Standard Gauge Challenger?

Not a standard gauge person here but I do believe MTH did an articulated ?-6-6-? standard gauge tinplate loco.

 

They siamesed two drives together under an extended boiler and wound up with a neat unit.  I believe ten + years ago.  Gotta be a must have piece for many.

Hi John,
I have not seen one before, but some have modified a 400e for that purpose.
MTH did a dinosaur looking articulated with a 400e frame back in the cretatious period of tinplate traditions era.
Suffice to say one of the most unique manufactured tinplate locos.

Here's a link to the details...and the auction listing for the prototype.

http://www.mthtrains.com/content/10-1166-1

A "recent" auction example that went almost 2x original retail.
http://www.liveauctioneers.com/item/9275619

MTH ended up canceling the articulated. I remember my customers laughing at the picture mockup in the catalog at the time they announced it. The unit you saw a movie of was built by Bob Thon of Roberts Lines. He has shown it off at the Great New York State Model Train Fair in the past.

Click on the photo to see it without compression. There are Challengers,Northerns(Js and Daylights)Hudsons(Regular and Dreyfuss) out there.

Thats the one that Jim has posted above. Any info on this or who built it would be great, thanks John

This is interesting. I understand the one in the photo here was made by Bob Thon of Roberts Lines. Is he still alive? The one in the Live Anctioneers is the one shown in the MTH catalog that was not made. So it must be the only one hand made for the MTH catalog. Who does this kind of metal work? I ask because I'm retired, bored and I'm a machinist. I would love to build something or things like this. I would love to find a couple people that I could group with and make our own all USA hand made 600E. I do not have a press, but they are cheap! We could buy a press, make a couple dies and stamp our own tinplate. Then we would only need some die cast metal parts made and we're almost there. We'd sell the heck out of them at York! Has everybody in the US given up? It's like we don't have the confidence to build our own trains. We can!

400Bill,
What a great idea!
There is no reason why not...though, I don't believe we'd have a catalog ready for fall York this year!
I have been dabbling with a couple ideas myself in the tinplate space.
I've only begun the research and thought, boy, it would be great if I had help from a machinist to bounce off for input...

I saw this blog post and thought...why not?

http://littleglitterhouses.com...ingTinTrainCars.aspx

What's the history behind the 600e?
Or, is that what is pictured above?

Let's keep this going.

CH

Here is Bob last November at Monroeville. He is alive and well and still wears glasses. Not sure if the Challenger in my photo was made by Bob or not. Several people have made them.

Hey Jim, does he make these for other people? Are there other builders out there sell to the public? I love Standard Gauge Tin, but I really like the one offs and custom stuff! Really fun to collect,run and enjoy them. Thanks John

roblines@earthlink.net

 

Here you go.

Thank You Jim

Any leads on different sites besides Ebay and here for standard gauge engines like the Challenger or Hudsons would be really appreciated. Thanks

Has anyone emailed Bob yet? I didn't want us to flood him with questions! Tony Hay had a 600E for $600 and a friend of mine bought it first! He's passed and I have no way of finding that one. It did have a lot of die castings. My main concern is that in todays times, all the parts suppliers are gone. Becauce many of the trim parts to build a 4-6-4 or 4-6-6-4 would be bought from and parts supplier. We would have to cut a frame & stretch it, and then build the longer sheet metal boiler and punch out the notches for all the trim tabs. We could use a regular 400E steamchest & guides and make custom rods (no big deal there). The real question I have is: are those 6 wheel motors still available.

Well, winter time is approaching and I won't be mowing and working on my outdoor railroad (1/2 mile of 7.5" gauge) as much. So anyone that wants to put together a collective project for either (or both) loco, shoot me an email hmi@otherside.com I'm 51 and had to stop working because of arthritis. My wife is a PHD with busy schedule. She goes to work and I sit at home alone. I still can do jobs, but just an hour at a time and then take a break. I love working with metal and will get very bored with Gunsmoke & Bonanza this winter! Here's my wife & yellow lab "Butters" of the railroad I built.

Bill Hanks

TCA#96-42883

 

 

I'm guessing that this Hudson was also done by Bob.  Am I correct?

