TMCC Steamer on a Legacy Layout won't Smoke!

After you press AUX1 try holding down the + icon for up to 10 seconds.

These older tmcc steamers have a "smoke boost" feature to superheat the unit.

The newer legacy smoke units do this automatically when they are turned on

RickO - that's exactly what I did - still no smoke.  But, in conventional, just fine!  It's driving me nuts!

Try switching from TMCC mode to Cab1 mode.

Pete

Is this a legacy engine or tmcc.  If legacy it needs the cab 2 in the legacy mode, but I imagine you know that.  Also do a reset.

What "resets" did you do?  Did you do the complete reset as described in the user's manual?  Specifically, the second part of the reset with the 74 reset code?

Try re-programming.

Bill

Alright - here's what I have discovered.  When I put my ear up to the smoke stack, I can hear the smoke unit fan whirring, and when I hit "Aux1 and 8 (or the minus sign) the whirring stops - as it should.  When I hit "Aux1 and 9 (or the plus sign) the fans starts up again and I hear steam sounds indicating I am increasing the smoke unit heat.  However, no smoke coming out!  Now, it's not even smoking in conventional mode!

I opened it up and saw the little smoke unit in there - and a replacement (FAN DRIVEN SMOKE UNIT / RECT / DIESEL / 27 OHM) from Lionel can be had for $30 - but I am not sure how difficult it would be to swap out - or even if that would fix the issue!

You should first check to make sure the smoke resistor reads 27 ohms. You can replace them without replacing the whole unit. Look at the circuit board on top of the smoke unit. The two terminals closest to the motor leads are for the motor. The smoke resistor is the other two. If that reads 27 ohms check the cable running from the smoke unit to one of the boards, usually the mother board that the radio board plugs into. Unplug them and plug them back in. If still no smoke you might have a bad triac (the large one) on the R2LC (radio board).

Pete

Just for curiosity how much fluid did you put in? If this loco was NIB you could add allmost a whole eyedropper to get the new wicking saturated.

If it already has a fan driven unit, why are you considering replacing it?  I'd start by repacking it with a new wick, make SURE you use at least 20 drops of fluid to start, and then run it.  Also, if you have a meter, check the value of the smoke resistor.

Lyle, I just noticed on the parts breakdown that that smoke unit has a regulator. I had a TMCC loco that had rarly intermittent to no smoke production.

It ended up being the regulator, as was recommended byLionel tech when I emailed them on how to repair it myself as it was out of warranty.

The regulator controls the voltage going to the resistor.

http://www.lionel.com/CustomerService/ReplacementParts/index.cfm?doAction=productPartFilter&number=610-8057-200&productID=1067947c-6b7a-424a-a2d3-705c23d6c233

The regulator is only $.80,( plus the lousy $9 flat rate shipping) worth a shot.

OK - so here's what's happening.  If I hit Aux1 and hold down the "9" button for a good ten seconds, the steams starts blowing GREAT!  The longer I hold down the button, the better the smoke gets.  If I let go of the 9 button, It'll keep blowing for about a minute or so - then it stops smoking. I know that pressing the 9 button "superheats" the smoke unit and it supposed to be used at startup to help warm up the smoke unit.

But after a minute, I have to push that 9 button another ten seconds to get the smoke going again. So, it seems that "superheating" the resistor is working - but it keeps reverting back to a mode that isn't hot enough to make smoke.  I really don't want to continually have to keep my finger on the 9 button!

That's what I have learned so far - hope this helps!

If no one else chimes in with an exact solution, email Lionel at the "service/repair question heading here.

http://www.lionel.com/ContactUs/

Fill out the requested info and tell them exactly what you just posted.

The email is not limited to warranty repairs, they are quite helpful diagnosing a problem and recommending the necessary repair/parts for the "do-it-youselfer". As I stated above thats how I solved my smoke unit problem.

DO NOT CALL, EMAIL, it has been my impression that MR himself  and/or his " tech crew" read the emails sent to "service/repair question".

Actually, that's the regulator for the fan.  There's no way that regulator handles the current required for the resistor.  Note the description: TO-92 5 volt Regulator

From the sounds of it, either the wick is not properly in contact with the smoke resistor, or you need a lower value resistor.  The 27 ohm resistors are marginal at times, I've had better luck with 22 or 24 ohm resistors.

What voltage are you putting to the track?  Crank it up

Good point Ben, I'm assuming 18 volts, probably a mistake on my part.

18 volts is correct! I'l l open her up tonite and check out the wick - but the thing is like new- even though it's 12 years old.  Been sitting, unused, in storage all that time.

You should check the Lionel video by Mike Reagan if you haven't on improving TMCC smoke units.  He covers removing the resistor, drilling out the fan intake hole, and properly packing the smoke unit.  The mods make a significant difference on anything I've done them on.

Here you go.

Well, I tried the TMCC smoke unit improvement video - and no difference!  I removed the wick from the resistor, replaced the lionel batting with tiki torch wick, and enlarged the air intake hole.

Still does NOT smoke unless I HOLD DOWN the #9 key to initiate smoke unit superheating.  If I take my finger off the #9 key, the smoke disappears in about 20 seconds.

Now, if I run it CONVENTIONAL at highball speed, it smokes! But in command mode, no go unless I keep my finger on the #9 button.

Any other suggestions?

My next step would be to replace the smoke resistor with a 22 ohm resistor.

Where would I find the resistor?

Given the other symptoms, it's hard to believe the R2LC is bad, but if you have a spare, you could try swapping it in.

You can get various value smoke resistors from many parts places, try Boxcar Bill on the forum here.

I have to say, I've had a number of bad smoke triacs, but never one that was "sort of" bad.  Swapping the R2LC is an easy test, so maybe that's the first thing to try.

I have to agree with gunrunner.

I would go for an 18 ohm resistor if you want to make a Lionel smoke.

BoxcarBill or Chuck Sartor are both good sources.

Rod

You are correct Bob, probably a quick swap of the R2LC and checking the wiring from the motherboard to the smoke unit would be a useful exercise.  However, if that doesn't fix it, the next step is the resistor.

The value will probably vary with your individual engine, I've found that 22 ohms makes a large difference in the typical Lionel smoke unit.  Obviously 18 ohms would yield more smoke, but you're also putting a lot of current through the smoke triac, that may bite you in the long run.  If I were going to 18 ohms, I'd probably rig some sort of little heatsink on the smoke triac.

You folks wouldn't happen to know WHERE I could get this work done- this is beyond my capabilities.

Thanks.

I don't know about locally in GA, but there are plenty of good folks in the forum that offer these services if you don't mind shipping it.

I just need to find them! lol

Well, I'll bet Boxcar Bill would fix it for you, and he's very reasonably priced.

Thanks - I'm emailing him now

UPDATE:  Got my Lionel B&O "President Harrison" back from the great folks at Lionel repair and she smokes like a champ!

STARHOPPER I too have no smoke in a tmcc crescent 2003 , you mentioned hitting aux 1 and then the +. where on cab 1 is the + icon ????, Jeff.

it matters how you have the CAB-2 setup, the icons are different for each layout but the locations are the same. IF you do not see a +  or - look for the smoke icon. It's in the 8 and 9 keypad position. 9 is +