Some store owners may be reluctant to sell an item for less than they paid for it. Everyone is different my thinking is it’s better at some point to cut your losses
Oh and I know that store in Nazareth.
In Dec at the OKC train show I bought an essentially new red Pennsy F3 from 1979 for ninety dollars and an early 70’s Milwaukee road F3 A with only flaking of the decal for 45 dollars. I wasn’t looking for either but could not turn down the price.
Store owners don't pay MSRP. However, they are in business to make money. Charlie
Again, interesting thread. One additional item on rolling stock that comes to my mind as I look at NOS or similar involves shipping cost. I may get zapped for this image but how do you justify this difference? I am equal distant between these two.
Of course I will be more prone to consider the shipping cost that is half of the other one. Both of these are "old" and not sure what the original was. However we can all see these are attractive compared to current production. they both have decent detail and metal sprung trucks.
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I struggle to understand the fixation on prices here.
Something is worth what a person is willing to pay. For the seller it is about how long they are willing to hold something to get their price.
Maybe a sellers price isn’t what you think it is worth, ok then there is no sale with you, maybe someone else will buy at the price the seller wants.
Seems like a lot of people focused on what price someone else should sell their goods for.
Rich, Your point is on the money (to make a pun
?) with the focus of the thread, how do you come to the benchmark you are willing to pay for a "normal" item? What logic do you use other than that occasional event where we have all been..... this rings my bell or will complete my collection of x and i must have it even if it costs $xxxxx.
I can’t speak for everyone but for me my wants far exceeds my wallet.
cpowell posted:Store owners don't pay MSRP. However, they are in business to make money. Charlie
They don't pay MSRP, BUT they do pay their bills from the mfgs. & after that that the longer it sits on the shelf - the more they lose in cash flow, & the resulting interest they could have gained by selling & getting the stuff off their shelves.
scale rail posted:There is a toy/train store I would buy building materials from when we lived on the mainland. They had shelf after shelf of old MTH, Lionel and many other brands of engines and cars. Most were years old and had outdated sound system and running equipment. They even had some S gauge cars that were made by companies that had been out of business for years. Everything to this day is full retail price. I don't get it. Don
What's not to get? It's a brand new item, isn't it? Assuming apples-to-apples features, the only value difference is lack of warranty. The OP thinks it's all worth 50%?
Ironically, I think this is one factor making folks less likely to want to be in this hobby. It's a very specific antiquated type of toy. At the incredibly high prices for scale locomotives and rolling stock today, it takes a special mentality to want to put that kind of money into something that even the true hobby aficionados don't value. Curious what the basis is for these opinions....
Mallard4468 posted:
Until relatively recently, I was unaware of the extent to which electronic components will deteriorate over time, even if they aren't used or abused. With that in mind, my thought process when buying NOS non-conventional engines is "if I have to put $200+ of repairs into it, will I still be happy with the deal?".
From some research I've done and personal experience the best bets for older command control locomotives are Lionel TMCC made in USA or Korea and MTH PS2 3V made in Korea. Those items have virtually no complaints about failure out of the box.
PJB posted:scale rail posted:There is a toy/train store I would buy building materials from when we lived on the mainland. They had shelf after shelf of old MTH, Lionel and many other brands of engines and cars. Most were years old and had outdated sound system and running equipment. They even had some S gauge cars that were made by companies that had been out of business for years. Everything to this day is full retail price. I don't get it. Don
What's not to get? It's a brand new item, isn't it? Assuming apples-to-apples features, the only value difference is lack of warranty. The OP thinks it's all worth 50%?
I should've been more clear. NOS rolling stock bears little risk. Agree with all the posts related to supply and demand. No concerns here and I'd suggest people pay what it's worth to them. If one is hard to find and completes a collection, you might pay over MSRP. I think we're all on the same page.
My main concern/question was about electronic-based locomotives. Newer versions generally have sound and some capability upgrades. Also, as several have mentioned, the new one comes with a warranty; NOS likely does not. Lastly, and this appears to be in contention, electronics might degrade over time or, worst case, not have replacement parts available. Remember the ERR uproar?
