Be positive! Grow the hobby! Get others involved! :-)

I think folks can choose hobbies on their own.  I see no real advantage in proselytization.  For younger folks, better to channel efforts into education.

Opinion.

Nothing beats a layout to draw people's attention. It doesn't even have to be fancy. A simple circle of track in a store window will draw people in like a lightbulb does to mosquitos. 

I see this topic come up from time to time and I agree. There are issues with this though and while not popular I will mention them. 

There are a lot of things vying for the families time and dollars so while the train hobby might catch their interest it is not s priority. Clubs and personal outreach are important to do along with being friendly and helpful all of the time. I personally do all of this and more and it is hard work. The problem is there are far more critics than doers out there telling this like me to work harder and donate more. I admit to reaching my limit of this type of abuse more than once. I just have to remember to step back, take a breather, and then go at it again.

Finally, this really is a family hobby that can appeal to everyone. If the current hobbyists do not realize this then the hobby will have a smaller base due to all of the current societal influences we have now.

Not everyone can give everything but everyone can give a little.

John

Points well made.

Giving ease of access to the hobby will allow it to grow, it isn't the easiest thing to start on many fronts helping folks to get going is a big deal. 

Good luck

Tried to start a round robin group but so few people were interested it made no sense to continue. This is in the Philly area which is a hot bed for 3 rail trains. 

I think people have to get involved themselves and no amount of prodding from me or anybody else will do it.

None of my friends or family has any interest in trains, whether real or toy, and over the years (71) I have spontaneously met only one other person who shared my interest, so I think this is a very personal matter that is not actually influenced by clubs, groups, meetings, or proselytizing, which all essentially preach to the choir. 

I think public displays of layouts are key. Many "closet railroaders" will come out to watch.....it's how we've gone from 4 members in 2009 to the low 20s now.

Here are our 2 layouts at the annual Science Museum of Virginia Thnaksgiving weekend show. This past s spring and summer we've been working on 24 liner feet of new or revised modules to keep it fresh and interesting.

This show brings about 3-4000 people to the museum daily for 3 days.......their 3 biggest days of the year.

Peter

Great post and point we'll made.  Mention to anyone that you are a train modeler and they are circuit and love to see pictures, videos, and your running layout, and they always have a lot of ?'s.

Like anything, if you put a lot of effort into it and get the word out, you will get more  back.

A lot of people don't have a hobby but could sure enjoy one, we may be able to steer them into ours.

A start to a post with a good message. I don't know if it is possible to grow this hobby just yet, but it is possible to draw in new people to continue the hobby.  Most people are not interested in model trains but that is nothing new. We have never been a "most" hobby but a hobby for the few. The solution is outreach and that has been touched upon by Peter. If we do a good job of making people aware of the existence of this hobby some will come.  We also have to do a good job of showing people how much relaxation and fun it can be. This is why I preach that Carnivals, Bazaar's, Street fairs, Outdoor Markets , Malls are the best places to reach a new audience.  In short places where families go. If the mission is to promote the hobby, both the hobbyist and the TCA need to look seriously at a critical outreach mission. Preaching to the choir is not going to cut it.

......and, "you have to work the crowd" while you display. Here is Gilly@N&W and I answering questions.

Peter

Exactly Peter! 

Getting those who show interest to take one step closer to engaging. Many more might one day become hobbyists if they were given the chance to become involved with a club or group that was welcoming and didn't demand much on the front end. 

The All Gauge Toy Train Association gives away a complete ready to run train set two times a year (sometimes 3 times) to any child under 18.

We have gotten donations from club members and even Lionel.

About a month ago, I heard that a group of people are going to put a model railroad display in the Indiana Mall during the holidays. Weather permitting, I will stop in and take a look.

It's been my experience that you can never force anyone to become interested in anything...fishing, golf, pinball, video games, and model trains.  But I have found that if you expose them them to the hobby and show them what it offers, then some people will get interested and pursue the hobby...

John C.

I  could not agree with you more. I accidentally made a post to the wrong "forum" and was literally blasted with all sorts of negative comment that I will not go into including "can't you read or understand where your post those questions".

I decided not to respond to someone who thought he was mightier than god himself as it would not be worth effort. 

