Train shows

Jim, this has been the case since I attended my first train show many years ago. I guess they have a price in their heads what an item(s) is worth and stay away from reality. It is their nickel, so who really cares. I just walk by them.

 

Fortunately, there are many sellers out there that do offer their merchandise at a fair price, so in most cases, the shows are worth attending. 

Some say that such sellers aren't really interested in moving merchandise.  It's just their way of getting out and socializing.

Jim,

 

A bit presumptuous to try and dictate what other people do. The best thing to do if you don't like the price, (my opinion of course) is to haggle a bit, or chuckle and move on. It's been a while since I attended a York meet, but prices were all over the map. I got some bargains and good buys, and I also chuckled a bit. Some people like to haggle, Some folks are greedy, some are uniformed as to values. When I go to a show to sell, I always mark stuff a bit higher than I will sell for because invariably, people will try and beat you down on price. Bottom line is, it is all a game. If you find your tolerance is tested, may be a good day to stay at home. Sometimes I do!

 

Simon

Some are willing to haggle a lot but at same time looking for the unknowing and get close to there way over price also some know there going to get haggled down so they over price to get what they really want then some as others have said live in a dream world

In most cases some are folks trying to hold on to yesterday. They bought trains back in the "Glory Days"of the 80's & 90's. Rather than break even and get at least some of their cash out lay back. They would rather keep hauling the same old trains back and forth.

The prices don't bother me at all. It's their stuff, I just shake my head and move on, but the thought still keeps poppin into my mind. There's no doubt some of them believe it's still 1980.

Jim

Hello

Came back form here in central Fl - Deland show on 4/11/2015 at the fair grounds,nice place , great parking areas.

Saw the same vendors that where there when I went last year [ 2 shows ago ]

Most of the stuff was MSRP or just 5/10 % off.

Some mom and pop tables ,I did  not see anything that was really rare

There was a lot of great stuff that did not sell and looked it was just getting put out to fill up the tables.

Saw lots of people walking around with empty hands

One guy even  said so and wanted me to buy what he wanted to get rid of,great deal for him ,not so much for me , as I gave up and moved on.

Talked with most of the vendors about what I was looking for.got the same reply.

Over priced stuff that everyone else had .

Heck one guy told me that he was loosing money at that price [ No Box ] ,while at another table The that  guy had it new in the box !

Same price ! ? ! ?

I know selling a meets in not fun as the Wife and I did the Mustang thing when we were into the Mustangs  [ still have one ,but that's another story ]

Did find just ONE GUY that listened to what I was looking for and that's where I spent my funds.

Got his card and will be calling him as he now knows what I am looking for.

He took my number down too and said if he found it ,would call.

We ended up talking for a long time about things other than trains

While the show was fun to see the operating layouts,the rest was a bust.

Talked with some of the train people while taking a break and they were saying the same thing.

This did not turn me off as there are shows everywhere this just is the closest to me and I had the time to go.

This Topic comes up on the Forum from time to time.  It is

a Topic of great interest to me.  The reason for that is simple,

since 1986 when I jumped into this great hobby with one purpose

in mind, build my operating collection.

 

That purpose was met with Toy Train Meets throughout New England.

From the NETCA to other meets I was able to get some great deals on

what I was looking for.  When I came to a table with prices Donald

Trump would fine out of mind, I walk on.  I learned this lesson the

hard way.  

 

A wise man once said, if you "argue with a Idiot you become one".

However, to cut them some slack it is a free market, they charge

what they want.  As a result I can walk on by, and look elsewhere.

 

As Brain stated above the majority of dealers are great people, who

want to sell their trains at a price agreeable to them and you.  That 

is the Free Market, it works every time it is tried.

 

Many thanks,

 

Billy C

There are times when attending a train meet that I find vendors with exorbitant prices and I just ignore them.  Nevertheless, this is a free market economy so the prices are often set at what the market will bear.  So be it.  Why waste time bemoaning their prices.  Just walk on by.  It has been my experience, however, that most vendors offer decent pricing and are usually willing to negotiate.  Case in point; I attended a train meet today in Brick Township New Jersey which by and large offered mostly pre and post war items and what was being sold wasn't junk.  I found the pricing to be uniformly reasonable and the dealers were quite pliable.  The few who were selling modern era stuff, including TMCC and Legacy were reasonable as well. 

