0-6-0 Docksider Q's?

Well, it is a pretty tiny little thing and chock full of stuff (motors, gears, mechanisms, electronics and such) inside, to the point there is just no room left.  I've taken a couple apart and don't see how you could get anything substantially more into it.  It's just full in there.   No room for an old style whistle mechanism or a new style electronic board whistle with a large speaker (fatboy, etc.)  at all.

Which model # do you have?

Some of us have replaced the the board with one from the Shakespeare 4-6-0 which will give you a typical British whistle. Won't help the volume much but is a more pleasant sound. Given your talent for reshaping engines you could also look at the sound boards used in todays conventional engines. They have been shrinking compared to what was offered say ten years ago and have very good sound qualities. I replaced the TBII sound board in a Williams Berkshire with one from the new CC Lionel 726. That board is larger than the one in the docksider but you may find a place to cram it in.

Pete

Pete,

I followed the posts in the other Docksider thread about replacing the board with the Shakespeare board. It had my interest piqued. I just went to the website and looked at the photos of both boards. The Docksider board has two two prong clips. The Shakespeare board has two clips (one appears to be a two clip and the other 4). What was involved in swapping at those boards? Thanks

Roger

I guess I'm the only person who actually likes the Docksider whistle.  It's sassy!  The one in mine is pretty loud.

Pete

Roger, Its been a while since I swapped mine but don't recall a problem with the connectors. I will have to look closer but the only change I made was to eliminate the plastic bracket for the board.

Pete

I converted one to TMCC, but I had no room for a sound board that would work with TMCC.

Mine is also loud, at least loud enough to still be heard when pulling a long train around my FasTrack loop on the floor at a good clip.  It's not my favorite whistle, but at least when I hear it, I know which steamer it is.  Yes, TMCC would be nice, but I'd rather it had a bell and chuffing sounds more than command.

Pete,

I appreciate your looking at your board for me. I'd like to make that swap. 

Roger

It is time for some miniaturization by Lionel. I just got an ad for an HO Trackmobile with DCC or DC. If HO has command why can't Lionel or am I mixing this all up?

The TMCC board in the trackmobile would fit in most HO engines. It is the same or similar to the ERR MiniCommander.

Pete

My O-gauge trackmobile has command.  I'd like it to have sound, but that's not happening.

Alright, back on topic a little... I took this little thing apart (because I wanted to) and found buried inside a 16 ohm 0.25 watt speaker with an F on it, about the size of a silver dollar. So to my electrically inclined friends, would it be correct to suggest that the less impedance the speaker has, the more volume it will have? or should I look at upping the wattage to say, .75 or 1?

thanx!

The wattage is how much it can handle, it will not effect volume.  Volume comes from the circuit driving the speaker.  And if you put a speaker with a different impedance than the driving circuit, you can blow it and get no sound.

For tons of information on speaker ohm and watt information and what changing them can do, look up aftermarket car audio amps and subs.

very good, thanks for the info!

To compare the volume output of speakers you need to know their efficiency. That is a measure of electrical power in to sound pressure out usually stated in decibels (db). As Sinclair states its not a good idea to use a speaker of lower impedance as it might damage the amplifier. As a rule speakers with larger cones and/or stronger magnets are more efficient. Probably not a lot of 16 ohm speakers to choose from that will fit in the space you have but thats what you will want to search on.

Pete 

That's why I wanted to know the model #. I believe it's a 1.5 inch dia. (38.1mm).

I couldn't find any in 16ohm. Slim pickin's. Mouser has a full range 8ohm. Check the depth of the hole it sits in or measure the speaker. This is a 36mm dia. x 4.3mm thickness.

Mouser speaker

Full range 450 to 20k, mylar cone, neodymium magnet. 85dba in stock 3.23 + shipping. Better than the one that's in it.

So, can you add a resistor to make it a 16ohm? Help electronics guys!

You can add a resistor, but now only half of the power is going to the speaker and the other half is being wasted to generate heat.  Not the best thing to do.

Some posts say the whistle is loud. Just a wild guess, but could it be your 0-6-0 is intended for use by "children", and is set up so as not to exceed federal sound level requirements.

     If that is the case then perhaps the sound board is capeable of driving an 8 ohm speaker. Maybe an Email to Lionel could check this out.

Bill 

Thanks, Sinclair. It was worth a try. Since there appears to be no readily available speaker upgrade, what about enclosing the back of the speaker? Can you put a cover over the hole where it sits down in the frame? Does the cab floor do that already?

What do you think, Steamwolf?

Mine runs and smokes great but when I hit the whistle button the enging pauses then resumes when I let go, but no sound. Its still a nice little engine

Steve

Gunrunner John - Was it a big deal to convert it to TMCC?

