Steam locomotive question

The Flying Scotsman  was equipped with multiple tenders at one time is all that comes to mind.

Most railroads didn't use canteens at all back in the steam days. 

 

Those that did used them on larger freight locomotives.  Illinois Central, Baltimore and Ohio, Norfolk & Western come to mind off the top of my head. 

 

Back in the day, the Burlington (CB&Q) used a canteen behind 2-8-2 4960 during excursions, but 4-8-4 5632 didn't use one.

 

Nowadays, a canteen is practically a must for any mainline steam excursion locomotive.

 

Rusty

this makes sense in a couple ways.  in a long freight consist, the extra weight of a water tender would not be all that noticeable and added to that, not having to bring a heavy train to a halt to take on water and then having to get up to speed again would also be an operational plus.

 

just the opposite would apply to small locomotives with light consists.

 

cheers...gary

Thanks working on a custom model and since the tender is small the customer is wantEd to know if there was any 4-4-0's that were ran with a water canteen car.

Canadian National and Canadian Pacific used auxiliary water cars in Manitoba and Saskatchewan, due to bad water territories. Often these accompanied 4-6-0's and 2-8-0's. Southern Pacific used auxiliary water cars behind 2-6-0's and 4-8-0's in the Imperial Valley area.

      Regarding 4-4-0's and water cars, typically water cars were used by class 1 railroads, and not many 4-4-0's survived after the Depression. The only ones that come to mind were SP/T&NO, C&IM, CPR and Katy.......none of which used water cars with their 4-4-0's, as the runs they covered weren't particularly demanding, so taking water at a station stop probably wasn't viewed as terribly inefficient.

Thanks Mark. This has been an interesting project as my customer has asked for smaller locomotives for her layout.

Water tank cars have been used to transport water in the dry areas in the 19th century.  I haven't figured out yet if these cars were exclusively for railroad use or if it was for the towns along the line.

Northern Pacific used them with branch line engines. Pennsy used tenders from M1As behind J class 2-10-4s in the mid- fifties too. 

On the Norfolk & Western, the use of canteens (A-tanks in N&W language) were used because while the weight of the canteen did reduce the pulling power available for freight, the ability of not having to stop on a grade to take on water meant that the locomotive could actually pull more tonnage upgrade than would be possible is the locomotive had to restart the train on that grade (in other words, by having the A-tank the trains could "run the hill" with more tonnage by not having to stop and restart).

 

Stuart

 

 

Interesting railroad history.

Gary

• Cheers from The Detroit and Mackinac Railway

George Hart used a Taylor tender from a Reading Camelback as a "jug" for his Reading 0-6-0T 1251 on excursions on the Ma & Pa. The Reading & Northern uses his "jug" with 4-6-2 425. It fits with her on the turntable at Jim Thorpe.

 

 

 

The Reading, Blue Mountain & Northern acquired a former Pennsy tender for a "jug" when 425 ran offline.

 

The coal compartment is still intact. Some railroads removed it to increase water capacity.

 

When "the Four-and-a-Quarter" headed Fall Excursions between Port Clinton and Jim Thorpe, the Pennsy "jug" wouldn't fit on the turntable at Jim Thorpe with 425. It had to be turned separately. George Hart's "jug" fit on the turntable with her.

 

The Reading used similar "jugs" in the late steam era on a few freight locomotives.

 

One creative aspect of model railroading is devising a plausible reason for doing something you like. A "jug" could be used with a 4-4-0 in excursion service. Or the ruins of a water tower could be placed where visitors will notice it to explain a "jug."

 

There is a prototype for everything. Somebody somewhere probably used a "jug" on a small steamer for any of various reasons.

 

No. 425 made her debut in a new paint scheme this past weekend when NKP Berkshire 765 stopped in Jim Thorpe on her return from Pittston. Her "jug" has the same dark blue paint with black trucks. It was spotted in the yard by her Pennsy "jug." But in all the excitement I didn't get a photo. It wasn't lettered, so that offers another possibility - a blank (undecorated) "jug."

 

This new RBM&N herald resembles the Gulf, Mobile & Northern herald on her Baldwin builder's photo

 

I just remembered that tank cars were used a "jugs" on African steamers, and they still are. Go to www.youtube.com and look for videos. That's another option.

I have never heard the term "canteen" used to refer to an auxiliary tender. 

I was under the impression that the N&W referred to them as a "canteen", back in the late steam days.

I have a photo somewhere of a Santa Fe 2-6-2 west of Topeka, on the 1st district (now Topeka Sub) with a water car converted from an old tank car, early 1950's.

I've always heard them called canteens. Of course my grandfather was a N&W fireman, and he always called them canteen cars.