I was just at our monthly show today and there were so many good deals that it is very easy to ignore the ones that are overpriced and never change.   Great 1:43 cars at great prices was an example.  A super deal was fantastically weathered Atlas and Lionel cars at $30 asking prices!  They were worth extra pricing because of well the weathering was done, but the seller said he was clearing them out.

 

Yet, it wouldn't surprise me if someone posts that they were disappointed in today's show.  If you couldn't find something you wanted at a good price, you must be very hard to please.

 

Art

The days of the train show seem to be winding down. In my area The Allentown Show Greenberg's and ED York are the only decent size train shows left. In comparison when I first started collecting in 1979, there were also big shows in Wayne, NJ, in Dover, NJ and in a few other locations.

If you consider the effects of online train stores, eBay and an aging audience the market in 2015 is probably greatly diminished and shrinking. Its a good time to buy though. I have noticed a sharp decline in the pricing of used trains of late. The last Greenberg's show here in NJ was like a giant rummage sale, train, toy flea market and sadly there were numerous dealers closing their business, retiring and liquidating their inventory. Is there a way to reverse this trend?

IMO, the only chance we have to move the hobby forward is if we can open the doors to all the train shows and meets to families with children and offer things for them to have fun. There are many in this hobby that strongly resist this philosophy. You will soon realize, its just a matter of time!

 

In my area train shows are on the upswing. I just got back from a brand new show today. And I heard that there will probably be a couple more starting up too. Attendance at these local shows were very good this season, with lots of hobbyists, and families with children.

 

Ask reasonable prices, and your trains will sell.

Train shows are definitely a mixed bag. There are lots of unrealistically overpriced items, but I've also found some great bargains. A lot depends on what you're looking for. Of course the older pristine items are going to ask for top dollar. I'm happy to get well-used items that I can repair and operate or kitbash.

 

Sometimes I've gotten a good deal just by taking the time to socialize with the seller and discuss the different items he has for sale. I get a lot of entertainment just from looking. I don't go to a train show with the idea that I "have to have" any particular item. If an appealing item comes my way at the right price, I'll be happy.

I see the same at car shows. the same guys bring the same parts, year after year, overpriced rusted junk, and they can't figure out why the stuff doesn't sell.

train shows are just like real life. some times there are bargains and sometimes there aren't. when you go to several car dealers to purchase a car they are not all at the same price. and we complain about them making too much money.

 i have been on both sides of the table at train shows and i know when i buy all dealers are "crooks" and want too much of my money. when i sell i probably will need a ride home as i won't have gas money to get there because i am giving my stuff away.  just like anything in life you need to be an educated consumer. train shows are a good day out especially when you go with a friend so why not just enjoy looking at whats offered. no one is forcing you to buy.

i was a the Medina Ohio train show today and saw some items i had as a kid,talked to a few friends, found  few o scale decals bought a few 1/43 cars. there were some items i tried to purchase but didn't buy as the seller and i couldn't get together on price , but when i walked passed his table the items were gone, so someone else got great deal, he sold the item and i didn't get the item. who lost in that transaction? i enjoyed the day with my son and can't wait till the next show.

 

 

There's exactly one train show in my area, and it's held in the spring and the fall.  Sometimes the pickings are fabulous; sometimes not so much.  The spring show this year was hardly worth the price of the gas I burned to get there, but I'll be back in the fall.

 

The moral, if there is one, is that I don't expect it to be a fantastic show each and every time.  But if I don't go, I don't find the good stuff, ever.

 

Whether or not there is competition makes a big difference. I lived on Long Island until 2007. In the fall, winter and spring there was a train show almost every weekend. While there were some sellers who maintained high prices, many others sold a wide variety of items for very reasonable prices.

 

Since moving to SC, I've driven hours to get to the shows which are few and far between. I've gone as far as Charlotte (4 hours), Easley (4 1/2 hours) and Jacksonville (2 1/2 hours). My experience is that prices are much higher at these shows, especially on postwar, MPC and newer (NOS) items.

