Problem with MTH engine - Ives 3243R

It's Proto 2 and the battery is 17 years old! You need a new battery and a good charge. How long do the sounds play once power is killed to the track? Also, try on the DCS forum and ask for GGG. He fixed one of my old MTH engines. Have you lubed the axels and gears and checked for any binding? 

That is a really neat engine and I would be reluctant to return it. It should be fixable.

George

Well? I don't have any of these. The usual stuff is something binding? Roller pick-up wheels need lube? Engine needs lube.

Just how old is this? Battery dead? Grease dried up inside?

Edit: Ooops George replied while I was typing.

Fellas, I should have stated earlier: I did not put the engine on the track until I replaced the dreaded white battery with a BCR.  So it has a BCR in it.

And I did lube the gears with Labelle's 106.  I oiled all the wheels and pick-ups with Labelle's 107.

beachhead2 posted:

Fellas, I should have stated earlier: I did not put the engine on the track until I replaced the dreaded white battery with a BCR.  So it has a BCR in it.

Oh, great! Good start. I would go with Engineer-Joe's recommendations.

If you wanted to take the motor out, you could check the condition of the tack strip on the flywheel and clean any dirt out of the gears. The engine was made in 2001, so at 17 years old, the grease can dry up. You can also check the condition of the gears to make sure there is nothing in them and no broken teeth.

Otherwise, send it to GGG. 

George

I use Labelle oil and grease. It's great!

Well, last items are tack strip, binding, broken gear teeth. After that, it's a job for a pro.

George

Hey Beachhead,

I purchased a new (old stock) Green 3243 set from Sidetrack in 2014.  I had the same issue.  It ran on straight track but was jerky on curves. It had a brand new battery and no wear on the mechanism.  

I contacted MTH and found out there was a program update that was not on the web site. MTH sent me two files. 

I live near Stockyard Express in Oberlin, Ohio and took the engine to Bryan who is a wiz at MTH repairs.  He hooked up his computer and upgraded the program installed a BCR and the engine runs perfectly. I am not sure which of the two files is in my green 3243. I highly recommend Stockyard for fixing any MTH issues.

I have never uploaded anything but photos and videos but I will try to upload the MTH programs.  At least you can  see the file names and get the files direct from MTH.

Hopes this helps.

Jim Z

Jim Z posted:

 

I contacted MTH and found out there was a program update that was not on the web site. MTH sent me two files. 

 

Whoa!  Now that is interesting.  I definitely need to do this update.  However, I have a few things on my plate (so to speak!) in coming days.  I shall report back.  Thank you.

I have this engine in Orange and had the same problem. Last time it ran was 2012. Will get an update.

Video

F&G RY posted:

I have this engine in Orange and had the same problem. Last time it ran was 2012. Will get an update.

Video

Jim C,

I would  like to thank you for posting this  video back in 2012.  It was the one you tube video that inspired my layout which I built in 2017.  It is very similar but a little smaller than yours but essentially the same track plan. Hope you get your orange set running properly!

Jim Z

WHITE IVES UPDATE - the seller offered to service the engine for me (update the firmware).  I received it back today.  I immediately put it on the track and unfortunately it still hesitated somewhat when it started.  It was much improved but the jerkiness was still apparent.  I took it off the track and applied some more grease and oil.  I wasn't optimistic that would improve things because it looked pretty good already.  I put it on my big STD 72 Christmas tree loop which is about 16 feet long.  I decided to let it race around the loop a little bit.  Other than the jerky starting, the other immediate concern was it was unresponsive until the throttle was at 5.  It creeped along at 10.  I had to dial it up to 30 just to cruise along at a moderate clip.  To compare, my other MTH engines are really flying at 25 and over 30 I'd be concerned about them tipping on curves.  While I was sitting there thinking about the lack of speed, the engine started emitting a rather high pitched scraping noise.  The noise stopped when I stopped the engine.  But now it makes that noise anytime it's moving at anything faster than a crawl.  So I think I'm out of patience with this deal.  I've contacted the seller about a return for refund.  So long white Ives set.  I hardly knew ye! 

Wow.  First this is a PS-2 5V engine and the files shown for a different engine that is PS-2 3V are not compatible.  Because there is a problem with one TP model does not mean a different one has that issue.