Thanks for taking the time post your concerns, suggestions and recommendations. Good for the hobby

PSU1980 posted:

John C.

I  could not agree with you more. I accidentally made a post to the wrong "forum" and was literally blasted with all sorts of negative comment that I will not go into including "can't you read or understand where your post those questions".

I decided not to respond to someone who thought he was mightier than god himself as it would not be worth effort. 

Thanks for taking the time post your concerns, suggestions and recommendations. Good for the hobby

Sorry that you experienced that.  I CRINGE when I see knuckleheads respond.  We all were new and inexperienced at one time.  We all make mistakes.  When I see unkind responses I just want to say to the person:  "So you are perfect and never have made a mistake in your life, huh?" 

At the TTOS Southern Pacific Division, we are doing a lot of public outreach to attract newcomers to the hobby and to our club. We participate in many public events throughout the year where we run our portable layouts. We emphasize lots of running trains over prototype operation - the kids love it. Our layouts are at table top level so they get a good view. Occasionally, we let them do the running with Lionchief controls. Of course, we hand out flyers at these shows but we also work to engage with the visitors -  it isn't enough to put out a stack of flyers and expect people to pick them up and respond. Finally, we are building an email list (around 500 names and growing) from those same visitors. One idea that has worked to really grow the list is a raffle - members have donated rolling stock and we collect names and email addresses from the entries.

I have yet to meet anyone who doesn't like trains. Our challenge is turning those train lovers into hobbyists and club members. We figure that if we can get them to our meets (we had about 100 visitors last month), and show them a good time we cab bring them into our hobby.

Glenn Olsen

There are many ways to get involved and I applaud those who are making it happen. 

My kiddos are little yet so it's hard to find time for the club scene currently. So my strategy is to pass out and gift my magazines and catalogs to kids that show interest in trains of any kind. If a kid sees our layout and enjoys it they go home with a catalog. If I hear that a kid got a train set for Christmas or a birthday my wife will drop off a few magazines and catalogs from our stash! Very simple, but effective. 

The Bay Area Garden Railway Society (BAGRS) has figured out how to grow their club and the garden railroad hobby in the SF Bay Area.  The club has many public shows and layout tours throughout the year plus an active social component.  The combination of social functions, gardening and model railroading seems to work well because it combines mutually supporting activities.  Families join BAGRS to see wonderful gardens, socialize and, oh yes, run trains.  

It also helps to have a mild climate in the SF Bay Area.  I just returned from the NMRA convention in Orlando.  There wasn't a single garden railroad on the layout tours.  It is no wonder.  Working in the garden in FL in August is equivalent to working in a steam bath with biting bugs.  Very few people would live in FL without air-conditioning.  (I saw many spectacular indoor layouts at the convention.)

I am at a loss at how to get people interested in the other aspects of the model railroading hobby.  Both I and my club have tried very hard by holding open houses, letting kids run trains, handing out catalogs and flyers, setting up trains at non-train events, etc.  Kids and their parents are excited to see trains operate but I have never known anyone to buy a train during or after a train show and get started in the hobby.   All the kids love Thomas but that fades as they grow older.

Parents look at train shows as a way to entertain their kids for a few hours not as way to get them involved in a hobby. Many parents have told me that they think model railroading is too expensive.  Another problem is the demise of the local hobby shop and retailers.   People will not buy trains unless they can see them and touch them.  There is not national advertising for model trains except in train publications.  

Many model railroaders are not good ambassadors for the hobby.  Beautiful layouts are built in hidden basements or garages that very few people outside the owner's family or friends get to see.  They don't put up trains around the Christmas tree nor do they mention that they are model railroaders to their friends.  I think that some model railroaders are not proud of their participation in the hobby.  Model railroaders need to get over an attitude that building a model railroad or collecting trains is somehow not an adult activity.

I believe that the only thing that can be done is to continue to make people aware of the model railroading hobby and its many facets.  Perhaps a few people will get started.

NH Joe

On the very rare instances when someone has expressed interest I show them my crappy garage layout and try to help, but I don't recruit.  I don't push any brand of trains, control system, track system, or level of detail.  I tell them to learn their own path and to ignore the din made by people with agendas.