 

I love browsing shows, rummaging through the boxes of stuff under tables, etc. and I usually find a few things to buy, but nothing compared to what was available on Long Island. I also find far fewer O gauge sellers (and many of those are from hobby shops selling at near retail) at SC shows. I was encouraged that the Charleston show expanded to a second building this past November, but overall one of my only regrets about leaving Long Island is missing the many swap meets.

Make a reasonable offer if you see something you like at a train show.  Most vendors expect you to bargain.  I don't know why most Americans are afraid to make an offer.

 

Joe

Most of these show are over priced and it is the same vendor at each of these shows. I have found go during middle of the show see what is what. Close to the end I start playing "Let's made a deal". Most vendor do not want to pack up their goods to go to the next show. So times it works and sometimes it does not but close to the end of the season vendor sometimes want to unload the goods.

I guess you didn’t see the 400E Blue Comet passenger set and the 381E passenger set on a table along with several other standard gauge engines.  The seller was asking $5,200 for the Blue Comet.  I didn’t see a price on the 381 set.  IMO those are really rare!

 

Bill

I am going to take a different approach to the issue of train shows in general. Yes, we all know the guy that carries the same stuff to show after show for what seems like an eternity, and seldom sells anything. These are the people that are there more for the fun of going and the conversation than the actual selling process. Then there are the people that are selling off (or attempting to) dad's trains and have the attitude that dad paid X and therefor we are going to get X, period. These are the folks I really feel sorry for since they will cart their stuff to show after show never selling much of anything, and the boxes and merchandise gets more and more beat up so that their merchandise is worth less and less.

 

Then there is someone like me that do shows not only for fun, but also as a business. I often wonder if some of the people posting on forums have a clue what it takes to do these shows. In my case, my smallest setup is twelve (12) tables, and the largest twenty-four (24) tables. At any given show I have between $40,000 and $60,000 worth of merchandise for sale from N to O gauge. It takes at a minimum four people to man the booth, and do the set-up and tear-down. With all of the costs, I am into a show for $3500 before I sell anything. I always start each season with fresh merchandise, price it fairly, and yes I will deal within reason. However, if I can not make a reasonable profit there is no point to the sale, and really no point in continuing to do all the work necessary attending the shows. At the end of the season I pick a show that I use as a "clean out" show where I lower prices to move the old stuff in preparation for new stuff. I use a different show each season for this purpose so I spread the deals around.

 

One last thing I would like to point out for consideration. When making a low ball offer, and the seller counters with a higher offer, how about working toward a middle ground where both buyer and seller can be happy. A wise old man once said that the best deal is the one where nobody is completely happy.

 

Regards,

Randall

 

 

 

There are a lot of people that have no interest in the old rusty relics anymore. The sellers who think they have gold on there hands keep lugging the same old stuff back and forth year after year Haven't realized that yet. It still amazes me how it can possibly be worth loading the car after hotel,food and gas expenses Like going to York? 

 

I agree and I have to say 2008 was a great year for deals if you have the cash to purchase them. Everyone has gold in their collection but where is the price of gold today compared to a few years ago? A reasonable price will always sell if you have someone at the show looking for it. I will go to the table where people are selling a collect to see what they have and at price.  Sometimes they are reasonable and sometimes they are not, if they are not move on. If they are reasonable I give them some advise if they start talking about feed bay pricing.  I give them the break down on feed bay pricing and how much time and money it is actually cost them to do business on feed bay. IE the listing cost, the time to take the photo, write the description, PayPal cost and the actual sending the merchandize when sold. Also the associated cost for the show and their time being at the show and cost of storage every month for the trains Or do you want cash right now on the spot?

quote:

There are a lot of people that have no interest in the old rusty relics anymore.

 

Perhaps there are. Maybe a lot of folks on the OGR folks are not interested.
Yet there are other folks who are interested in original prewar, postwar, and even older Modern era trains.
Sometimes I wonder what attracts the folks who are only interested in the new stuff to train shows. Isn't all that stuff generally available in stores and online?

 

 

There are lots of other reasons to attend a train show. You might find a old new piece you have been looking for or find a good deal on something a dealer may not have in in stock or sold out. I think there will be good  deals out there for those who like pre or post war trains. I think also there will always be a market for pristine pre or post war trains with the boxes for those who can afford a premium price that goes with it.