Mike D

I have the Reading which was the first one to come out and the Transylvania. Both are loud enough. There is no room in them. Mine shares the same sound board used in Percy and Thomas engines. Both are different in pitch just like Percy and Thomas.

Roger, It appears there are two different pictures on the Lionel site. The first one I checked I saw the board you saw with one 4 pin connector. Then checked my engine and found two 2 pin connectors compatible with the original Docksider setup.

Here is the alternate board and one I used:

Here it is installed along with the pic of the engine showing where some material has to be removed to accommodate the new board. Also in the pic is the sound board used in the new CC 726 Berkshire. It is about the same length and slightly wider than the Shakespeare board but would still take a lot of surgery on the engine to get it to fit. Very nice whistle but probably now worth the effort given the tiny speaker in that engine.

Pete

Pete,

Much appreciated checking that out for me. I searched using the part number you posted above and it came up. This will be my next project (sometime in the next two weeks). I'll be back here when it's done. Thanks!

Roger

Pete,

It's a little hard to visualize from that pic exactly what you had to remove to fit the board. Is that the back end of the engine?

Roger

Roger, its the bottom side of the coal load. Its held in place by two screws and is easier to modify if removed. Once you get the new board mounted it will be clear where clearances need to be increased.

Pete

Pete,

I'm assuming you Dremeled away parts of the inside of the cast iron shell. I don't have my 

DS opened, but I'm sure it will be apparent once I open it again. Thanks!

Roger

I installed the Shakespeare whistle board in one of mine. I chose that board because of the high pitch whistle. Little engines like that didn't have 'fancy' whistles, just little peepers and screech-ers. Only minor dremel grinding is needed for board clearance. From remembering the little 0-4-0T's I used to see at the sugar refineries in Loveland, Co. and the British sounding whistle is pretty close.

By using this sound board do you now get a bell too?

As for enclosing the back of the speakers, speakers generally sound better in an enclosure than in "free air."  The trick to make it work though is knowing what size enclosure to have.

Hello, my name is Brian, and I have a Docksider problem.

alternate caption:  "You do not know the power of the dockside!"

Question for Chuck or Pete (Norton): My Shakespeare board is set to arrive tomorrow. I just opened my Docksider and found that mine has a 2 pin clip and a 4 pin clip. The one coming has 2x 2pin. Can I use it? In the photo above, one of the clips goes to the switch, so that should be an easy swap. I'm assuming then that the two wires from my 4 pin clip have to go to the other 2 pin clip in the Shakespeare. Is that going to work?  Also, I'm going to have to find a two pin clip to put my two wires into.

Roger

Chuck and Pete,

I found a 2 pin clip in my electrical parts box that fits the 2 pin clip on my board. So....the question remains....even though mine has a 4 pin clip (with 2 empty slots) and another 2 pin.....will the new board work if I just connect my 2 pin clip from the switch and connect my other 2 wires to the new board as well (by removing them from the 4 pin clip and putting them into my 2 pin clip)?

Roger

Here's a photo of the original board in my Dockside:

There is already an enclousure on the back of the speaker which is used to hold the thing to the chassis, I've given up on it, I just won't toot the whistle lol.

Chuck and Pete,

The board arrived this afternoon and I just finished a four hour install. Bottom line, it works and I like the sound much better. A bit of a bear to put it in. I had some polarity problems.....transformer horn didn't work, bell button did. Reversed the wires in a 2 pin. Had quite a bit of trouble getting the shell back on. I couldn't figure out what was contacting the shell. I thought it was the vertical board, but it turned out to be the voltage regulator. Alot of Dremeling and eventually, the shell went on. Real snug, but on. Some wiring came loose as well and had to trace back where they broke off. As usual, the simple jobs take the longest. But.....it works and I'm pleased. 

Thanks for the advice on the board swap. Good idea

-Roger

Sorry, I missed this before.  It was a bit of a PITA to do the conversion, I had to hack away some internal supports to fit the TMCC board in.  I also wanted an electrocoupler, that that was even more work!  The non-standard mounting of the couplers makes this a Dremel Tool, Drill, and File problem.  Never again!

Glad to hear you figured it out. I does take a little work to install, but I think it sounds more realistic than the original sound.  Lionel should put the British whistle on the chip they use in the Dockside board. I had to reverse the polarity on mine also so the whistle button sounded the whistle.

Glad it worked out. When I took mine apart to take the pics above I had the same problem with the regulator but when I realized what was causing the interference it was just a matter of bending it slightly to miss the body. How much material that needs to removed from the underside of the coal pile depends on what you put under board, thick or thin foam tape or just a layer or electrical tape.

Pete