Pete

My favorite thing to do is hand someone new my DCS remote or android phone. They usually resist and I assure them it's easy. Most of the time they'll finally try it and I just stay in the background for help if needed.

 To be honest, I'm always surprised at the interest of toy trains in young girls. They like the trains every bit as much as boys. They learn the remote in a few seconds good enough to handle the trains. I like to encourage anyone to try to run them. That seems to form a better bond and helps establish their decision to like toy trains better.

The High Plains 3 Railers will be doing our part outside at the Colorado Railroad Museum September 23-24 .

PSU1980 posted:

John C.

I  could not agree with you more. I accidentally made a post to the wrong "forum" and was literally blasted with all sorts of negative comment that I will not go into including "can't you read or understand where your post those questions".

I decided not to respond to someone who thought he was mightier than god himself as it would not be worth effort. 

Thanks for taking the time post your concerns, suggestions and recommendations. Good for the hobby

Welcome to the forum, my first post got so nasty I asked that the whole thread be deleted. Seems I should have known kids are not welcome at York, nor are cell phones, or cameras, at least that was the case when I made that first post 6 years ago. 

Now I just smile with the realization that many folks are cantankerous and this is their kingdom. There are plenty of other ways to spend time than dealing with strangers on the internet.

Welcome to the forum, my first post got so nasty I asked that the whole thread be deleted. 

Exactly the reason that its like playing with fire to suggest that people try to be "ambassadors" for the hobby. A lot of people are ill suited for the task.

Ever wonder why Lionel killed their ambassador program?

I have a feeling that the folks who would make good ambassadors are already doing things to expose the hobby to new people.

CincinnatiWestern posted:

PSU1980 posted:

John C.

I  could not agree with you more. I accidentally made a post to the wrong "forum" and was literally blasted with all sorts of negative comment that I will not go into including "can't you read or understand where your post those questions".

I decided not to respond to someone who thought he was mightier than god himself as it would not be worth effort. 

Thanks for taking the time post your concerns, suggestions and recommendations. Good for the hobby

Welcome to the forum, my first post got so nasty I asked that the whole thread be deleted. Seems I should have known kids are not welcome at York, nor are cell phones, or cameras, at least that was the case when I made that first post 6 years ago. 

Now I just smile with the realization that many folks are cantankerous and this is their kingdom. There are plenty of other ways to spend time than dealing with strangers on the internet.

But, in today's online world, new and/or young enthusiastic modelers come to places like this. And, being confronted by the miserable "experts" is a very negative experience for them. Some don't come back.

It's actually quite sad, and very bad for the hobby. 

On the other hand, many thanks to those folks that set up layouts at various places to expose folks to the hobby.

Trainfest in Milwaukee was mentioned in another thread. What a wonderful event that is. Much fun for everyone ... especially families. New model railroaders are born there. 

I bring non-shooters from work to the family-orientated gun range I belong to. Their faces light up when they first plink a little metal target with a .22, and when they break a clay target with a shotgun. Their faces also light up when I hand them the throttle for the first time to run a locomotive on my little layout in the basement. 

Exposing new folks to a hobby is key. (And keeping them away from the curmudgeons. lol)

But, in today's online world, new and/or young enthusiastic modelers come to places like this. And, being confronted by the miserable "experts" is a very negative experience for them. Some don't come back.

Something we should all keep in mind before hitting that transmit button.

As a perfect example, until yesterday I was a member of a modular train club for about 4 years.  I haven't been very active lately due to having two young kids ( 3 total), moving and taking a job that doesn't allow for time off during the week like my old over the road job did.

So I drive an hour to get to a dinner/club meeting.  I take my wife and the two small children.  The kids are pretty good through the whole thing.  (Nobody's kids are perfect, including mine)  The meeting/dining room has terrible acoustics, and tables are set up in a u shape with seats inside and out.  Nobody complains about the kids, no rules about about kids at meetings.  The only communication I get from the club in the last month is about an event I can't attend due to a family commitment.  

