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Surprise from my Williams F Diesel

OldcatOldcatOGR Forum Member DIGITAL SUBSCRIBER

Several years ago I bought a Williams PRR F Diesel and dummy. I opted on no sound just to save a few bucks. After buying a couple of other units with factory installed sound I decided to add a Railsounds Commander to this unit as I love how well it runs. The shell comes off and I am surprised to see a speaker that was factory installed. I leave it alone as it has the two wires attached to to a circuit board and I don't want any trouble by doing something stupid since I am not any kind of an electronic wizard what-so-ever. I proceed to install the new board and speaker. A trial run proves I was adequately able to follow the installation instructions and the formerly silent unit erupts with diesel idling sounds but what else am I hearing? When I engage the bell and then the horn I hear the Williams sounds competing with the Railsounds, each from their own speaker. Two distinct and different bells and two horns! An easy fix, I clip one of the wires to the Williams speaker but I am totally puzzled as to why adding a different sound board that is not attached to the other electronics has activated sounds that I presumed were absent when purchased. Why has merely connecting power to the Railsounds board via the third rail and a ground caused this occurrence? Is there something else I should do other than cutting the Williams speaker wire to silence the Williams sounds? 

 

Joe

Last edited by Oldcat
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OldcatOldcatOGR Forum Member DIGITAL SUBSCRIBER

Rob,

Problem solved. You were correct, Sir! You have amazed me, again. Turns out my memory wasn't so good. I apparently assumed this Williams had no sound. What a goofball I am, again. As far as selling it? I shall keep it for now but thanks for the idea. Afterall, had I not installed the Railsounds module I never would have activated the True-Blast. Maybe needlepoint is a better hobby for me.

GZ Gordon ZOGR Forum Member

The diesels that had no sound were the very earliest ones.  Later ones had "electronic horn" only, which sounded like a rude doorbell.  Then True Blast was issued, followed by True Blast 2.  There were several incarnations of True Blast 2, depending on the component suppliers for Williams.  Jerry Williams saved a little money later by buying cheap components, and those horn/bell boards tend to sound scratchy.  WBB boards seem to share the scratchy quality of the less pleasing issues of the pre-Bachmann True Blast 2 boards.  For a short while, Williams made an optional "True Sounds" board, which provided horn, bell, prime mover sounds, and a short dispatcher announcement.

P phillyreadingOGR Forum Member
Originally Posted by Gordon Z:

The diesels that had no sound were the very earliest ones.  Later ones had "electronic horn" only, which sounded like a rude doorbell.  Then True Blast was issued, followed by True Blast 2.  There were several incarnations of True Blast 2, depending on the component suppliers for Williams.  Jerry Williams saved a little money later by buying cheap components, and those horn/bell boards tend to sound scratchy.  WBB boards seem to share the scratchy quality of the less pleasing issues of the pre-Bachmann True Blast 2 boards.  For a short while, Williams made an optional "True Sounds" board, which provided horn, bell, prime mover sounds, and a short dispatcher announcement.

With the Crown Edition diesels Williams used a circuit board from QSI for what was called "Station Sounds" which had the diesel engine revving sounds and bell & horn. The bell and horn sort of worked together, the bell wound sound at low speeds and the horn would sound at higher speed or voltage when the whistle button was pressed.

 

Some early Williams engines that had a motor similar to Lionel's post war motors didn't have a sound system. Also some of the Williams "Reproduction Series" diesels lacked any sound system.

 

While some early diesels after the Lionel style motor had only a small circuit board and speaker that gave a rather crude horn sound.

 

Lee Fritz

GZ Gordon ZOGR Forum Member
Lee, the diesel sounds board was never called "Station Sounds."  It was always referred to as "True Sounds."  "Station Sounds" refers to a never-produced sound board that was supposed to be an option in Madison dining cars and/or passenger cars.  Some of these cars come with a connector, but the board itself was never produced.  You can read on the passenger car boxes that these cars were "Stations Sounds" ready.  Unfortunately, they only came with a connector.
 
