Railsounds ver # and Crew-Tower Dialog Questions

Terry: 

To the best of my knowledge, all of Lionel's better engines had engine specific announcements until those that were shipped after about October, 2011.  This change caught me off guard and I made the mistake of purchasing three new Legacy steamers in Jan and Feb 2012 only to find they have the exact same announcements.  I was furious that I had spent $3000 for engines I do not want.

I do not plan to purchase any more Lionel engines until this feature is restored.  The very idea that a feature that has been a staple of their better quality engine for over 11 years would be sumarrily remover has lost them a customer!

I am now going back and buying some of the older engines that have the announcements.  Saves me a lot of money.

Don

There is also a discussion about this on the TMCC / Legacy control forum.

Here's the reference to the thread that Don mentions above: https://ogrforum.com/displayForumTopic/content/7343020873801456.(If the link doesn't work the thread started in that forum on July 16.)

The Legacy AC6000s have Legacy Railsounds, which is actually Railsounds 5.5 and higher, and is distinct from Railsounds 5. Unlike what is the case with most of my RS5 engines, whether steam, diesel or electric, under Legacy RS there is no engine or region-specific crew talk.

In the control system thread, there's a copy of the explanation Lionel's CTO gave to the Lionel Users Group of why this particular feature was dropped.  Engine-specific crew/tower exchanges are still present in the Vision locomotives I have although they are also Legacy equipped and it looks like Lionel intends to continue this.

The only upside I can think of is that the prime mover sounds on the Legacy AC6000s are excellent.  There's a video of the UP version that shows off this feature here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hsZkaaWv6BE. 

The maker of that video doesn't demonstrate the crew talk but if you go to Eric Seigel's review of the Santa Fe warbonnet version of this model you can hear what the basic crew/tower announcements are like: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xDNPXqQXRhQ.

IMHO RS5 was superior to Legacy Railsounds in this particular respect.

As I mentioned in my post above, Legacy engines up until 2011 DID have engine specific announcements.   I have the KCS SD70, NS SD40, UP SD70 cab number 8444 (which has the best diesel horn I have ever heard), UP FEF Northern and all these Legacy engines have engine specific sounds with appropriate accents.  This was not a change that was instituted with the introduction of Legacy but a change made last year.

As to Terry's concerns, one would have to check when the engine was actually shipped and ask those who own one about the announcement feature

With regard to the feature still being available on Vision engines, I find it interresting that Lionel's CTO says that Lionel listened to their customer's that  did not like the engine specific feature because it was not prototypical but it is still to be a desirable feature on their top of the line items.

Go figure,

Don

Thank you guys for the replies. Don I agree with you I too prefer the older version RS4 so what do you think would be moderately priced and a good replacement engine for the ac6000? I kinda like the Amtrak Dash-9 #517 or 519. What is the difference between the 517 and 519?

I actually did read that TMCC/Legacy forum before starting this thread. I think that's where I couldn't figure out which version went with which engine.

This is what Doug wrote, in that forum, that I couldn't quite understand,

"

July 18, 2012 5:07 PM

 

Yes, Don is right about some Legacy engines having engine specific sounds -  my Legacy FEF-3 Greyhound has them, and the Legacy Texas Special diesel set - and that squares with the CTO's explanation of when the feature was withdrawn.

It might be a different question when the regional accents that were in RS5 soundsets stopped being used; I think that the tower announcements in all my Legacy engines are in the same voice although there are slight differences in the engineers' voices.

I think the explanation must be cost-cutting in the general run of Legacy production; we'll see how long Vision units stay exempt.

Final thought: I'll defer to people with more experience/engines but I think that RS4 had unintelligible crew talk - just the sound of radio chatter/static with no specific words from the engineer although there may have been some short phrases from the tower.  I suppose that might not have held good right up to RS5, which was certainly an improvement.

Don,

My sentiments EXACTLY!!!  I made the same comment recently on another thread which prompted a sarcastic response from a Lionel "does-no-wrong" supporter.  Quite frankly, I don't particularly care whether or not my comment offended folks who "believe" everything they're told by "the corporate executive types", if you know what I mean. 

Fact is... Lionel is cutting corners here by going with the mindless and generic Towercom/Crewtalk that has become so common on their latest locomotives.  Legacy Railsounds is otherwise a huge step above anything else out there right now, and for Lionel to have essentially "dumbed it down" with generic announcements is truly sad.  The only thing more sad is that Lionel's CTO has the audacity to defend the decision by indicating he has no plans to change its implementation in regular-line offerings -- yet indicates Lionel's top-of-the-line Vision Line products will continue to have engine-specific and dialogue-specific announcements (even though Lionel supposedly "listened to customer feedback" when they simplified the implementation with more generic dialogs on the regular-line offerings.)  HUH???    Doesn't even make half sense.  He would have garnered a LOT more credibility with his listening audience if he would have just told the truth:  "Yep, we dumbed it down 'cause it's CHEAPER to do it that way.  If you want engine-specific dialogues boys and girls, then you gotta ante up and pay Vision Line prices!"  We still wouldn't have LIKED the message... but he would have been telling the TRUTH instead of corporate party-line gibberish. 

David

You are 100% correct.  The RS4 tower message is clear, but the cab message is just garbled voice.  All of the RS5 messages are actually understandable.

if Lionel CTO was paying attention they would see more people complain about NOT having engine numbers then ever said they do want them.

come on Lionel really pay attention.

R U sure? Everytime someone posts video of a new locomotive and demonstrating the crewtalk, far more folks chime in wishing Lionel would do away with the crewtalk altogether. Now they make it generic, and people complain they want more.... go figure 

Just because a few people on a forum find a feature undesirable does not make them a majority.  I for one could never understand those who complained about towercom because it is a feature for which you had to issue a command to activate.  JUST DO NOT PUSH THE D--- BUTTON AND YOU WILL NEVER HEAR IT!

Happy railroading,

Don

You beat me to it.  I don't understand why anyone complains about a feature which is optional!!  I personally would have really liked them to keep the engine #s and in the case of special trains like the Blue Comet...the mention of the name as well.  

It's a shame the crew talk is so generic right now as it has simply lost a lot of character and for those of us who enjoy it...regardless of how "unprototypical" it may be this is a step back.

The rest of the RailSounds pack and the new features added (like the sequencing) keep getting better and are really wonderful.

I agree!

+1 for those wishing the feature of cab/roadname specific towercom & crewtalk to be restored.

I think this is the link to the original thread folks are referencing.

-Dave

I also like the specific road name and cab number in the Legacy crewtalk, that really makes a huge difference if you like crewtalk.  I can see why people would not like the generic crewtalk, you don't know if you're talking to a steamer of the latest modern diesel.

Prototypical or not, the engine-specific sounds of RS5.0 were a major selling point for me in buying Lionel engines.

I have to say the universal Noo Yawk soundset makes it much less likely that my next purchase will be a new Legacy engine.

I too miss the engine specific tower com and crew talk.  The JLC Big Boy is a lot of fun to play with partially because of the crew talk..."Gonna fire this big boy up"....c'mon prototypical or not that is just fun!!

If Lionel does release the N de M Centipede as mentioned in another post I will buy it but, if the engineer's voice is that same annoying East Coast accent that has been on all my Legacy engines lately I swear I am sending it back!