R2LC / R4LC Code Differences

I'm guessing the second on your list should be the R4LC-C08.  It's functionally the same as the R2LC-C08 according the the folks at ERR, they now supply the R4LC with the ERR kits.  I don't know what the differences are in the newer versions of the R4LC.

Since we were never able to get a list of differences in the R2LC versions from C04 through C13, I doubt any details of the R4LC versions is coming any time soon.

I think some of the higher coded versions could address semi-smart and smart smoke units.

R4LC:  S01 and S02 are just earlier versions of the S03 with some minor feature improvements in the code which don't translate to something visible to the user.

Later versions of the R4LC (beyond S03) are for Legacy Pullmor support (stall set  capability).  The latest R4LC code will work in any earlier version applications.

The R2LC is a bit more complicated.  The C08 code (which has been ported to the R4LC for ElectricRR use), is basic, stable, feature rich; and does the task.  Later versions of the R2LC code (C11, C13) added some tweaks for Lionel Odyssey.  You should not change revs of R2LC code in any particular loco/application. Except..

I don't know much about R2LC-C07, but I do avoid using it and try to upgrade to C08 - unless C08 fails to work as expected in the particular loco/application.

Wasn't there a polarity reversal of something between the C07 and C08 code?  I don't have one of the C07 units anymore, but I remember some issue with either the headlight or cab light (smoke) output polarity.

In any case Jon, I think the point is there has never been an official rev list of what changed between versions.  I suppose one could argue that it's not really necessary, but it still would be useful.

For instance, would either the C11 or C13 code help the Odyssey locomotives that suffer the "Odyssey Lurch" on initial movement after power up?

In my experience, the long obsolete CO7 code the marker light output is reversed. Example is the early UP 2-8-0 engines. It came with a CO7 board and if you replaced it with a standard CO8 everything would work fine except the front marker lights until you reversed the wires in the plug.

No, that issues is in the odyssey motor control board, not the radio!

Chuck, Thanks for the info on the marker lights.

I thought something changed, I remembered it as being a polarity issue on one of the lighting outputs.

Jon, thanks for the info on the Odyssey, I wasn't sure if some tweak had been done on the R2LC code.

Are the pinouts on the R4LC the same as the R2LC?  I would assume they're close as ERR is using them.  If so, what drove the change in design, more firmware space?

Thanks for all the info guys! 

One specific example I'm looking to do is replace the current R2LC in my TMCC aux tenders with a radio board that Legacy sees and will let me create TRains (engine + aux tender) that show up as Legacy TRains instead of TMCC or CAB1 TRains. 

I watch this with Interest Dave, I wasn't aware you could buy a Legacy command compatible replacement for the R2LC that would allow this.

Jon,  Can you explain what the outputs on the light circuit pin out of the Code 8 are?  I don't know if you saw my Atlas post, but ATLAS used 2 parallel LEDs with only a series 1500 resistor as headlights.  In parallel with the head light is a marker board with diodes and a 750 ohm resistor.  The FWD light set is off the rear light jumper and the Rear light Set uses the front light jumper.  Such that when in TMCC Fwd the Front LED headlights are on, but the markers are off, yet the rear Red markers light.  It switches when placed in reverse.  I was thinking a DC offset must be there some where.  Any light Shed on this would be appreciated.  G

GGG,

Wired as you explained, then the loco is operating as designed.  The rear markers, attached to the front lamp output  (and vice-verse) is a common way to achieve marker control. 

The output on the Front and Rear lamps on the radio in C08 are negative going with respect to chassis (or "U" common).  I am not sure if this helps you, but you can email me with more specific questions and I will try to answer them.

I was able to come up with this:

I placed this radio board into my TMCC aux tender and programmed it as an engine.  I was then able to build a Legacy TRain using my Legacy Big Boy and this Aux Tender which I was not able to do before due to the older R2LC radio board.  All functions on the tender work (coupler, backup light) now and the TRain shows up as a Legacy TRain, not a TMCC or CAB1 TRain giving me all my Legacy features in the lead locomotive back. 

I searched the Lionel parts page and came up with this image from their replacement parts, # 691R4LC103 and description is R4LC / RADIO BOARD / LEGACY (S03 CODE).  

The only difference I see is the small notation on the top right of each board, mine says LT 455FU and the Lionel parts page image just has a capital F and a lowercase t. 

It appears that if I just swap out radio boards I can use my older TMCC items in the Legacy environment and they now will appear as Legacy items instead of TMCC or CAB1 items. 

Dave,

not at all; for some reasons I tested combinations of TMCC components and R4LC.

For example the combination EOB and R4LC08 works ,

same for the K-Line electronic devices in the Southern Pacific Berkshire,

I operate a UP9000 TMCC with a R4LC08 with success

for the Cruise Commander and Cruise Commander M it seems to me that the newer releases can be combined with R4LC08.

Interestingly some older Cruise Commander work with R4LC S03 in TMCC .

All in TMCC-mode, meaning lash ups 1-9

Regards

Albrecht

Jon, Thank you. G

Nice to hear that you can put in an R4LC and treat some TMCC locomotives as a Legacy engine, I'll have to give that a go!

Albrecht, I remember you were replacing R2LC with R4LC boards. Due to certain versions

of the R2LC causing issues while running on 50Hz.

Would you have the numbers for the R2LC's that have a problem on 50Hz?

It would be great if you could let me know, as I would like to pass it on to our club magazine editor. So Lionel Collectors Club UK members can identify potential problem locos before they run them. 

Regards

Nick

Nick,

it's correct I operate with 50Hz; however, I am not sure that the problem that I had , has to do with the cycle.

In old TMCC all receiver types worked correctly, I hadn't any problem with start up of engines that stayed and did not run away when giving juice to the track.

That changed when I started Lrgacy equipment, however still in TMCC or cab 1 mode. Many engines rocketed away when fed with juice.

Then I checked that R2LC13 equipped engines have normal behavior, but you can only original Lionel engines with modular TMCC equipment fed with these R2LC13, EOB equipped  fails.

Now , when the R4LC08 were available, I nade some trial, and it worked.

So you can replace R2LC08 with R4LC08, however concerning R2LC07, keep in mind that some palarity is changed.

Then:

applying R4LC08 does not mean that you can operate in Legacy mode; cab2 has to be set to cab1 or TMCC !

Regards

Albrecht

Thanks Albrecht, The only Legacy runaway I have had was when a motor driver board went bad.

Regards

Nick

The polarity of the smoke output in cab light mode changed between the R2LC version C07 and C08.