Second, no firmware update for 5V board.  He may have reloaded the sound file.  This sounds more mechanical and could have been gear lash and such especially for an electric.  Jerky at slow speed (DCS) is possible until it is broken in and even then it may not smooth out until above 5 which it seemed it did.

Also more about Power Supply and how in operation could effect this.  G

GGG, I said he updated the firmware but that's just me playing loose with terminology.  I suspect he reloaded the sound file as you say but I don't know.  I ran the engine conventionally using a Lionel PH-180 and a MTH Z-controller.  And I ran it with DCS also with the PH-180.  In any case, seller accepted a return for refund so I've washed my hands of it.

I have the 3243R set in Red with gold lettering. I ran it briefly when I received the set. I was told their are screws in the front and rear trucks that need to be loosened slightly that will bind if too tight, and cause the jerkiness. It has been packed away so I have not been able to check yet. I hope to do this soon

Joe Gozzo

Your tach reader is not in the right position. I was having a similar issue with an MTH/ Ives 3236. I took it to MTH. Jon ran it around the test track and said let me look at this. He made a slight adjustment to the tach reader and the engine ran smooth from that point on.

Scott Smith

Thanks all for the advice, I have a green one that 'chugs' at low speed, but rips when the voltage increases. Be aware: the can motor engines sometimes have a poor gear mesh between the motor worm gear and that brass worm wheel that it connects too. I have had to remove the motor bracket, drill out the holes in the frame that the screws go through, then reinstall the motor bracket and check the mesh. That grinding sound is probably the edges of the worm wheel get machined down. If you catch it quick and make the adjustment, you may not need a new worm wheel.  You can still find that part, but it will become scarce quickly, as so many of the Contemporary standard gauge locos use that gear and have that problem. Once you do the mod, I think the loco will be good for a long time.

Jim

To all, thank you for sharing all of this information. I just received my 10-1231 Ives 3243R and three passenger cars. All of this is nearly, if not new and has not been run in many years if ever. I’ll replace the battery, and download the software etc before I attempt to run this. I didn’t know about the screws or the software update. All good information. Now if I can just find an original Ives 3243R. Thanks.

There is a problem with some of the protodrive motors where the play in the axle bearing causes it to disengage with the tach flywheel.  The symptom is the loco will run fine, but occasionally speed up and lurch.  The chinese solution was to hammer the crap out of the pickup plate that presses on the axle bearing below the tach gear.  The purpose of the hammering is to raise the metal on the pickup to put more pressure on the bearing.  If you can pull the wheel away from the tach gear, i.e., if the axle can slide up and down the slot in the frame, it is too loose.  I usually add silver solder to the top of the pickup to put more pressure on the bearing or hammer the pickup more to raise the metal.  Also, if the motor holddown clamps are "cupped" up, they were stamped the wrong way and can cause the motor to rock in the frame of the locomotive.  The rocking can cause the tach gear to disengage if the axle has too much play.  Replacement clamps are available from MTH.

My olive green MTH 3243R was only fixed from the jerkiness by a firmware update by Jon Grasson (I see he responded with a solution to a related problem. We had replaced the tach sensor, I had verified the alignment of that sensor, it was only the firmware update that solved the problem for my locomotive.

Jim

@Jim Z posted:

Hey Beachhead,

I purchased a new (old stock) Green 3243 set from Sidetrack in 2014.  I had the same issue.  It ran on straight track but was jerky on curves. It had a brand new battery and no wear on the mechanism. 

I contacted MTH and found out there was a program update that was not on the web site. MTH sent me two files.

I live near Stockyard Express in Oberlin, Ohio and took the engine to Bryan who is a wiz at MTH repairs.  He hooked up his computer and upgraded the program installed a BCR and the engine runs perfectly. I am not sure which of the two files is in my green 3243. I highly recommend Stockyard for fixing any MTH issues.

I have never uploaded anything but photos and videos but I will try to upload the MTH programs.  At least you can  see the file names and get the files direct from MTH.

Hopes this helps.

Jim Z

Jim, Do you know if the 2 files you were sent also apply yo the 3245?

Thanks,

Joe Gozzo

I don’t know! I suggest you ask Bryan at Stockyard Express  in Oberlin Ohio.  He is very knowledgeable and can be reached by phone.

Jim