purchase of PS1

I think it's a buyer's market for MTH PS1 locomotives.

Since having DCS during the past 3 years, my MTH PS2 and 3 locomotives are my favorites. Love the way they run prototypically slow and smooth on my layout. However, I still occasionally run my PS1s, which all look, sound and smoke great, so I'm content with them.

I purchased a new old stock Lionel Santa fe F-3 AA at the last York show. The B unit was on display and the AA units were sealed never opened in their boxes. The engine was made in 1993 and it took about three hours of service work to get it running, for one example the upper armature shafts were seized and rusted to the bearings in the brush caps. I'm fortunate to be able to most of my own work. I truly didn't expect it to be in that condition.

Usually, they pretty much run as long as you change the battery before starting it up the first time.  I have a bunch of PS/1 stuff that I've converted or am busy converting now, and I've run across minimal issues.

I still run PS1 models that have been in operation since 1997. In my opinion, the electronics are robust, but they tend to run fast because they don't have speed control. Install a BCR before you attempt to run. New York Central P-2b electric motor is an example.

MELGAR

Thanks for the thoughts......I have been running DCS and certainly like the speed control - however, don't mind lately adding some conventional.   My desire for locos is outpacing the budget for new PS3 equipment!

Also, early PS1 are very picky with transformers. I've run into this especially with the 'MT-XXXX' early models before they went to '30-XXXX' naming convention.

I have to agree with PRRick on this.

I have three "brand new old stock" Baldwin AS-616 diesels that I cannot get to run using my MTH Z1000 or Z4000 transformers. There is some problem between the sound chip and the microprocessor reading each other on the sine wave produced by these two transformers.

Put a later PS1 sound chip in the Baldwin (BNSF Dash 8 for instance) and the engine comes to life and moves out of the "reset" mode using the Z1000 controller, but it won't move if I usae the Z4000 controller. Also, I can't get the AS-616 chip to work in the BNSF Dash 8....no matter what transformer I use......go figure.

It appears this problem is only associated with some of the early MTH products starting with the MT xxxxx serial numbers, but not all of them!!!

All I can say is, good luck, and try starting them with a very low voltage...say around 5-8V's, and turn the controller down real slow to zero, wait 2 seconds and then re-power, and hopefully it will leave the "reset" mode and move forward.

Whatever you do.......DON'T USE THE DIRECTION BUTTON TO LOWER THE VOLTAGE WHILE IT IS STILL IN THE "RE-SET" MODE!!!!! Once it leaves the "re-set mode, and starts moving forward (joy upon joy), you can use the "Direction" button to stop it, and get it to go into reverse.

Good luck msp!!!!

Peter.....Buco Australia

Buy it, IF you can return it. If not, your $$$ is at risk. If you provide an MTH MPN, a reasonably better assessment can be made by the repair gurus.

Worst come to worst, I just replace the board set and/or pick up the updated chip from MTH if a customer still wants to run PS/1.

There are some (?perhaps many) PS1 locos that do not work well with transformers that don't put out a pure sine wave.  An example was the ancient and unloved Lionel MW from the 1990s.  QSI designed the PS1 system for MTH to work best with old time postwar transformers such as the ZW, LW, 1033, etc.  Or at least that's what I've been told.  These old transformers were pure sine wave devices.  Perhaps this is part of the problem with some of the modern (even MTH) transformers and some PS1 locos.  So if you have trouble with what you've got, reverting to a postwar reconditioned transformer is something to consider.

@charles mcdaniel posted:

I purchased a new old stock Lionel Santa fe F-3 AA at the last York show. The B unit was on display and the AA units were sealed never opened in their boxes. The engine was made in 1993 and it took about three hours of service work to get it running, for one example the upper armature shafts were seized and rusted to the bearings in the brush caps. I'm fortunate to be able to most of my own work. I truly didn't expect it to be in that condition.

Gee whiz I've never heard of this problem with MTH or any other brand.  I wonder if these were victims of flooding, or stored in a very damp place?

My MTH PS1 engines run great using MTH Z4000 transformers.

All of my PS1s have BCRs,  I initially charge them in reset mode for 30 seconds to 1 minute at 10 to 12 volts, and then reduce the voltage to 8 or 9 volts when I start them.

@msp posted:

Considering the purchase of a PS1 locomotive.  

Don't!

Not worth all the hassle as many have commented above.

I have many PS1's and regard them as the most unreliable engines due to their flaky control electronics. I converted all of them using the ERR (TMCC) module or using the MTH PS3 upgrade kit. They run fine now but it took many $$$ to convert.

To add to my prior post, I do have the PS1 versions of the PRR Turbine (not the bantam, but larger one), the dreyfuss, and a Amtrak Genesis, all Railking. They all have BCRs and function well.

To the best of my knowledge, there doesn't seem to be many problems with the PS1 "RailKing" models.

The problem is with the very early (original) QSI PS1's in the maroon colored MTH (Premier) boxes, before the "RailKing" line was introduced. If it's in a yellow/orange colored "RailKing" box, chances are it will work (at least with a Z1000 transformer).

Peter......Buco Australia

Conditions for buying a PS1, IMO...  you want to run conventional, and it is priced such that you can afford to repair or convert it to PS3.

Seems like the asking prices for PS1 engines have been rising recently, which makes no sense to me.  My rule of thumb is that a PS1 must be at least $300 cheaper than a comparable PS2 or PS3.

And of course, follow the advice in previous posts about BCR and proper transformer.

thanks - i have seen enough here - that is what this is QSI maroon box no 20-#

plus it is not priced right....$360 by the time i ship and add a battery.

PS1's are the best to buy for conversion projects.  Straight running as is?  Eh, I'd pass.

QSI still in business.  There is a website.

Jack, we're going out the north end

This video shows one of my favorite MTH PS1 locomotives, the Jersey Central FM Trainmaster:

IMO, it looks, sounds, smokes and runs great, and it has stood the test of time, having run flawlessly for over 20 years.

@Ron045 posted:

PS1's are the best to buy for conversion projects.  Straight running as is?  Eh, I'd pass.

Case in point Ron.  These are a pair of PS/1 A-A units, they've been converted to Lionel Legacy.  Still working on the B-Unit, I'm adding smoke and sound to it as well.  All three will have sound and smoke, and these two are powered.

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

Case in point Ron.  These are a pair of PS/1 A-A units, they've been converted to Lionel Legacy.  Still working on the B-Unit, I'm adding smoke and sound to it as well.  All three will have sound and smoke, and these two are powered.

They look really nice. 

What is the cost to upgrade to PS3?

About $350.

$200 for the upgrade kit; $150 for an expert installer to include back and forth shipping. Your mileage may vary.

@msp posted:

What is the cost to upgrade to PS3?

Choose your upgrade and model wisely.  I left the DCS world for upgrades simply because most of the time it was only cost effective for Premier steam engines.

Let's look at one of our sponsors prices.  It's a popular vendor that ends in a "Z".

MTH GP38 PS1 $214, add in @Bruce Brown estimate for a PS3 upgrade and you are at $564.

The same vendor sponsor has an MTH GP38 PS3 for $429.

If you can do it yourself, the price is about the same.  But even then, why not get the newer more detailed model?

Ron