I'm looking into getting a saw for working on an extension on my layout. I'm also looking to get a new set of tools specifically a drill or screw gun. I currently have a Black and Decker drill but I'm looking into getting something different. What brand(s) should I look at. As far as saws go I'll probably just do a circular saw and a jig saw nothing else at this point. I'd prefer battery operated ones.
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A miter or radial arm saw should be on your list for making benchwork. I’m also a fan of a router with a flush cut bit for edging the tops flush with the benchwork.
Some kind of finishing sander.
A drill and impact driver (not a cordless screwdriver). I have an 18v impact for construction and a smaller 12v for touchy things like track screws in wood ties.
Quality tools are always good... Dewalt, Makita, Milwaukee, etc...
Jigsaw only if you’re making curved tabletops.
There are a lot of deals these days on combo packs, just pick the brand that has the tools you want on sale. It’s kinda like iPhones, the batteries work with one brand and no others, so once you pick, you’re locked in, or you have a bunch of incompatible chargers and batteries.
Consider the loss of power with some cordless tools vs the corded ones, and also the size, the battery can make some of them quite large.
The homeowner grade stuff (Ryobi) is ok, just don’t expect it to last as long.
Also, not a power tool, but buy yourself a couple framing squares, a level and a right angle clamp.
@Boilermaker1 posted:A miter or radial arm saw should be on your list for making benchwork. I’m also a fan of a router with a flush cut bit for edging the tops flush with the benchwork.
Some kind of finishing sander.
A drill and impact driver (not a cordless screwdriver). I have an 18v impact for construction and a smaller 12v for touchy things like track screws in wood ties.
Quality tools are always good... Dewalt, Makita, Milwaukee, etc...Jigsaw only if you’re making curved tabletops.
There are a lot of deals these days on combo packs, just pick the brand that has the tools you want on sale. It’s kinda like iPhones, the batteries work with one brand and no others, so once you pick, you’re locked in, or you have a bunch of incompatible chargers and batteries.
Consider the loss of power with some cordless tools vs the corded ones, and also the size, the battery can make some of them quite large.
The homeowner grade stuff (Ryobi) is ok, just don’t expect it to last as long.
Also, not a power tool, but buy yourself a couple framing squares, a level and a right angle clamp.
Thanks. My dad has a set of Dewalt tools he's very happy with. Might have to consider that brand. I'm thinking the jig saw for things like sinking bases of buildings into the layout. I wouldn't be using the tools for huge jobs for long periods of time so I think the coreless (battery powered) units should be good for my needs.
Not sure why you’d use a jigsaw to sink a building in. (Can’t see why you’d cut all the way thru the top for a building base).
It’s much easier to put the building in and build up terrain around it with pink foam or something, but maybe that’s a technique of layout building I’m just not aware of.
@Boilermaker1 posted:Not sure why you’d use a jigsaw to sink a building in. (Can’t see why you’d cut all the way thru the top for a building base).
It’s much easier to put the building in and build up terrain around it with pink foam or something, but maybe that’s a technique of layout building I’m just not aware of.
I don't use pink foam I just set the buildings on top of my wood. On most of them I've removed the bases but on a few I don't want to or can't (like the mth operating buildings and passenger station)
Keep your receipts in case the power tool goes south. When I worked at Home Depot last couple of years, when a tool went bad and customer had receipt, we just exchanged it even up, if it had been replaced with a newer model the receipt would give us the price to credit the customer, then they could purchase the new one with that credit.
I use BLACK & DECKER for small jobs and Milwaukee for bigger jobs both drills have 100's of use hours on them no problems. I have 4 Ryobi electric power tools that are a great, there old they are all blue very reliable.
Skill makes a great hand held circular saw 7 1/4 blade.
A glue gun, Dremal tool , solder gun and foam cutter also come in handy for various jobs.
BTW. the best time of year for power tools is Christmas then Father's day.
Want a tool that precision cuts, drills any size hole or any opening shape, also engraves and scores?
It's a Glowforge laser cutter.
