way up on the shorter 027 cars, from what they were not too long ago. Then factor in shipping and you can easily pay $30.00 each for a short 027 train car. Since my layout is now the smallest I've ever had, I'm taking some of my longer traditional 0 cars and cutting them down, more to "027 scale." So the above gondola I think was an Industrial Rail one. I cut no more than an inch and a half out of the center and glued the two pieces back together, using some wood on the underside for bracing. This was the first of my "cut down" jobs and was pleased enough with the result to continue with more.

Same story for the flat car above, which was a typical Lionel traditional flat, that I cut a little more than an inch out of the center, glued and braced the two pieces together. I cut the angle supports off the flat car ends and screwed them into the car. And now I see how easy it is to photograph a car, not realizing one of the trucks is slightly off the rails. I didn't notice this until I uploaded the picture. Oh well.

This one above was one of those "I wonder if I could do that" projects. It started off as a 5000-series K-Line stock car. I carefully cut every other "board" out of the sides of the car. The chicken inserts are from the Lionel Chicken Sweep car. Yes, this is illuminated. I used a yellow 3M type scrubber bad, roughened up with a wire brush, to suggest hay on the floor of the car. The Foghord/Henry Hawk figure is from the larger Lionel operating car, which uses a rubber for operation. I mounted the figure to a thin piece of styrene, shaped like an "L" and mounted to the car floor at the far end of it. Then I put plastic wheel sets on one truck, BUT with the wheels flattened on one side. So as this car rolls down the track, the flattened wheels cause the car to rock a little bit... just enough to cause the Foghorn figure to move or vibrate in and out of the car about 1/4 to 3/8's of an inch.

Here's a couple of cars that get ZERO respect: The low end Kickapoo train set dump cars. Though as you can see here, when you paint them, they do look much better. I put metal wheel sets on them, and also some weights to the underside of the car. I came up with a little mechanism on my layout that operates these cars and causes them to dump their load. I also have a very simple operating forklift truck that I can use to load these cars up.

And this last photo for now is a good example of "this ended up being far more work than I imagined." In my quest for smaller 027 types of train cars that do look better on a small layout, the Lionel NYC Woodside reefer seemed like a candidate for shrinking without repainting and decaling. I basically shortened the length by cutting off 1 inch from each end of the car. Of course, then new truck mountings had to be made. I replaced the molded in ladder on the far side with a K-Line metal ladder from one of their traditional box cars. The doors (which shouldn't slide open anyways) are now glued in place. Like I said, it did end up being more work than I originally envisioned with all the grinding and cutting: It might have been easier to just scratch build one. But I managed to pretty closely match the brown paint on the car with spray paint, and then decided to do just the roof top in black. I do like the smaller size of the car now, and it looks much more at home with my other MARX style K-Line 5000 series cars. But next time? There's got to be an easier way, so I might just scratch build one.

Excellent models!! JohnA

Hi Brian- Figured I'd reply on your thread instead of on SWSat.

The car in question is a scratch build. I recently bought a Northeast Trains track cleaning car. I wanted to make it look like a MOW car and the results are what you see. The body is 100% scratch built except for the pipes. The body is styrene, and I added the stakes and piping/ pump system.

Been a long time since I did water-slides, the Long Island decals were a little touch and go but they came out nice. The others came from a set of Champ decals I had.

I plan to take a shot a weathering the car and will matte/clear-coat it after.

Nice Looking Rolling Stock!!  Great Job k-line guy.

VERY NICE WORK i like them all .

Brian,

Could you take some pictures of your layout? I would love to see it.

Thanks!

@brianel_k-lineguy posted:

And now for some more photos. First below is my most recent finished project. The original brake wheel stand was broken off, so I changed that. And it was missing the searchlight dome cover, so I made one from the plastic from a milk carton, along with this clear ribbed plastic stuff that is really made for kitchen shelf covering. Now some might argue the Disney figures are completely unprototypical. Depending on your feelings about the Penn Central... I have a friend who jokes the Penn Central was a Mickey Mouse operation, so maybe it's more realistic that it seems.

Next below is prototype and fantasy combined. I like the Norfolk Southern Enviro scheme that was used on one single engine, the 999. Norfolk Southern has no Alco FA's, but I do. I realized finding decals for the "wave" part of the white striping was going to be impossible. And doing an identical paint mask on each side was going to be a huge challenge. So I did a simplified version of that scheme and added a zero to the unit number, though I still have to make the number boards for this one.

Next is a shorty Lionel plug door box car. I know it's the wrong shade of blue for CSX rolling stock, but I like it over the dark blue that is normally used. RMT had issued one of their 2-bay hoppers in the CSX Coke Express scheme. But the RMT version had white lettering. I looked high and low to find a photo of that car with white lettering and could find none. So I did my own Coke Express hopper and stumbled upon this shade of blue. I knew it wasn't right (those hoppers were black) but I liked it. So then I did this box car also. We 3-railers are a funny breed, aren't we? Somethings bother us, even though they're accurate, and other things that aren't accurate, we like. Well... maybe NOT all of us.

This next one was inspired by a fantasy paint scheme MTH put on a Lehigh Valley steamer. This one below was one of those Lionel late 1980's DC only starter set engines. Aside from the paint scheme, I added weight to the engine, so it can pull a train now. I also added a headlight, handrails, some other details and moved the drawbar from the tender to make the engine and tender closer.

Next is a K-Line flat done up for NS. For some reason, K-Line had a thick round mounting on the body, where the trucks attach. I used a Dremel and sanded down the thickness of those, so that the car sets lower to the track and looks much better. I don't remember where I got the bars running along the deck surface... I cut them down from something... they hold items like these Tonka tractors in place. But I can also now put a whole variety of items on this particular flat car, which I like the flexibility of.

Next below, a Lionel woodside reefer. Aside from repainting, I also cut down the body mounts where the trucks get attached to the car, so that the car rides a little lower to the track and looks better with my other smaller more 027-ish rolling stock.

I might have posted this one on one of the Saturday Switcher threads. On my local division of the Norfolk Southern, there's some tight curves that the bigger engines just cannot maneuver through. So some Alco FA's had to be put into service. This was one of the older K-Line unpainted, molded plastic colored engines, either a Pennsy or Southern from one of the starter sets. Looks good to me now.

People forget and get jaded, but this is where it all started. This is where the fun began, and this is where the fun will always Well done!

when I set up the Christmas layout for the grandkids to play with under the tree their is an O-27 set where it all started for me a place of honor to remind everyone this is Lionel