Questions about "Traditional" boxcar size.

In a nutshell, K-Line’s Classic series, Industrial Rail, and MTH’s Rugged Rails boxcars are all 6464 size, and compatible with Lionel in dimensions and profile. Williams, and MTH’s Railking line are bigger.

From left to right:

MTH’s Rugged Rails

Industrial Rail by Atlas

Lionel Traditional Line

K-Line Classic

Except for Lionel, all have metal trucks, adding weight for better tracking. Lionel does make traditional sized boxcars with metal trucks, but you need to read the item box end flaps for features to be sure.

In K-Line terminology, 6-XXX equals "traditional" or 6464 size box cars. 7-XXX equals scale size boxcars.

There is no universally accepted use of the terms "traditional" or "semi-scale" or "postwar" size. The terms are used differently by different people so there is no accepted/actual meaning, except to say these terms mean cars that are all smaller than actual 1/48 scale size.

@Eilif posted:

Good Morning,

         After about a decade of dabbling in O Gauge Christmas layouts, I'm taking small steps to standardize my collection a bit  I've settled on what I think is the Lionel "Traditional" size of boxcar like the one below...

... and I have a few questions.

-Is "Traditional" the accepted term for this size rolling stock?  I've been trying to research and see folks talking about 6464, and various 9000 series and I'm a bit confused.

Yes, "traditional" is the accepted term for this size rolling stock. With Lionel's introduction of 6464 boxcar in 1953, their traditional-size boxcar has been 10-1/2" long. Some of Lionel's new boxcars are called "6464 boxcar" in the item name, for example, the #6464-25 GREAT NORTHERN CHRISTMAS BOXCAR.

An "O27" boxcar will be smaller. A "scale" boxcar will be 1:48 scale and larger. "Standard O" will be scale-sized and thus larger.

-What's the blanket term for these boxcars that though coming in various configurations seem to all have the same basic dimensions?   

"Traditional."

-Are there other brands and models of boxcars that share these dimensions?   I'm not wedded to Lionel-only and I'm open to other brands, especially if there is a cost savings.

See @Mark V. Spadaro's excellent response above.

-Does the "6-xxxx" in the model name indicate this size?

Yes and no.

The 10-1/2" Postwar boxcars will be 6464-x, 6464-xx, or  6464-xxx. (Double door boxcars will be 6468 or 6468-25.) Here is a great primer on Lionel' Postwar boxcars: http://www.tandem-associates.c...nel/lionelcarbox.htm

Lionel's MPC-era 10-1/2" boxcars are the 9200 series, the 9700 series, and the 9400 series. Their item numbers will be 6-92xx, 6-97xx, and 6-94xx. The 9700 series and the 9400 series use the same mold a the 9200 series.

Primers:

https://www.trainz.com/pages/g...-9200-series-boxcars

https://www.trainz.com/pages/the-guide-to-lionels-9700-series-boxcars

https://www.trainz.com/pages/t...-9400-series-boxcars

I believe that the boxcars in Lionel's Traditional O line today use the 9200 series mold unless they are called a 6464 boxcar or have a different adjective in the item name, e.g. "waffle-sided," "hi-cube," or "end door." The length will be listed as either 10-1/2" or 10".

See my red-text responses above in-line.

Thanks so much Folks.

I really appreciate the responses.  I'll be looking into K LINE and Industrial Rail lines also.

What's the width like on the Rugged Rails? It's pretty, but I'm getting the feeling it might irk me the same as the Menards does.

Looks like I've got some reading and researching to do.

@Eilif posted:

Thanks so much Folks.

I really appreciate the responses.  I'll be looking into K LINE and Industrial Rail lines also.

What's the width like on the Rugged Rails? It's pretty, but I'm getting the feeling it might irk me the same as the Menards does.

Looks like I've got some reading and researching to do.

…….”compatible with Lionel in dimensions and profile.”

@Eilif posted:

Thanks so much Folks.

I really appreciate the responses.  I'll be looking into K LINE and Industrial Rail lines also.

What's the width like on the Rugged Rails? It's pretty, but I'm getting the feeling it might irk me the same as the Menards does.

Looks like I've got some reading and researching to do.

Examples are pretty cheap, pick up some representative samples and see what you think.

Will keep an eye out and a ruler handy at the next train show.

Hmm: should I really toss the cat amongst the pigeons and bring up the 027-sized cars?

If you want to keep your boxcars virtually interchangeable, @Mark V. Spadaro provides really good advice. You'll be happy with MTH Rugged Rails, Industrial Rail, and K-Line's (not K-Line O Scale Classics). I have a couple Williams and MTH Rail King and he's right, they are a bit bigger.

@Eilif posted:

Good Morning,

         After about a decade of dabbling in O Gauge Christmas layouts, I'm taking small steps to standardize my collection a bit  I've settled on what I think is the Lionel "Traditional" size of boxcar like the one below...

... and I have a few questions.

-Is "Traditional" the accepted term for this size rolling stock?  I've been trying to research and see folks talking about 6464, and various 9000 series and I'm a bit confused.

-What's the blanket term for these boxcars that though coming in various configurations seem to all have the same basic dimensions?   

-Are there other brands and models of boxcars that share these dimensions?   I'm not wedded to Lionel-only and I'm open to other brands, especially if there is a cost savings.

-Does the "6-xxxx" in the model name indicate this size?

-Are there terms to know or be aware of that would differentiate these from slightly larger boxcars like those Menards sell?

I know it's nitpicky, but -though nicely painted and good running- to me my sole Menards boxcar looks out of place next to the others and I'll probably sell it.  The larger size is the same reason that I've avoided their most of their other rolling stock.  Exceptions being plastic flat cars, modern tank cars and at since point I may pick up some of the recent ore cars.  I've gotten rid of the few tiny 8.5 inch boxcars I had (looked more like S Scale), a couple of similarly undersized K-line cars (maybe around 9 inches?)  and also an old Atlas accurately-scaled 40' boxcar that dwarfed the rest of my boxcars.

Any other advice or terms I should know would be appreciated.

I would like to add another part to this, in real railroading there is no such thing as standard. Box cars came in all size and shapes. The first time I looked back from the left hand seat it amazed me no one car was the same........

@ThatGuy posted:

I would like to add another part to this, in real railroading there is no such thing as standard. Box cars came in all size and shapes. The first time I looked back from the left hand seat it amazed me no one car was the same........

I agree completely. As it happens, in HO I have a wider variety of rolling stock. 

Thinking about it with O gauge though, I notice it more and visually and have settled on the 6464 to be my guide for height (Hi Cubes excepted) width, and -to a slightly lesser extent- length.

This hobby is amazing in the diversity it provides to everyone...if you want to collect variations in paint or decals or truck-types you can spend a life time doing so. If you want to collect cars decorated for a certain road name you can spend a life time doing so. Pre-war only, post-war only, MPC only, LTI only... If you are a techie you can spend your time writing programs to run your layout from your phone while your on vacation in Tahiti...and if you want to collect only boxcars of a certain size and shape you can do that too! 

One more thought after swapping boxcars back and forth with a few different locos.   It definitely confirmed to me that wider cars are more jarring to me than  differences in length. 

Also, when lashed up with my various locos -all of which are in some way compressed in size- the size (especially width) of the Lionel 6464 just looks right to me.   Probably doesn't have a particular connection to reality, but that's what feels right.

Also note that Atlas O PRR X29 boxcar has similar dimentions to the Lionel 6464 type boxcar too.