@Trainlover9943 posted:Thanks. My dad has a set of Dewalt tools he's very happy with. Might have to consider that brand. I'm thinking the jig saw for things like sinking bases of buildings into the layout. I wouldn't be using the tools for huge jobs for long periods of time so I think the coreless (battery powered) units should be good for my needs.
I have DeWalt (20V series) and am also very happy with them. I started with their Drill/Driver combo kit; since then I have bought their jigsaw, variable speed orbital sander, reciprocating saw, and oscillating tool. I buy them through Home Depot around holidays (fathers day, labor day, Christmas) as they usually offer special deals such as 'buy a tool, get a battery/charger for free' or similar deals.
My advice: instead of buying loose saw blades for tools such as the jigsaw, buy combo kits like this one because they come with a case to hold the bits. Usually I buy these through Lowes, Home Depot doesn't seem to carry accessories kits like this.
@Jushavnfun posted:Keep your receipts in case the power tool goes south. When I worked at Home Depot last couple of years, when a tool went bad and customer had receipt, we just exchanged it even up, if it had been replaced with a newer model the receipt would give us the price to credit the customer, then they could purchase the new one with that credit.
BTW. the best time of year for power tools is Christmas then Father's day.
I second both of these statements! I have an accordion folder that contains all the paperwork/manuals that comes with the tools and staple the receipts to them. In addition to the paperwork/manuals for the tools, it also has paperwork/manuals for my lawn mower, snowblower, etc. (I have a separate one for all my train purchases). My grandfather taught me the practice of doing this.
I have a DeWalt miter saw (corded) that I'm very happy with.
George
The all important SAFETY! Clamps and sawhorses for cutting wood. googles, mask for sawdust, earplugs, and tight fitting gloves. A circular saw has no mercy!! I work construction and I've seen too many "when things go wrong"!
What's wrong with the B&D drill you have? My 2 B&Ds have outlasted the all my high dollar drills that came after.
Too fast? Too slow? Chuck too large for tiny bits? Not big enough for over 1/2"?
Keyless chuck?
Long term, a hammer drill with hammer-off/on option, 1/2" keyed chuck (vs hand tightened) and make sure it accepts small bits too! (my B&D 1/2" holds a smaller bit than my Dremel chuck) Slow speed capability. High speed will just burn your bits; it takes some learning to know when to use high speeds correctly, slow when needed is more important.
Cord?
I haven't had the best of luck with rechargeables that sit idle. Regular use seems to help them last. I also don't buy a rechargeable until I have a corded mate. Waiting for a charge (that may not happen) doesn't beat the 3 minutes to run power to a usually "better" AC tool. The cordless stuff is a dream only if you use it often and/ or move about on a job a lot. IMO, cordless is almost a novelty, I don't work anymore, so likely won't buy another cordless again.
@Adriatic posted:What's wrong with the B&D drill you have? My 2 B&Ds have outlasted the all my high dollar drills that came after.
Too fast? Too slow? Chuck too large for tiny bits? Not big enough for over 1/2"?
Keyless chuck?
Long term, a hammer drill with hammer-off/on option, 1/2" keyed chuck (vs hand tightened) and make sure it accepts small bits too! (my B&D 1/2" holds a smaller bit than my Dremel chuck) Slow speed capability. High speed will just burn your bits; it takes some learning to know when to use high speeds correctly, slow when needed is more important.
Cord?
I haven't had the best of luck with rechargeables that sit idle. Regular use seems to help them last. I also don't buy a rechargeable until I have a corded mate. Waiting for a charge (that may not happen) doesn't beat the 3 minutes to run power to a usually "better" AC tool. The cordless stuff is a dream only if you use it often and/ or move about on a job a lot. IMO, cordless is almost a novelty, I don't work anymore, so likely won't buy another cordless again.
Nothing really wrong with the B&D drill but I'm thinking if I do a brand of saw or other power tools why not get a drill of the same brand. Especially when the batteries come into play.
@Tom Tee posted:I have the brands mentioned but a few years ago I limited my tool purchases to the HD Ridgid brand.
The Ridgid tools AND the Ridgid batteries come with a LIFETIME replacement guarantee. Yes you do need to fill out a registration form for each battery and each tool and mail it in in a specified amount of time with the receipt (I get duplicates from the HD cashier) but FREE BATTERIES make the deal. I'm embarrassed to say how much I have spent on Dewalt batteries over the years.