Over the weekend the next meeting reminder comes out.  All standard fare until the end of the email.  Then a new paragraph shows up that says"unfortunately we cannot accommodate kids at our meeting.  It turns out to be distracting for members when trying to discuss meeting items.  I ask that you please refrain from bringing family or children to our meetings."  My kids were the only ones there.  No personal communication ahead of this email or after.  I know my kids were pretty good at the meeting and didn't interfere with anything.  If they had I would have taken them outside for a few minutes to call them down.  There was no prior discussion, it just came out as an edict to all members.  I can understand wanting adults only meetings, but my family has been directly singled out and the club president cannot understand why I am insulted and looking for and apology for the way it was handled.  In fact he went so far as to say that no apology is owed.  

I can put up with alot of things in life, but saying my kids are a problem and don't bring them back, and not understanding how I might think you owe me an apology for that is way too much. Now I have to explain to my 11 yr old that we aren't going back.  

Sorry this is more of a frustration venting than a something constructive for this thread, but perhaps it can be used an example of how not to treat people.  I know not everyone can deal with kids, but this could not have been handled more poorly.  After all one of this club's public displays was how I got involved in the first place!

JHZ563:

That's a very sad story; no problem on venting.

I can't imagine saying the words, "We're going to be playing with trains so please leave your kids at home."  That sort of policy will repel both younger members (i.e., parents) and the youngest members (i.e., the kids who will never be introduced).

I'm appalled at your story and I'm sorry it happened.  It sounds like that's not a club worth belonging to.  Perhaps you can spend some time building a layout with your kids and/or looking around for a different modular club?

I hope we all see you and your children at York.

Steven J. Serenska

Serenska posted:

JHZ563:

That's a very sad story; no problem on venting.

I can't imagine saying the words, "We're going to be playing with trains so please leave your kids at home."  That sort of policy will repel both younger members (i.e., parents) and the youngest members (i.e., the kids who will never be introduced).

I'm appalled at your story and I'm sorry it happened.  It sounds like that's not a club worth belonging to.  Perhaps you can spend some time building a layout with your kids and/or looking around for a different modular club?

I hope we all see you and your children at York.

Steven J. Serenska

Thank you very much.  

Unfortunately, this hobby seems to have a few bad apples. Some are the worst examples of spoiled children that grow up to be spoiled adults.

Others are just plain grumpy old crabs. It took their whole lives to get where they are. Nowhere.

 But.... and Fortunately, they are not the only ones who can enjoy toy trains! So let the trains run and have fun. If someone points out that "those little lights aren't twinkling Clark", just walk away. Thanking them, seems to go to their head that their behavior is correct and proper.

 Now I'm not talking about the ones who know what they're doing and offer info and history. I'm describing the ones who behind the scenes send out a letter stating "leave your kids at home". How in the heck will the hobby ever move forward? When I see a child get a special smile from seeing the trains, I know there is still hope.

I do agree with getting support, and help. For example I am still fairly new to the hobby, though I have liked trains as long as I can remember, I did have an HO loop I ran years ago, and I do still have that engine, though I may end up selling it, or giving it to my son, though he likes my polar express set, easier for him to control. I haven't really experienced much negativity with help on my layout. Though most of the people that I show my layout to are close to my age, and a friends of the family. Not many kids around the area that seem to like trains. For Example, with the 765 came through my town a couple of years ago, most of the people that went out to see it, were of the older variety, at least the ones I saw.

I took a group of college seniors to a local radio control airfield at a state park to test their instrumented 2 lb model radio control airplane for a college class.  We came early at 8am to avoid other hobbyist and were alone.  After completing the tests, a high ranking club member arrived, and basically "read us the riot act" for using their field that they rent/use from the state.  It absolutely made all of the students want to avoid the hobby in the future.  Yes, he was an old fart...yes, we could have coordinated better, and yes he wasn't interested in expanding the hobby to younger folks...and yes it worked!!!

I feel like that was John's point along the thread, we all should be mindful that we are play a role in the future of this hobby. We can be welcoming, warm, fun to hang around with, and bring those with an interest along. 

Being open with your layout and being part of modular clubs helps grow the hobby. Here, we have clubs like the Chicagoland Lionel Railroad Club and the North Central O Gaugers that do a great job of presenting the hobby through public displays and open houses. I am amazed at the number of clubs that do great displays at venues like Trainfest year after year. 