For those reasons, I believe locomotives' value declines over time much like style or fad-based products or even smartphones. I don't argue with retailers' attempts to try to sell NOS at original MSRP. I'm merely stating that I'm not willing to pay it just as I won't pay the 2010 price for an IPhone 5 today.
Let's try these more specific cases.
- Compare a NOS Polar Express junior Berk w/TMCC 1.0, one with LC, and a new one with LC+2. In this case, there's room for a seller to hold close to MSRP on the TMCC 1.0 and LC versions since those were probably around $300 - $350 and the LC+2 looks to have an MSRP of $500. But, if dealers discount new LC+2 to a street price of, say, $400, that has to have an impact on NOS.
- A Rail King Berk from 2004 with PS2 and an Imperial Rail King Berk from 2017 with PS3. MSRP has only gone up about 10%. In this instance, I think the NOS has been severely devalued by perhaps 50%.
For those like @rich883, if you "struggle to understand the fixation on prices here", then why take the time to ring in? I struggle to understand why people comment on others' threads when they're not interested in the subject. For example, I struggle to understand the concerns about paint or rivet-count accuracy, so I don't comment because it merely comes across as raining on their parades. The whole point of the forum, I think, is that people can and should discuss what's of interest to them. To each his own, no?
Ok so why someone will pay full MSRP, OR MSRP+, is ultimately their personal choice.
A brick and mortar store that tries to maintain their inventory at full MSRP, No matter how outdated that inventory is....is a retail business that at some point will operate at a loss, (unless he's buying at pennies on the dollar NIB and selling full retail as NIB because he has little invested and profits over the LONG hall). Not bad if one has deep pockets and can outwait the fickel market. But unwillingness to negotiate a price seems foolhardy if you have little invested and a willing buyer with a reasonable offer.
Of course that is a possible answer, Little investment, so not too concerned about WHEN something sells. Maybe something else sells and pays for whatever is left to sell. (Already recouped his investment...everything left is pure profit).
Don't know just thinking out loud.
justakid posted:Ok so why someone will pay full MSRP, OR MSRP+, is ultimately their personal choice.
A brick and mortar store that tries to maintain their inventory at full MSRP, No matter how outdated that inventory is....is a retail business that at some point will operate at a loss, (unless he's buying at pennies on the dollar NIB and selling full retail as NIB because he has little invested and profits over the LONG hall). Not bad if one has deep pockets and can outwait the fickel market. But unwillingness to negotiate a price seems foolhardy if you have little invested and a willing buyer with a reasonable offer.
Of course that is a possible answer, Little investment, so not too concerned about WHEN something sells. Maybe something else sells and pays for whatever is left to sell. (Already recouped his investment...everything left is pure profit).
Don't know just thinking out loud.
The think the premise here is assumes an incorrect fact. Retailers do not get to purchase product from the manufacturer at pennies on the dollar.
I deal with 30 plus small business owners on a monthly basis. I own buildings and they rent from me. I am fairly certain they all think when they pay me the average $0.20 per square foot per month rent it all goes into my entertainment account. After, taxes, insurance, principal, interest & repairs they are correct.
I watch some of them struggle because they refuse to drop the price of their inventory when it is definitely dated. It is hard to make that leap when it was your hard earned dollars that bought it in the first place. Over time a majority of them go out of business. It is sad but at least they had the chance to live the dream.
raising4daughters posted:PJB posted:scale rail posted:There is a toy/train store I would buy building materials from when we lived on the mainland. They had shelf after shelf of old MTH, Lionel and many other brands of engines and cars. Most were years old and had outdated sound system and running equipment. They even had some S gauge cars that were made by companies that had been out of business for years. Everything to this day is full retail price. I don't get it. Don
What's not to get? It's a brand new item, isn't it? Assuming apples-to-apples features, the only value difference is lack of warranty. The OP thinks it's all worth 50%?
I should've been more clear. NOS rolling stock bears little risk. Agree with all the posts related to supply and demand. No concerns here and I'd suggest people pay what it's worth to them. If one is hard to find and completes a collection, you might pay over MSRP. I think we're all on the same page.