"Crown" was a name applied to all Williams production within a certain time period.  Some Crown diesels came with electronic horns; some came with True Blast; and others were optionally equipped with "True Sounds" boards as described in catalogs and brochures from that period.  The "True Sounds" boards cost extra and could be factory installed or added by the customer himself.
 
In my experience, the best-sounding True Blast horns were used in the period when Williams products came in red "shoeboxes" (as Marty Bowersock called them) with thick gray foam.  These horns and bells did not seem as scratchy as some that came later (better electronics?).  By this time, I believe, "True Sounds" was no longer available.
 
I have Crown edition diesels with each of the above.
 
Originally Posted by phillyreading:

With the Crown Edition diesels Williams used a circuit board from QSI for what was called "Station Sounds" which had the diesel engine revving sounds and bell & horn. The bell and horn sort of worked together, the bell wound sound at low speeds and the horn would sound at higher speed or voltage when the whistle button was pressed.

 

Some early Williams engines that had a motor similar to Lionel's post war motors didn't have a sound system. Also some of the Williams "Reproduction Series" diesels lacked any sound system.

 

While some early diesels after the Lionel style motor had only a small circuit board and speaker that gave a rather crude horn sound.

 

Lee Fritz

 

prrhorseshoecurveprrhorseshoecurveOGR Forum Member DIGITAL SUBSCRIBER
It baffles me on how some of you call a horn or bell sound a "sound system". Sound systems to me incorporate steam chuff/ diesel engine sound along with a whistle/horn and bell sounds. Postwar Lionel had whistle/ horn sounds but they are not referred to as a " sound system". The #622 switcher may have a bell sound but that isn't referred as a "sound system"
GZ Gordon ZOGR Forum Member
You are correct.  The only "sound system" made by pre-Bachmann Williams was the "True Sounds" board, which had diesel idling and acceleration and deceleration sounds, bell, horn, and a brief dispatcher announcement as the engine started to "leave the station."  It was made by Ott and resembled early QSI boards found in Weaver and MTH.  This "True Sounds" board was similar to but less refined (fewer bits) than the new Bachmann Williams True Blast Plus board.  And neither of these diesel sound boards can be turned off except by disconnecting them.
 
All other Williams boards had the digital "sound" of horn alone, bell alone, horn and bell, or whistle and bell.
 
Williams literature mentions "True Sounds" (with steam sounds and whistle) in certain brass steam locomotives, but I have no experience with that board and have never heard it.
 
Originally Posted by prrhorseshoecurve:
It baffles me on how some of you call a horn or bell sound a "sound system". Sound systems to me incorporate steam chuff/ diesel engine sound along with a whistle/horn and bell sounds. Postwar Lionel had whistle/ horn sounds but they are not referred to as a " sound system". The #622 switcher may have a bell sound but that isn't referred as a "sound system"

 

P phillyreadingOGR Forum Member

Gordon,

 

I hate to dis-agree with you on the sound system by Williams as some of the earlier "True Sounds" as you say it is called were made by QSI and had QSI circuit boards in them from what I can tell from the lettering stamped on them. The announcement was "Leaving on track 10, all clear to depart on track 10." I have a set of Crown Edition Santa Fe F-7's and a set of Reading Lines F-7's that have the QSI circuit boards in them, no mention of OTT on them just QSI. 

The later run of Williams used the OTT circuit boards or maybe the second run of Crown Edition engines were equipped with OTT circuit boards.

 

Another thing I have seen with Williams Crown Edition passenger cars is the knuckle couplers are fixed(unable to open) on the first run and are able to open on the second or third run of the Crown Edition passenger cars. I have two sets of Crown Edition passenger cars for the same railroad name and the couplers are different on the two sets.

 

Lee Fritz

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