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TMCC works, sound doesn't - FIXED

SH Southwest HiawathaOGR Forum Member

I just acquired a Weaver VO-1000 switcher with TMCC. Early version, SAW board, no EOB, no volume pot. The unit runs fine; all TMCC functions work except the sound. Not a squeak. I've reset the unit (code 43 according to Weaver's instructions) and tried the sound/no sound switch in both positions (for some reason a lot of the Weaver diesels tend to have this switch installed backwards). I've also played with the volume control on the remote. Continuity looks OK. I tried it with a known good sound board, same result. I would suspect the speaker but there is no sound at all - not even static - and I kind of think even a bad speaker would make some kind of sound. It's like the sound is turned off. Is there some sequence of button pushes I'm missing to turn the sound on and off? Any other suggestions? I can always order a new speaker from Weaver, but I'm not at all convinced that is the problem. 

 

Thanks in advance. 

Last edited by Southwest Hiawatha
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SH Southwest HiawathaOGR Forum Member
Originally Posted by Stephen C. Puntar:

I would put one back in and see what happens.

Why? TMCC is designed so the battery is ONLY used for conventional operation, to wind down the sound when you shut it off and to cover the gaps when power is interrupted. In command operation, the battery has no function at all, except to present a risk of damage from leaks if you don't replace the thing every year or two. I have at least 20 TMCC engines, all of which work fine without a battery. 

Stephen C. PuntarStephen C. PuntarOGR Forum Member

I have a 1995 hudson that had lost all of its rail sounds. It had whistle and bell's and thats it. Some one suggested that I install the battery and everything is working again on TMCC. The TMCC manual says you don't need the battery except in conventional mode,but the engine manual say's you do. I don't know if it will help but it worked for me.

SH Southwest HiawathaOGR Forum Member
That's weird - something else had to happen besides adding a battery. And, now that I think about it, I did test run the engine with a battery in it, before I pulled the shell to check for bad wiring, etc. The battery tested good after I removed it. z
 
Originally Posted by Stephen C. Puntar:

I have a 1995 hudson that had lost all of its rail sounds. It had whistle and bell's and thats it. Some one suggested that I install the battery and everything is working again on TMCC. The TMCC manual says you don't need the battery except in conventional mode,but the engine manual say's you do. I don't know if it will help but it worked for me.

 

cjackcjackOGR Forum Member DIGITAL SUBSCRIBER
Originally Posted by Southwest Hiawatha:
Originally Posted by Ukaflyer:

Have you/can you test the speaker for resistance just to make sure?

 

Haven't done that yet; might try it if nothing else works. I'm going to talk to Gary at Weaver tomorrow and might just order a speaker. They don't cost much and if I put in a new one I know that isn't the problem. 

If you have an multimeter, and it sounds like you do if you are checking batteries, just put it on ohms and measure across the speaker leads. The speaker will make a ticking noise if it is a good speaker. They either work or they don't work. There is almost no "should do some sound if it's bad" condition. The issue is, that reading the speaker impedance with the circuit hooked up to it may confuse you in that the resistance you are reading could be the electronics driving the speaker. BUT, if the speaker makes a sound when you connect the ohmmeter, then it is clearly ok and you can move on to the board driving it.

SH Southwest HiawathaOGR Forum Member
Bingo. Open circuit. Dead as Elvis. That's a new one on me; first time I've seen a speaker that was just dead. I'm more familiar with them going out gradually, with the sound getting raspy but still making some kind of unpleasant noise. As in the chronic issue with early MTH PS/2 speakers, and a stereo or two. 
 
OK, now to call Weaver and order a new speaker. I'll probably get a couple of them; that speaker is really tiny and might come in handy for a custom installation in a tight spot. 
 
Thanks to all who posted suggestions. 
 
Originally Posted by cjack:
Originally Posted by Southwest Hiawatha:
Originally Posted by Ukaflyer:

Have you/can you test the speaker for resistance just to make sure?

 

Haven't done that yet; might try it if nothing else works. I'm going to talk to Gary at Weaver tomorrow and might just order a speaker. They don't cost much and if I put in a new one I know that isn't the problem. 

If you have an multimeter, and it sounds like you do if you are checking batteries, just put it on ohms and measure across the speaker leads. The speaker will make a ticking noise if it is a good speaker. They either work or they don't work. There is almost no "should do some sound if it's bad" condition. The issue is, that reading the speaker impedance with the circuit hooked up to it may confuse you in that the resistance you are reading could be the electronics driving the speaker. BUT, if the speaker makes a sound when you connect the ohmmeter, then it is clearly ok and you can move on to the board driving it.

 

SH Southwest HiawathaOGR Forum Member
Swapped them out with known good boards from another unit that happened to be open on my bench with a non-sound problem. No change. Thanks for mentioning the "RS boards," I had checked the sound board but forgotten the RS power board and went back and tested that before I pulled the speaker and found it was dead.
 
Originally Posted by gunrunnerjohn:

Have you had someone test the RS boards?  If you have a different TMCC locomotive, you can swap them in and test them yourself.

 

 

Rod StewartRod StewartOGR Forum Member SUPPORTING MEMBERDIGITAL SUBSCRIBER

"

Bingo. Open circuit. Dead as Elvis. That's a new one on me; first time I've seen a speaker that was just dead. I'm more familiar with them going out gradually, with the sound getting raspy but still making some kind of unpleasant noise. As in the chronic issue with early MTH PS/2 speakers, and a stereo or two. 
 
OK, now to call Weaver and order a new speaker. I'll probably get a couple of them; that speaker is really tiny and might come in handy for a custom installation in a tight spot. "
 
If its an 8 ohm 2" speaker maybe think about replacing it with a Lionel Fatboy?
Way better sound IMO
 
Rod
 
G GGGOGR Forum Member
Originally Posted by gunrunnerjohn:

I can only remember one dead speaker in a Lionel set out of hundreds.  OTOH, I've seen a number of the bad speakers in the PS/2 5V setups.

 


My statement was when Lionel came in for sound issues, not every Lionel that comes in.  So I think it is still sound (forgive the pun) to reseat a board, check the volume pot and speaker.  G

SH Southwest HiawathaOGR Forum Member
Weaver designed that engine with a flat speaker and the 9v battery right behind it. The speaker is an inch and a half or less across and maybe a quarter inch thick. As built there's no room at all, although without a battery I could probably build some sort of small baffle behind the speaker. That falls into the category of "feasible, but probably more trouble than it's worth." The sound is surprisingly good for such a tiny speaker. I think the fuel tank does act as a baffle, to some degree.
 
Originally Posted by gunrunnerjohn:

If the original didn't have a baffle on the back, adding one can help.  Even a flat plate right behind the speaker does wonders for the sound.

 

cjackcjackOGR Forum Member DIGITAL SUBSCRIBER
Originally Posted by GGG:
Originally Posted by gunrunnerjohn:

I can only remember one dead speaker in a Lionel set out of hundreds.  OTOH, I've seen a number of the bad speakers in the PS/2 5V setups.

 


My statement was when Lionel came in for sound issues, not every Lionel that comes in.  So I think it is still sound (forgive the pun) to reseat a board, check the volume pot and speaker.  G

I've had all volume pots. Either a bad lug connection inside or no contact at full volume of the wiper.

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