My main concern/question was about electronic-based locomotives. Newer versions generally have sound and some capability upgrades. Also, as several have mentioned, the new one comes with a warranty; NOS likely does not. Lastly, and this appears to be in contention, electronics might degrade over time or, worst case, not have replacement parts available. Remember the ERR uproar?
For those reasons, I believe locomotives' value declines over time much like style or fad-based products or even smartphones. I don't argue with retailers' attempts to try to sell NOS at original MSRP. I'm merely stating that I'm not willing to pay it just as I won't pay the 2010 price for an IPhone 5 today.
Let's try these more specific cases.
- Compare a NOS Polar Express junior Berk w/TMCC 1.0, one with LC, and a new one with LC+2. In this case, there's room for a seller to hold close to MSRP on the TMCC 1.0 and LC versions since those were probably around $300 - $350 and the LC+2 looks to have an MSRP of $500. But, if dealers discount new LC+2 to a street price of, say, $400, that has to have an impact on NOS.
- A Rail King Berk from 2004 with PS2 and an Imperial Rail King Berk from 2017 with PS3. MSRP has only gone up about 10%. In this instance, I think the NOS has been severely devalued by perhaps 50%.
For those like @rich883, if you "struggle to understand the fixation on prices here", then why take the time to ring in? I struggle to understand why people comment on others' threads when they're not interested in the subject. For example, I struggle to understand the concerns about paint or rivet-count accuracy, so I don't comment because it merely comes across as raining on their parades. The whole point of the forum, I think, is that people can and should discuss what's of interest to them. To each his own, no?
Thanks for elaborating.
Your post gave me pause, as I never equated a toy train to an iPhone. To me, they are very different. An iPhone's entire purpose is use, as tool. Toy trains on the other hand are not tools. Their entire purpose is personal enjoyment, much like other things I collect, like comic books, Cuban cigars, and bourbon. In all cases (other than toy trains), folks covet the items, which leads to hobbyists appreciating vintage versions and happily paying higher prices to secure the items. Even cell phones now see vintage examples appreciating in value.
Based on all this, I couldn't get my mind around why folks in this hobby routinely bash the manufacturers, the products, and the prices. Or why prices plummet in value as soon as the items aren't absoutely fresh to the market. Even video games and vintage cell phones are now collectibles, with old video game cartridges routinely selling for thousands of dollars - even though the graphics and functionality are laughable by today's standards.
It's really unfortunate that maybe toy train hobbyists see these amazing items as "last year's" iPhones. Unfortunate for the hobby. Per my initial post, what hope does a hobby have when the entry price (for scale products) is incredibly high and even the staunchest hobbyists dont think the products have much value.
Thanks for your post - it's well taken.
NOS from the postwar era is by and large driven by what collectors are willing to pay - the newer stuff adds a twist due to the fragility of electronics and whether is it being purchased to run or be stored.
PJB posted:raising4daughters posted:PJB posted:scale rail posted:There is a toy/train store I would buy building materials from when we lived on the mainland. They had shelf after shelf of old MTH, Lionel and many other brands of engines and cars. Most were years old and had outdated sound system and running equipment. They even had some S gauge cars that were made by companies that had been out of business for years. Everything to this day is full retail price. I don't get it. Don
What's not to get? It's a brand new item, isn't it? Assuming apples-to-apples features, the only value difference is lack of warranty. The OP thinks it's all worth 50%?
I should've been more clear. NOS rolling stock bears little risk. Agree with all the posts related to supply and demand. No concerns here and I'd suggest people pay what it's worth to them. If one is hard to find and completes a collection, you might pay over MSRP. I think we're all on the same page.
My main concern/question was about electronic-based locomotives. Newer versions generally have sound and some capability upgrades. Also, as several have mentioned, the new one comes with a warranty; NOS likely does not. Lastly, and this appears to be in contention, electronics might degrade over time or, worst case, not have replacement parts available. Remember the ERR uproar?
For those reasons, I believe locomotives' value declines over time much like style or fad-based products or even smartphones. I don't argue with retailers' attempts to try to sell NOS at original MSRP. I'm merely stating that I'm not willing to pay it just as I won't pay the 2010 price for an IPhone 5 today.