Ridgid does replace items quickly.
A short while ago Makita tools were sold and the newer tools come with plastic gears in their drill motors.
Casual hobby use may allow you to go cheap.
On another tradesman forum couple few years ago we did some testing and record keeping of Harbor Freight corded tools and it was not pretty. HF electric motors have not performed as rated. Not good for long term contractor use. Again, may be good for light duty infrequent usage. All my opinion.
That's a cool plus with the ridgid brand. I actually was looking at the HF circular saw but figured why buy that and just buy something better that would be of better quality.
Tools, tools, tools ... there's always more with performance and features to wish for. Some keepers I've bought and used extensively the last few years:
Milwaukee M12 drill and M12 Right Angle drill. The R.A. was my first Milwaukee battery tool bought for a specific project and I liked it so much I built a collection of M12 tools to replace my Makitas. When assembling layouts, the R.A. drills the pilot holes and the drill drives the screws. These drills are compact and handle well - the 2x batteries have good life and are very compact. I have the M12 circular saw but that needs the 4X battery to do any real cutting. M18 would be far better for saws. I have used, and was impressed by, a friend's M18 Sawsall for cutting steel and that one is on my wish list.
Hitachi 10" compound miter saw. Light and easily carried to the work area. With an 80-tooth blade, this saw sees much more use than my bigger saws.
Harbor Freight corded oscillating saw. This bargain priced saw out-performed a friend's Fein when we had the two of them at work during a module repair session.
Porter-Cable D-Handle router. My favorite. (I also have other Porter Cables, Makita plunge, and Bosch laminate routers). (One can never have too many routers ... I leave mine setup for use on specific tasks and jigs).
So a starting tool set for layout building: a couple of battery-powered drills (one for pilot holes and one for screw driving) is essential. A miter saw makes cutting frames easy and precise. A circular saw for cutting sheet materials (18v if battery powered). A jigsaw for the curved cuts. A router with a follower bit if your layout is going towards cabinet grade work.
WRT quality of tools, my Milwaukee and Porter-Cables have replaced failed Craftsman, DeWalt, and Black & Decker tools over many years. However, the bargain prices of some of the battery tool kits is attractive and the kits will probably provide good service.
Special dished blades are available for cutting curved subroadbeds with a circular saw.
If you are cutting 1/2" or less plywood set your saw blade depth a hair more than the thickness of the plywood and you can cut with a conventional flt blade. Cut over scrap material.
Cutting circles with a circular saw provides a more consistent edge than a jig saw for the less skilled. IMO, Bosch jig saws cut the straightest.
Setting a table saw blade height proud of the thickness of the plywood allows you to cut round plywood disks if you pin the center axis to a table mounted vertical stud. For the faint of heart you can start with the blade lowered and bring it up with successive passes.
I've had great service from the Ryobi Cordless Tools from HD. A lot of different tools and you can easily swap batteries. The setup below is currently $ 129.99 and has a cordless drill, cordless 5-1/2" circular saw and two batteries with charger plus storage bag. Plenty of run time.
Re: "Setting a table saw blade height to the thickness of the plywood allows you to cut round plywood disks if you pin the center axis to a table mounted vertical stud."
The router-on-a-stick technique is more precise and safer than using a disk-bladed saw for cutting circles (turntable) and arcs (elevated track).
@Sean007 posted:I've had great service from the Ryobi Cordless Tools from HD. A lot of different tools and you can easily swap batteries. The setup below is currently $ 129.99 and has a cordless drill, cordless 5-1/2" circular saw and two batteries with charger plus storage bag. Plenty of run time.
Not a bad deal. Maybe have to consider this.
@Tracker John posted:Re: "Setting a table saw blade height to the thickness of the plywood allows you to cut round plywood disks if you pin the center axis to a table mounted vertical stud."
The router-on-a-stick technique is more precise and safer than using a disk-bladed saw for cutting circles (turntable) and arcs (elevated track).
TJ, Hacks: One of the purposes of hacks is an alternate approach to use if one does not have the optimum tool.
