Southern Pacific Lines Berkshire - Lionel 2012

I tend to agree; another point to consider is that there are a few other modelling opportunities with the SP version.  In 1949 numbers 3500-3509 were eventually converted to oil burners basically by scrapping the existing coal bunker and custom-building new Vanderbilt-style (whaleback) tanks on the existing tender frames and trucks (the drawbar configuration on the Berks were incompatible with SP's existing fleet of Vandy tenders).  Eventually all except 3500, 3501 & 3502 had the feedwater heaters removed.

That Southern Pacific lettering definitely appeals to me more.

Here is a couple of pics of the K-Line version from a few years ago before K-Line went "poof!"

I guess this is before the switchover to oil burning and the vandy tender.

Anyone know why the preheaters were removed later on?

Is this a reasoanbly accurate of what they looked like dressed up for SP?

It's a great running engine and I love the detail work that went into it.

The old K-Line plunger operated smoke unit is somewhat anemic though compared to MTH units.

 

Rod

Now I am caught in a horrible dilemma. This in SP or  the 4-12-2

Something to consider.  The pictures in the Lionel catalog, show a boiler that is suited for modeling the B&A Berkshire, which is not the same as the B&M and later Santa Fe and SP Berks.  Rod Stewart's SP boiler (which is correct) is not the same as Lionel is picturing. 

Marker, all of the SP Class B1 Berks I have seen pictured came with the coffin feedwater heater and coal tender as pictured in the Lionel model. Lionel's model is accurate for 1945 as delivered with SP Lines on the tender. They later acquired the whaleback tenders as in Bob's photo above.

 

I don't have my Dunscomb book handy. This will have to do:

 

http://espee.railfan.net/sp_steam_berkshire.html

 

Pete

 

 

 

Pete - I'm sorry, I should have been more specific.  I wasn't referring to the feedwater heaters.  I was referring to the sand dome, steam dome, etc.

 I posted B&A Berk pictures, perhaps by comparing them with Rod Stewart and bob2 pictures, the difference will be clear.

 

 

Here is Lionel's picture.

 

 

Now compare it to the top of the engine in the link you posted.  Again, I'm talking about all between the feedwater heater and the cab. 

 

The earlier K-Line engine had those details correct.

3rd Rail did one with the whaleback tender. Nicest of the bunch.

 

Pete

I have a kind of dummy question as long as we are talking SP berks.

There are two stacks on the model, the front one being slightly smaller in diameter.

On the K-line model it is blanked off and only the rear one smokes.

Can someone explain the purpose of two stacks? I am aware that Challengers and BigBoys have twin stacks, but they are the same size.

 

Rod

That isn't a "stack". That is the the front end throttle. Notice the long rod down the Engineer's side, with a reversing link half way down the side, which ends up going into the side of that housing.

Hot Water: What is the purpose of the front end throttle? Is it a way to alter the draft on the firebox?

Yeah that was going to be my question as well?

 

Rod

No, the throttle controls the amount of steam to the valves and then into the cylinders to move the pistons. Earlier locomotives had the throttles in the steam dome. with the development of "Super Power" and increasing steam temperatures as a result of super heater tubes installed within the fire tubes (flues), better control of the steam, by the Engineer, was needed. Since the super heater header is located way forward, at the front of the boiler, the logical progression to "front end throttles" occurred.  

So the actual steam valve was located in that front housing?

Should the top be open as the K-Line model has it?

Here is a couple more pix of this great engine just for fun.

 

Rod

The feedwater heater gives the front end of the BM and SP engines the look of a some of the old nun's head veils!

For the nit-pickers, there were two B & M Berks.  The ones that made it west had a slightly smaller sand dome, unlike the dome in the picture.  If it is any consolation, my dome is not correct either.  I worked from Hundman plans and did not spot the difference until I was done.

 

The Mainline Modeler article is definitive on these Berks.

>>>The SP/ATSF fans apparently need to look for the K-line models. <<<

 

I just looked at a photo of a Kline SF Berk and yes, the boiler is quite different.

Looks like Lionel is using just one casting for all the different roads.

Joe

I for one am excited about getting an ATSF coal burning berkshire, given the dominance of oil burners on the Santa Fe roster this is a rare bird.  In addition, this berkshire has the latest sound features and steam whistle and retails for $150 less than the Nickel Plate Road and PM berks in 2010.

 

Let's wait until we see a production unit before we start casting stones.  In my limited experience I have found that errors are not uncommon in the catalogs.  Perhaps the marketer that compiled the pages simply photo-shopped the same image for all the roads and Lionel is using the correct K-Line derived boiler for SP and ATSF.  Who knows?  Nobody...so how about we reserve judgment. 

 

I prefer to be excited about the new items in the catalog rather than be disappointed by what is or is not in it.  But what do I know....I am a grown man that plays with toys.