Let's try these more specific cases.
- Compare a NOS Polar Express junior Berk w/TMCC 1.0, one with LC, and a new one with LC+2. In this case, there's room for a seller to hold close to MSRP on the TMCC 1.0 and LC versions since those were probably around $300 - $350 and the LC+2 looks to have an MSRP of $500. But, if dealers discount new LC+2 to a street price of, say, $400, that has to have an impact on NOS.
- A Rail King Berk from 2004 with PS2 and an Imperial Rail King Berk from 2017 with PS3. MSRP has only gone up about 10%. In this instance, I think the NOS has been severely devalued by perhaps 50%.
For those like @rich883, if you "struggle to understand the fixation on prices here", then why take the time to ring in? I struggle to understand why people comment on others' threads when they're not interested in the subject. For example, I struggle to understand the concerns about paint or rivet-count accuracy, so I don't comment because it merely comes across as raining on their parades. The whole point of the forum, I think, is that people can and should discuss what's of interest to them. To each his own, no?
Thanks for elaborating.
Your post gave me pause, as I never equated a toy train to an iPhone. To me, they are very different. An iPhone's entire purpose is use, as tool. Toy trains on the other hand are not tools. Their entire purpose is personal enjoyment, much like other things I collect, like comic books, Cuban cigars, and bourbon. In all cases (other than toy trains), folks covet the items, which leads to hobbyists appreciating vintage versions and happily paying higher prices to secure the items. Even cell phones now see vintage examples appreciating in value.
Based on all this, I couldn't get my mind around why folks in this hobby routinely bash the manufacturers, the products, and the prices. Or why prices plummet in value as soon as the items aren't absoutely fresh to the market. Even video games and vintage cell phones are now collectibles, with old video game cartridges routinely selling for thousands of dollars - even though the graphics and functionality are laughable by today's standards.
It's really unfortunate that maybe toy train hobbyists see these amazing items as "last year's" iPhones. Unfortunate for the hobby. Per my initial post, what hope does a hobby have when the entry price (for scale products) is incredibly high and even the staunchest hobbyists dont think the products have much value.
Thanks for your post - it's well taken.
I agree with you about hobbies being for enjoyment vis-a-vis a smartphone. The iPhone analogy dawned on me as I was thinking about the various threads on TMCC-Legacy-LC-LC+-LC+2. I get plenty of enjoyment out of my TMCC 1.0 engines, but as new technologies coming on the market now 15-20 years later, I feel like I want some of the new goodies much like some other new gadgets I don't really need but think are cool.
I think once the industry moved from conventional to electronic wizardry, some of this was inevitable and, my hunch, encouraged by the manufacturers.
Heck, for conventional operators, the postwar era items may even be better than modern conventional. I just sold off my last remaining modern conventional but retained everything postwar. But, in this electronic command control era, new technologies are replacing recent technologies in our toy trains.
Most of my O scale collection was acquired via Ebay. The majority of my freight cars could be considered new old stock. From day one I had set my limits to what I was willing to pay for anything I was interested in. I did my research too. If one came up at a high starting or "buy it now" price one most always came up later on at a more reasonable price. Occasionally a low price came with ultra high shipping charge. When it came to purchasing locomotives I have always preferred MTH Premier and only those with Proto Sounds 2.0 or higher. Often I've found that some earlier Proto 1.0 engines were going for MSRP even if they were 10 plus years old whether new in the box or not. I recently purchased an MTH Premier NYC Hudson lettered for the Big Four. Never run, mint condition and only the tender deck plate was loose. Was able to get the engine for $650.00 with shipping included. So, regardless of what a seller is asking the buyer should always make his or her own rules and limits. Educating ones self on the pros and cons of buying trains is important. Most of the comments on this thread make good sense and can be of great help to the new person in the hobby.
Ran into some related train and non-train events related to this thread in the past week or two.