 

I quite admire his Dreyfuss Hudson and Class J, though at $5,000. they're priced well beyond what I would seriously consider.

THe loco picture with the handsome Bob Thon is a Randall Hudson that Bob built up. The Dreyfus Hudson and N&W J are not done by Bob, they were crafted by John Kresse and John Harmon.

 

ARNO

Greatly appreciate the clarification!  I saw the J & Dreyfuss a few years ago at the Allentown show for the first time.  

 

Personally, I rather have a Randall Hudson than a 600E.  I do recall an old TTOS Bulletin interviewing someone who built a Standard Gauge "scale Hudson" but can't remember if this was it or yet another.  

1976 Quarterly, vol.23 no.1 to be exact, and the builder was Ralf Parton.

 

ARNO

That's the name.  I'll see if I have that Quarterly packed away.  Did he built some for sale?  

Ralf ended up making 3 locos. He originally had never planned to go into production, but after being shown at shows and the articles in train publications he planned 100 units. In a short note to the Editor of the TTOS Bulletin in 1977, he claimed to have 71 orders and when he got the remaining 29 he would begin production. He also was working with CMC to get the 6-wheel motors and had a order with them. Production never happened and the whereabouts of the 3 locos are anyone's guess. I heard one of them went over seas many years ago.

 

ARNO

 

Thanks, Arno.  I do hope that Lionel/MTH do something else with than Hiawatha/Commodore tooling.

 

Can't wait for your book to appear!

Arno, I want of your box when you go to print!

 

I also agree with Gilbert Ives, lets see some more Hudsons.

 

I personally would like to see a standard gauge rendition of the Blue Streak and Red Comet sets using the old LTI Commodore Vanderbilts Hudsons.

Bill, Love the pic esp. of "Butters" riding in the gondola 

 

Hmm..Standard Gauge Challengers..I'm getting hooked

Anybody else not able to see pics posted by navy. seal?

nope

Gilbert Ives,

 

I had the same problem in the past.  What I found was that if I use the link sent to me by the Forum, I don't always see the pictures just boxes where the pictures should be.  However, if instead I log into the Forum and scroll to the new posting, the pictures show up.  Why this difference, I haven't a clue.

 

Bob Nelson

400Bill,

 

Using the same technique that Bob Thon uses to add two unpowered driver wheels to a four-wheel Bild-a-Loco motor, you could similarly add two unpowered driver wheels to a McCoy six-wheel dual motor to create an eight-wheel motor.  You could then use this motor to build a variety of 4-8-4 Northern type locomotives.  

 

For example, you could build a tinplate version of The Milwaukee Road's famous and still running S-3 (Northern) locomotive #261.   http://261.com/photo-gallery/   If you did, I'd buy it in a heart beat. 

 

Bob

Thanks for the tip, Bob.  Still doesn't work for me, alas.  Probably some iMac/Safari demon.

Well I haven't made a reply for a couple days. The weekend is the only time I have with my wife, but I have been reading the comments and thinking. I'm deciding on my first project to be as simple as possible. So my first 2 locos are going to 4-6-4's. Like the 600E. I'm going to buy 2 steam wheeled 6 wheel motors. One with red wheels & 1 with black. So I can build a black with copper & brass trim & red wheels. And one gun metal gray with nickel trim & black wheels. I have a 400E frame sitting on my kitchen table & I'm studying it. My plan is to stretch the frame with a bolt in-fill in piece in the frame. And cut the boiler at the middle boiler band and roll a pc of sheet metal, punch holes in it for another sand dome,pipes and add a whistle and 3 pop off valves (like a Flyer Piper). And then braze that piece in with a torch. I'll hide the seams with more boiler bands. I'm probably going have to wait until my motors arrive to physically get started. So I can figure the frame-motor mounting. It will have to be in the right place for the rods, guides etc. I'm now pondering the tender. Probably do a coal type and only use the trucks from the 400T. I do have question. I will be using an MTH 400E, but I would like one that interchanges with an original. So when I buy parts from a parts dealer they will fit. I know the new 400E's are just enough different that they will not interchange with the originals. Maybe this was done because of copyright litigation. My question; are any of the reproduction 400E's an actual replica? If so, when was the change made?

Bill