The use of trammel mounted routers is routine for folks with routers and a trammel.
Hacks are meant to get one out of a jamb, save time, save money and essentially provide the user with similar service. Not perfect but adequate.
A hack for conserving router bits is to use your router and trammel to score a circle, then using a jig saw cut full of the finished edge then use you router to just clean off the face. Quicker than using a router with successive deeper passes or less expensive then heating up a bit trying to finish the job in one pass.
When cutting disks another hack is to use double face tape instead of clamps or through screws to hold your material.
Small band saw. 
Reciprocating saw. (Sawzall) and a hand-held tool, that uses Sawzall blades.
Combination disk/belt sander. Right center, lower shelf.
Interesting hobby cutter.
Key hole saw, picture center, blue handle, used a lot.
TJ, the table saw circle cutting hack is not one I care to use - been there, done that. The potential for kick-back is significant unless the ply is dressed close to final circle before rotating the material. The other hacks you mentioned are good techniques.
TJ brought up a very important point. Kick back. Especially when using a table saw, especially when in a hurry. Long back story!
Read all you can about safety in using power tools.
Dull blades are very expensive and are an accident looking for a place to happen.
Holding the materials just a hair loose while cutting is dangerous. Do not stand "downrange" behind the tablesaw. Use a very secure fence, don't run the blade higher then needed. If you table saw does not have a brake lower the blade as you cut power. Never reach over a blade. No loose clothing. Hold you work firmly. Consider where you hands may be positioned if you slip or trip. No children or pets anywhere around power tools. Eye, respirator and ear protection. Others can add more insight.
There are so many options out there for tools these days. I have lots of tools, both hand and power. I have many different brands. I am a hard core do-it-yourselfer and use my tools for building all the time. So I am going to buy tools of good quality and good price. I use a Porter Cable circular saw. It is a very good tool and I think I got it for 50 bucks at Lowes. My jigsaw is a DeWalt. I got the higher end one and paid about $150 for it.
Just because a tool is name brand doesn't necessarily equate to high quality. As an example, I have many DeWalt tools. I wanted a second router so I could leave my Craftsman router attached to the table and not swap when I need to freehand something. I bought the DeWalt kit with fixed and plunge bases because DeWalt is generally synonymous with high quality. I burned up two of them in less than an hours time of work When I was working on cutting out window openings in 3/4" OSB on my house I am building. I went back and bought a Bosch and it did what the DeWalt couldn't handle. Now the DeWalt is relegated to light weight work, which it handled well before I got into heavy duty stuff that it could not handle.
Kickback is real and I am proof that it can have severe consequences. Five years ago I was using my 10" Makita Miter saw to cut some PVC for a plumbing job I was working on and the saw kicked back on me. I did not even know it was possible for Miter saw to kickback until it happened. I used that saw all the time and I have had it for about twenty years with no issues. Now I only have a pinkie and a thumb on my left hand due to that kickback.
The main tools I use
Craftsman radial saw cuts 2x4 &1x4 lumber for bench work
Craftsman skill saw (old) cuts plywood
Dewalt and Makita cordless hammer drill and drill By far the most used tools on the layout or at home I would recommend either
Now I use a Dremel 3” Saw Max to cut track and it works great
When you start with bench work it’s more like construction than modeling when bench work is finished the jobs transition to lighter cuts
I have a jigsaw and bandsaw but never use them but will use bandsaw soon for making ties to fill in o gauge track
My guess is the pipe shattered and debris locked it up. PVC shatters often under high speed vibrations.
I have an incredibly healthy fear of spinning saws after seeing a few such accidents in person. It's why I didn't suggest one outright.
Table or hand held; You can't find a much more dangerous tool imo. I use a jig saw, Sawsall, or even a bandsaw if I can. (Broken band saw blades usually do shallower body/leg damage. Practically a skinned knee 
)
The small 3"-4" cordless circulars are much more likely to stop than kick hard, and are still pretty fast cutters as well. They offer more tool control but sacrifice a nicer long straight cut and some speed, etc.
Mike, that just plain sucks that happened.