I've been eyeing a Rail King NKP Berk and saw a NOS up from 2004 with PS up for auction at full 2004 retail. New ones with PS3 and warranty only 5% higher MSRP. So, I offered the seller 62.5% of his ask and was rebuffed with "sorry." I bought a new one with PS3 and warranty from Mr. Muffins for only $135 more than I offered for the 15 y/o piece.
At the same time, there's a set of Williams O27 NKP Alco FAs up for auction for $400. Original MSRP was $269. These are very rare, and I'm tempted, but then I'd be in for over $600 to convert to ERR components, so I'm passing. But, I was tempted.
Went to Dicks to pick up a pair of running shoes and found a pair of last year's model (same shoes, basically last year's color) for 20% off.
A previous poster mentioned that it takes a lot of money to run a brick-and-mortar LHS. Same can be said about any retailer, including a retailer of stocks (brokerage). Warren Buffet said the other day that a stock doesn't care what price you bought it at. I think the same can be said about engines (not so much rolling stock) in this electronic era. As new features come out like LC+2 and PS3, prior unsold versions have to be worth less.
raising4daughters posted:My personal feeling is that the new old stock is worth about half.
BINGO. You're buying an item w/o a warranty that may, or may not run.
On the dealer side, there are fixed costs for every month an item is inventoried. The longer the item inventoried, the less money is actually made on that item. Hold it too long, and they're upside down on the item. Macy's has an algorithm that mandates a sale price w/ a trigger date. Better to break-even than to lose money on an item.
If someone has 5+ yr NOS, they've already lost their shirt.
Several yrs ago my friend had a toy store, he sold a lot of collectible toys, die cast trucks, car and trains. I asked him when does he know what price to sell the collectibles. He said, don't anticipate making big bucks, sell it when you can make a buck on it, or you'll end up eating it.
Gilly@N&W posted:Macy's has an algorithm that mandates a sale price w/ a trigger date. Better to break-even than to lose money on an item.
If someone has 5+ yr NOS, they've already lost their shirt.
I think you're right though rare items like that Williams set of Alcos will always provide exceptions. In the base of the RK Berk though, the new one looks the same and is better equipped and warranted. No comparison.
I think recent history that saw the soaring in value of Postwar items is still in a lot of people's minds. Not only did they retain value, they increased. They were like beanie baby, royal dalton, and hummel figures.
But, now, in the tech era, engines are becoming more like 3-rail mobile computers and have more in common with smartphones and tech products, maybe even faddish clothing as in your Macy's example. Would anyone buy a 15 year-old smartphone or computer today for 2004 MSRP when a new one with warranty, more power, memory, speed might be the same price or less?
I just sold a pair of GPs (one power, one dummy) with a pullmor motor and TMCC 1.0 from the late 90s or early 2000s for $135. Not a single offer from the forum and only one at auction. Unpopular road name hurt, but I think this shows that even gently-used products with outdated electronics are worth as little as 25% of original MSRP.
I have not sold any thing since a T&P consist in the very early days of the Forum. If one is looking at unloading a collection today of NOS, or high quality used stuff, it seems to me that packing and shipping of locomotives has now become an economic deterrent to selling unless one can find a buyer who can pick it up at your place himself. I recently gave away and shipped four featherweight panel meters and the cost to ship UPS sans insurance and packing was $24 and change.
I priced shipping a N&W big-shouldered "Water Buffalo" mountain type steamer with a now fleeting thought of having GRJ upgrade it with TMCC . I priced the basic weight and dimension cost of UPS, USPS or Fed EX: plus insurance and using a $10 Overstock Inc, outer carton and $5 packing materials, I soon realized that shipping + return cost could reach over $100 just to get it to GRJ for upgrade and back. I favor the engine as a keeper so it sits on the layout in conventional mode and has never been operated, but I doubt I could get $200 for it($100 estimated net).
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I am of divided heart about this issue.
I benefit from the phenomenon because I purposefully wait until the perceived value tanks before I buy--I can't afford the hobby any other way.
But the corollary is that I *prefer* the outdated electronics--in fact, I prefer NO electronics. So I am satisfied with the older equipment.
