The Wreck of CP E8A #1801 - 1968

Hey Terry  I searched for about 20 minutes and can't find anything on this one. I started as a brakeman for CNR in 1965 near Toronto   and always get interested in this type of thing. Side swipe? Head on?   Train orders?    Something went amiss. Hope someone comes up with a little more info.

Thanks, Gregg.

I was hoping someone would pipe up with more details as to what an investigation might have uncovered as to the cause. Also, 1801 does not seem THAT damaged to my eye. But she was already nineteen years old in 1968. That might have entered into the decision to scrap her?

I was rather astonished to see the youtube video!

You have probably hit the nail on the head, Terry.  By 1968, CPR had plenty of engines and RDC's equipped for its shrinking passenger service, and was no longer traditionally concerned about the type of units used (example: GP9's on the Canadian). And, the three E8's were orphans and lacked dynamic braking, limiting their use to the eastern end of the railroad.

Thanks, Tom.

I had considered 1801's age, but not the fact the interest in passenger equipment was already in great decline at the time by RR management.

When I was up in the Three rivers area and or over at Gaspe. I remember reading an article that may have been this one. 

Radio's were fairly new to the area and I believe the RS18's were sitting in a dead zone on a remote siding waiting for the opposing traffic to pass. It was delayed so bad when it passed it was assumed to be the extra. They proceeded out of the siding and quickly found the extra coming at them.

I will see if I can find the article and follow up.

Jamie

I believe Via took over around 1970 . Prior to Via CN and CP had their own Passenger trains. I don't remember any of our guys(CN) using dynamics brakes on passenger anywhere. Not even in the Alberta and BC mountains.

Hi Jamie.. Good to hear from you... In train order territory , a regular scheduled train  could run  out of schedule. If you were running 12 hours late  you were dead in the water and had to get new orders. 

You're right, of course, Gregg.  CNR and CPR took opposing views of dynamic braking.  CPR embraced it and used it liberally.  CNR apparently did not see value in the extra cost and maintenance, and so did not purchase many first generation diesels so-equipped (none of which, I believe, were passenger diesels).

The E8's just didn't fit in well with the large CPR FP7/FP9 fleet, and were certainly unsuitable on CPR's steeper grades crossing the Rockies.  To the credit of its Locomotive Engineers, CNR did fine without dynamic braking. However, it had a different profile from CPR's in the west.  It's all Canadian dollars spent on dynamic braking or on brake shoes.  Neither was free, and each road made a choice which best suited its respective situation.

But - back to the actual topic of this thread - perhaps one of the historical societies inherited the mechanical records of the CPR E8's, and, if so, there is likely a document justifying the retirement of CPR E8 1801.  My "little voice" tells me that those three orphan E8's were a burr under the saddle of more than one CPR Mechanical Department official.  Two of everything in the engine room, a different control stand, no automatic backward transition, special curved number board glass, no dynamic brake -- the deck was stacked against them on a railroad that mainly used F-units on passenger trains, and they went to retirement before the FP7's.

And, so far nothing has come to light as to the cause and circumstances of the head-on collision, which is even more in line with the topic.

Tom, I never tire of your thoughtful and literate posts.