You can't clamp work too well or check the hold too often either. My porcelain smile proves that. Bounced off the garage floor no less.... that's about 10ft of travel plus slowed by an immovable force at 5ft.
@Tom Tee posted:Do not stand "downrange" behind the tablesaw.
+ 1,000,000 on that. As a kid, my house did not have power tools and my first exposure to to table saw was in a shop class - before the class began, the instructor was trimming a very irregular piece of oak that a student wanted for sculpture carving. A 3" chunk of oak flew back and made a mess of the instructor's face. Blood everywhere, class dismissed, safety lesson #1 imprinted on all of us.
One of my blades lost a carbide tooth. Glad I wasn't in the path of that bullet - I found it deeply embedded in the wall behind me.
Michael's tale on kickback shows that even easy cuts can re-direct a saw's energy in unexpected ways. Ouch!
Always let the blade cut the wood at the pace it wants to. Do not force a cut, if you smell burning wood, see smoke, burn marks on the blade or the wood. Stop! There is a reason:
Too much of a cut at one time, wrong blade, wet wood, dull blade, dying battery, hard wood, oversized hunk of wood, wrong blade pitch or maybe wrong career. You must respect the tool but not be afraid of it.
@Tom Tee posted:Michael, Wow! Hurt! Sorry to hear. Would you be open to share how a chop saw and plastic pipe injured you so badly?
Sure. Maybe someone can learn from my accident and maybe it will prevent someone else from suffering a similar fate or worse.
I was cutting about 4" off of a ten foot stick of 1-1/2" thick wall DWV. The pipe was chipping instead of cutting clean like it normally does. Because it was chipping, I was cutting very slowly. The only thing I can think of is that the pipe got hot and started to get soft and caused the blade to bind. When it kicked, it was very violent and my left hand that was holding the pipe slipped under the blade with the pipe and I ended up pushing the blade back down right through the end of my hand. It happened in an instant.
There is no need to fear power tools, but you need to respect them and need to know how they react to abnormal situations. I still use that saw but just for small stuff now. I upgraded to a DeWalt 12" compound slider for the big jobs.
I had a Radial arm saw for 40 years, but it was big and bulky. I finally got rid of it and bought the DeWalt DWE7480 and it's been a great saw. I have it on a compact base that I can fold away when needed.
Plenty of horror stories out there! Here's a common one: driving a 2.5 inch or longer drywall screw without pilot hole. Holding screw with thumb and finger left hand, impact driver bit slips, spinning Phillips bit into left hand! Seen it happen so many times! Hint: use square drive screws!
Now that we've worn out the tools discussion, "working on an extension on my layout" How big an extension to your existing layout?5 feet, 10 feet, helix, double deck around the walls? Measure your pending expense against the size of the extension. I have built layouts for years (commercially) and the number one criteria is that all joints must be square in order to stabilize the base of any layout. So in my very humble opinion what is the PRICE of a tool that gives me the QUALITY of the joints I need. Can I get what I want with a jig saw, or hand held circular saw, or some table tops device or do I need cabinet maker quality. I currently use a 48x96 wood CNC machine. But I am a commercial builder. Last comment, it really doesn't matter how you do it as long as you have some fun doing it! Russ
@ChiloquinRuss posted:Now that we've worn out the tools discussion, "working on an extension on my layout" How big an extension to your existing layout?5 feet, 10 feet, helix, double deck around the walls?
My extension will be around 20 ft long and 2ft at its widest point. Not huge but its going to be a run through yard for my subways and a small housing section. I'll post pics of the space later.
@DaveSlie posted:
Cool!
Heres some pictures of what will be the new extension. The side with the buildings will be the 2ft wide section (yes the TV will be incorporated into the design). The rest will be 16" wide (to give me room for three lanes of tracks and room to walk). That section will be the rest of the extension from the speakers to the end of the 16' layout. I'll post more pictures if needed.
@DaveSlie posted:
I also have the Harbor Freight cut off saw and agree it's a pleasure and breeze using it to cut track. It's inexpensive too!
Two other saws I find invaluable for hobby use and DIY home projects are:
this one from WORX -
and this one from Rockwell -
I recommend both.
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