Lots of good comments here that are pertinete to our hobby and the changing nature of it. I had a retail hobby shop back in the mid 1980s and got into trains in 1988 or so. Knew virtually nothing about the train business and then current state of the hobby. Bought a lot of stuff from distributors and individuals to 'stock the store' but I mostly bought what I liked!
Looking back now, I see that I came into this almost at the peak frenzy of the 'collecting' crowd buying everything that Lionel made and then what the new MTH produced convinced that it was all rising in value. Anyone remember the 'extra' Santa Fe B unit in the Lionel 'Stocking Stuffer' that went with the 1990 Santa Fe F3 ABA set? Richard Kughn said "He didn't get one either". These were fetching as much as $500 shortly after release. Many such items went nuts with the collectors.
Look at most trains shows of today. You will see vast tables full of modern rolling stock that has been carried around for 20-30 years now still in their boxes and sitting unsold. At least most postwar trains were actually played with and enjoyed by little boys and girls and Dads and Moms back in the day. Not so with post 1970s trains for the most part. Yet, dealers will load and unload these boxes of stuff to train shows for years and the trains will never see the light of day!
The value of motive power as posted by the OP is a greatly different issue as stated so eloquently by many posts above but my astonishment is with the rolling stock and many accessories out there that are essentially useless.... :-)
Dewey Trogdon posted:I priced shipping a N&W big-shouldered "Water Buffalo" mountain type steamer ...but I doubt I could get $200 for it.
That's a 3rd Rail Brass model of the K3. Even not-running it's easily worth $350 plus shipping .
Not to mention the preponderance of new product being pumped into the marketplace all the time by the manufacturers. Fortunately, there is quite a bit of new scale oriented equipment coming out for that segment of the hobby but how many more 'traditional' sized boxcars, tank cars, gondolas and the like can we take? It seems that our hobby is beginning to shrink in numbers and many of us who are still active have almost everything we 'need', so who is buying all this new product from the big four and others?
c.sam posted:Lots of good comments here that are pertinete to our hobby and the changing nature of it. I had a retail hobby shop back in the mid 1980s and got into trains in 1988 or so. Knew virtually nothing about the train business and then current state of the hobby. Bought a lot of stuff from distributors and individuals to 'stock the store' but I mostly bought what I liked!
Looking back now, I see that I came into this almost at the peak frenzy of the 'collecting' crowd buying everything that Lionel made and then what the new MTH produced convinced that it was all rising in value. Anyone remember the 'extra' Santa Fe B unit in the Lionel 'Stocking Stuffer' that went with the 1990 Santa Fe F3 ABA set? Richard Kughn said "He didn't get one either". These were fetching as much as $500 shortly after release. Many such items went nuts with the collectors.
Look at most trains shows of today. You will see vast tables full of modern rolling stock that has been carried around for 20-30 years now still in their boxes and sitting unsold. At least most postwar trains were actually played with and enjoyed by little boys and girls and Dads and Moms back in the day. Not so with post 1970s trains for the most part. Yet, dealers will load and unload these boxes of stuff to train shows for years and the trains will never see the light of day!
The value of motive power as posted by the OP is a greatly different issue as stated so eloquently by many posts above but my astonishment is with the rolling stock and many accessories out there that are essentially useless.... :-)
Back in the late 80's when Williams came out w/their Challenger, if you pre ordered one it cost approx. $1k. If you didn't get one, a month later they were selling for $1.8k - $2k. Now you can purchase a NOS Wm's Challenger for $500.
The longevity of many is showing clearly in this tread, which creates a very skewed view of the marketplace. Akin to those who purchased an LP in 1970, then an 8 track, then a cassette, then a CD, and down have digital download all of the same original recording.
In terms of trains, many adults with younger kids coming into the hobby don't recall the late 1980's -- because they were not born yet, nor does the fact that MTH released X engine in PS1, then PS2, then PS2 again, and now in PS3 mean anything to them.
On rolling stock paying original 2000 MSRP is akin to a 50% discount off the current catalog from Lionel or MTH, whose prices have risen greatly in the past couple of years. Seeking to pay 50% off the 2000 price on rolling stock, which might have been reissued but is the same molding, trucks, paint, etc., is solely the buyer looking for a bargain without any justification based upon product quality, warranty, etc. It is wishful thinking or pure supply and demand.