I go to a few during the year in Montreal and don't really look for anything in particular. Since our Canadian dollar tanked, I don't buy new often unless it is new stock purchased before xmas when the exchange was about 12%.  It's about 26% now ...

 

In the fall I found a very nice ZW for 80$ ... Canadian 

This weekend I helped a friend deal for a mint KW including the box and afterwards just talking with the seller found out he had a Powerhouse 180 which was squirreled away which I purchased. Also picked up a few new in box box cars from another table. 

 

I find it easier to deal when you buy more than one item ... if I see something I like, I usually look for a 2nd item before making an offer. 

 

 

I really like train shows. You get meet other people in the hobby, you sell stuff if you rent a table(usually in advance) and buy some nice stuff that you won't find at a hobby shop normally.

I have bought and sold at one train show in particular in Deerfield Beach FL.

I bought a set of Atlas 21 inch Amtrak cars and sold them again at the next show, the cars were too long(no other issues) for my small layout. Also the Atlas cars needed a very large engine to pull them with as the coupler spacing was very critical, too small an engine and instant derailment on curves.

 

Lee Fritz

I think there are three or four thoughts here, but the run-on makes them difficult to decipher.  PUNCTUATION, it's a good concept.

What does priced to sell mean?  Do you sell a $50 MSRP boxcar for a $1 or $10? 

 

Many items that are priced to sell at train shows do not move for reasons other than price.  Probably the biggest reason stuff doesn't move at SF Bay Area train shows is that the same people attend show after show.  These people already have two of everything that is for sale and are not about to buy another one at any price.  They attend the show to socialize with old friends.

 

A long time collector told me that 30 years ago the train shows were packed and nearly everything would sell.  He also said that 30 years ago he was in his 40s and didn't have any trains in his collection.  He is now in his 70s.  His kids don't want the trains and so his biggest problem is how to get rid of them.  We just don't have people in their 40s entering this hobby.

 

The general public are at the show for cheap entertainment.  They look at the modular layouts with their kids and may buy a toy or two but generally do not spend real money ($100 plus) on trains.  I have never seen a mom or dad with a couple of kids purchase an expensive train at my table or anyone's else's table.  The vast majority of my sales go to people who have been in the hobby for many years.

 

The biggest problem I see from a sellers viewpoint is that not enough new people are entering hobby.  The few people who are entering the hobby are looking for new stuff.  They will buy a Lionel VL Big Boy for $2,000 and pass on an older Lionel or MTH Big Boy priced at $300.  This is the reason you see the same older $300 Big Boy at show after show.  (The seller would probably accept $250 if asked.)  Would it sell at $100 or $50?  Maybe or maybe not?  I know I wouldn't buy it even at $50 because I already have too many large engines.

 

Joe

 

 

 

 

I was going to go, but I decided to work on my layout and hang out outside and enjoy the weather.   Now I wish I had gone.  I have always found things to be reasonable priced at this show.

For me "priced to sell" meant boxed Lionel/Flyer freight cars for 20 bucks a pop and die cast 1/64th vehicles for 2 bucks carded and 1 buck without packaging.  Negotiable for bulk purchases. 

 

I went home with empty totes.

 

Rusty

A friend told me an amusing story about a dealer.  He would see this guy at every show.  All his trains were overpriced and he would never sell anything.  Finally my friend said to him, "You know, your prices are too high.   That's why you aren't selling anything."  The seller's response,  "Who said I'm trying to sell anything?   It's my wife that wants me to get rid of my trains."

 

Bob

My experience with train shows is pretty limited.  I go to  few small ones here in Florida.   I do much much better making reasonable deals when I bring my 9 year old.  He seems to bring out the best in the veterans and most if not all are very kind and friendly to him.   Unfortunately I don't see many other young children there...just a handful with dads like me.   I have taught my son about the proper protocol and behavior of train shows and respecting others' property and he is very good at listening to that and being respectful.

69 nickey camaro: did you stop by my table at medina? i had the table in the corner of the west hall with all the mikes purple boxes. when i set up ,show looked like a dud,but i had a couple volume buyers that helped out. found a premier crane car for $30,so i was happy,butit  seems this show has more store dealers and less mom-pop tables [selling their personal items]-jim