Ugh, bought seven Lionel UP 0-27 cars & are too small

beautiful cars, but as you guessed, they were meant for the 2023 Alcos, or the Postwar steamers.

Let me see what I have in terms of those and i may be able to help you dispose of them.  Another frustrating and divisive thing about our great hobby that doesn't exist in HO or many other scales.

This is just me, but ever since I was a little kid, I did not like the 0-27 passenger cars. Next to the beautiful Lionel Line aluminum cars, there was no fair comparison.

 

I know many love them, and they serve a segment of our hobby, but they are not me. Good luck in providing a new home for them.

I like the Lionel 2400 series O-27's to be pulled by PW Alco's and also PW PRR S-2 Turbines.

 

 

Well Chip, with as often as you are on the forum, why didn't you post a question before buying them? Or even look for videos of the cars running on YouTube?

 

If your loco if one of the older Railking truly semi-scale F-3's, those cars would be a closer size match, than for one of the newer Railking Scale types of locos.

 

There was a time when 3-rail trains were nearly all semi-scale in one way or another. And it wasn't a big deal. And if it was a big deal, you went to HO.

 

The true frustration now, is not that there are scale and semi-scale items made and available, but that...

1) From a manufacturer vantage, they are not always clearly indicated or properly advertised as to what they actually are. If anyone recalls, that was a huge criticism of K-Line when they first started making the larger more scale sized products.

 

2) And from a consumer vantage, with all the information that is now available through the internet, buyers are in a much better position to be properly informed before they make a purchase.

 

I'm sure the over all sales numbers of the Lionel semi-scale passenger car type pictured above far far exceed all the other newer more scale proportioned passenger cars, even though reading this forum would have you believe otherwise.

 

Those cars above are the only ones I buy, but Union Pacific is not one of my road choices.

Actually........

My original intent was to use my vintage Post War UP Alco's.

However, those are prone to heat warping on the shells.

Thus, I wanted a TMCC, Legacy, or DCS version of those PW Alco's, of which...the only ones I know of are from this $1500+ Lionel set:

 

http://www.lionel.com/Products...neID=&CatalogId=

 

As a result, when I saw that MTH had DCS F3's with the following "Marketing Plug", I figured they would look good:

 

Postwar and RailKing Scale fans will no doubt want to order this stellar M.T.H. replica of model railroading's most famous diesel. The look and feel of the classic original is faithfully reproduced, right down to the diecast metal chassis. Under the hood, however, lies the power and performance of ProtoSound 3.0, twin flywheel-equipped motors, and Proto-Smoke, offering today's model railroaders an operating experience that boys of the 1950s could only dream about.

I think that size passenger car (11 to 13") is fine on a very small layout like mine, behind the 'TRADITIONAL SIZE' Loco or engine.

 

 

What part of O-27 didn't you understand?

Do you think a set of standards will ever be applied to this?  I would like to think that we could all agree as to what the apparently 3 different terms would be.  Traditional, Semi-scale, and scale.  O-27 is not very descriptive other than to inform it will run on O-27 curves.  

well to me at least...

O27 is the smaller sized trains

Semi Scale is )27 with more detail

and Scale is full sized O Gauge

Williams by Bachmann offers a Union Pacific yellow O-27 FA-2 AA set, #2023Y.  it's listed as discontinued, but some dealers seem to have them.

You should be able to pick up a set of the new Lionel Conventional Classic UP Alco's for a couple of hundred.  I am not sure why you would not want to run the Alco's you have.

 

If it has not warped in the last 60 years, it is probably not likely to warp now.  I have been under the impression that the cab warping of both the early F-3's and some of these early alco's was due to residual stresses in the shell as a result of the material thickness and the location of the injection port (A design fault that was corrected).  Maybe heat can speed that process up, I do not know.  I do know that I've had several sets of the early style Alco's and several non warped 2343 F-3 sets and none of them has warped on me, and I run the crap out of my old trains.  Point is, my admittedly limited experience with these leades me to suspect my initial statement, namely that if it hasen't warped yet, it is unlikely that it will warp in the future.  That said, I will happily accept correction by others with a more substantial history and usage of these old dogs.

 

I say, RUN EM!

It was just the Alco's that warped until they put a little plastic bubble on the top of the shell.

Here are my Vintage Alco's they are a little warped.

 

 

Are you looking to sell any of these cars? I have a set of WBB Alcos that would look nice pulling them...

Those cars are from  1994. When Lionel cataloged them, they also cataloged a matching "AA" Alco with a die cast frame(18119). Basically a replica of the 2023. While the pieces were only offered individually, the catalog referred to the pieces collectively as a reproduction of the 1950 anniversary set.

 

Lionel ran those Alcos again just a couple of years ago.

 

I run my postwar 2023 series alcos.

The 671 turbine and green passenger cars were my first train; Santa brought them at Christmas 1948 and I still have the set. Christmas 1950 was the UP Alco freight set. And I still have it, too. And I treasure those childhood memories of running those trains. I can still remember the thrill I had unwrapping those boxes.

Fred

Here is a visual of your problem:

 

http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showthread.php?t=5126

 

LDBennett

Chip, first off I would just run them with your PW 2023. If you want TMCC keep an eye out for some Williams repros and then add TMCC. That will be a whole lot cheaper than 1500 bucks. I had a PW 2023 and sold it when I found a Williams set so I could do just that. 

 

Pete

I feel that combo of the 671 turbine and green passenger cars is one of the most awesome looking!

That is a good idea Norton!

There is a mint 18119 set of Alco's on EBay right now for $269. If you are willing to wait, you probably could find them for less.

Thanks CW, but I think it has to have a flywheel in order to upgrade?

I do not believe Pullmor motors have that, only can motors, hence the need for Williams.

Those Alcos have a traditional pullmore motor, no flywheels. I wouldn't know whether they are suitable for any sort of upgrade.

There goes your wallet again, lol

The $1500 set you refer to is not o27 so you would be back where you started.

Thanks for letting me know, I went back and checked and sure enough.

That would have been an expensive mistake.

It was just the Alco's that warped until they put a little plastic bubble on the top of the shell. Here are my Vintage Alco's they are a little warped.

 

I can't speak for all of the PW die-cast Alcos, but my Erie PW Alcos (without plastic bubble) aren't warped.  Apparently, some but not all of them had this problem.