I suggest spending a lot more time looking at prices realized at auctions, train shows, and speaking with buyers and sellers, than asking generalized questions here. The members of this forum can all voice their views on pricing, however the market data may well show a very different reality -- one that takes into account the much larger scale of of hobby than is seen here. Lionel and MTH aren't getting by on the couple of dozen "new catalog released" thread relies that say "maybe I'll buy one engine this year," the scope of the marketplace is not the scope of the OGR forum.
I've thought the market seems saturated and that's why the prices are down on used so much. As the boomers continue to retire and downsize, the 100 engine collections are all going on the market.
I have never paid more than 1/3 MSRP on 1990s Lionel engines, but I bought them 10 - 15 years later. And these are items that have never been reissued.
From my visits to recent train shows it seems as though prices of P/W, MPC , early 90's and dated NOS conventional equipment have dropped substantially. As the market trends have shifted towards remote and complex electronic control operation, this has had a dramatic effect on the pricing of older equipment. Then add in all the reissues over the years and there are bargains galore. Its a great time for those entering the model rain hobby today
I agree Dennis and several others. I had a couple of boxes of my fathers trains in storage for many years. After resurrecting his pre/post railroad this year, I was astonished by the prices of the NEW trains.
Prices of the NOS locomotives and post war stock has allowed me to try out some of the more recent products and options, with our breaking the bank. Throw in an occasional sound upgrade or boxcar with sound, and I'm a happy man!
My most recent buy was a beautiful O Scale TMCC steamer with lots of goodies at less than half it's original cost. With a little patience, and "right place at the right time" luck, those new to the market have a price they can afford. Good for everyone!
Lion
I'll buy freight cars new, as at less than $100 I'm fine forking over the money. I have specific taste in what freight cars I want so when something comes out in the latest catalog that catches my eye I'll order it.
Now as others have said going for NOS locomotives has been the way to go. There is really no other way I could have afforded to buy the 3 scale steam locomotives I own if I bought them brand new when they first were released. If one is going that route they can save a bunch of money and get exactly what they wany by buying NOS. I'm not knocking anyone who orders/buys stuff from a catalog and pays close to MSRP. We would all do that, if we could afford it.
While I am downsizing, I have sold over 20 of my premier engines. While I only ask and get 50% of my purchase price, I think it is a good deal. I had a great time getting 37 trains running simultaneously (more than 50 engines) and now I am trying to make the rebuilt layout a little more grandchildren friendly (only two trains per track instead of 4/5).
SURFLINER posted:Big Consideration to be taken into account when purchasing NOS. Mfgs. have put limits on how long after production they warranty their products. So, unless you cut a "warranty agreement with the seller" - you got squat if something goes wrong. BBW!
From the Lionel Warranty statement on their website...
"Products that are more than 3 years old, from date of manufacture, are not applicable for warranty coverage, even if they have never been sold prior to this date. (Under no circumstance shall any components or labor be provided free of charge.)"
winrose46 posted:While I am downsizing, I have sold over 20 of my premier engines. While I only ask and get 50% of my purchase price, I think it is a good deal. I had a great time getting 37 trains running simultaneously (more than 50 engines) and now I am trying to make the rebuilt layout a little more grandchildren friendly (only two trains per track instead of 4/5).
I feel that your asking prices for the engines you sold were more than fair plus you have gotten rid of what you needed to and the money you received can be put towards something else. When I see sellers asking almost full price for an engine that is 10 plus years old, regardless of whether or not it is new in the box and never run, it just isn't realistic in my opinion especially since the engine is no longer under warranty. Also, the cost of upgrading an MTH Proto 1.0 engine isn't cheap and if you are unable to do the conversion yourself then the price goes up.
I like walking into a hobby shop and seeing a decent selection of NOS rolling stock and accessories. I have been known to pay more than the original MSRP for a find in shops. Locomotives are another matter. If it isn't fully functional, has all the latest features and is no longer under warranty then it will need to be marked down for me to buy.