The downside is the fact that occasionally you run across snobs, know-it-alls and "club politicians" that contravene the goal of growth of the hobby. However, we are dealing with human beings here, not angels and saints, so the best thing to do is to avoid the "Debbie Downers", if you can. Life is too short to put up with these people.

I took a group of college seniors to a local radio control airfield at a state park to test their instrumented 2 lb model radio control airplane for a college class.  We came early at 8am to avoid other hobbyist and were alone.  After completing the tests, a high ranking club member arrived, and basically "read us the riot act" for using their field that they rent/use from the state.  It absolutely made all of the students want to avoid the hobby in the future.  Yes, he was an old fart...yes, we could have coordinated better, and yes he wasn't interested in expanding the hobby to younger folks...and yes it worked!!!

I am confused. Was the field posted that it was for private (members only) use?
 
I belonged to a local model aviation club when my son was into model airplanes.
We rented a field on some vacant farmland.
There were lots of rules, most of which were related to safety. 
In order to maintain insurance, any person who entered the pit area had to be a member of the AMA. It didn't matter whether that individual was going to fly a plane or not, because there were plenty of ways to be injured by just being there.

jhz563 posted:

As a perfect example, until yesterday I was a member of a modular train club for about 4 years.  I haven't been very active lately due to having two young kids ( 3 total), moving and taking a job that doesn't allow for time off during the week like my old over the road job did.

So I drive an hour to get to a dinner/club meeting.  I take my wife and the two small children.  The kids are pretty good through the whole thing.  (Nobody's kids are perfect, including mine)  The meeting/dining room has terrible acoustics, and tables are set up in a u shape with seats inside and out.  Nobody complains about the kids, no rules about about kids at meetings.  The only communication I get from the club in the last month is about an event I can't attend due to a family commitment.  

Over the weekend the next meeting reminder comes out.  All standard fare until the end of the email.  Then a new paragraph shows up that says"unfortunately we cannot accommodate kids at our meeting.  It turns out to be distracting for members when trying to discuss meeting items.  I ask that you please refrain from bringing family or children to our meetings."  My kids were the only ones there.  No personal communication ahead of this email or after.  I know my kids were pretty good at the meeting and didn't interfere with anything.  If they had I would have taken them outside for a few minutes to call them down.  There was no prior discussion, it just came out as an edict to all members.  I can understand wanting adults only meetings, but my family has been directly singled out and the club president cannot understand why I am insulted and looking for and apology for the way it was handled.  In fact he went so far as to say that no apology is owed.  

I can put up with alot of things in life, but saying my kids are a problem and don't bring them back, and not understanding how I might think you owe me an apology for that is way too much. Now I have to explain to my 11 yr old that we aren't going back.  

Sorry this is more of a frustration venting than a something constructive for this thread, but perhaps it can be used an example of how not to treat people.  I know not everyone can deal with kids, but this could not have been handled more poorly.  After all one of this club's public displays was how I got involved in the first place!

I'm a dad with a 7-year old daughter who loves trains. Like you, I was driven away by rude, hostile or outright disgusting behavior toward my child. Because of these experiences, I am no longer a TCA member. I'm sure you will find other more constructive ways to enjoy the hobby outside of a club, just as I did.

GregR posted:

jhz563 posted:

 

I can put up with alot of things in life, but saying my kids are a problem and don't bring them back, and not understanding how I might think you owe me an apology for that is way too much. Now I have to explain to my 11 yr old that we aren't going back.  

Sorry this is more of a frustration venting than a something constructive for this thread, but perhaps it can be used an example of how not to treat people.  I know not everyone can deal with kids, but this could not have been handled more poorly.  After all one of this club's public displays was how I got involved in the first place!

I'm a dad with a 7-year old daughter who loves trains. Like you, I was driven away by rude, hostile or outright disgusting behavior toward my child. Because of these experiences, I am no longer a TCA member. I'm sure you will find other more constructive ways to enjoy the hobby outside of a club, just as I did.

It is so sad that these events happen.  On the bright side, there are many more of us who welcome kids to see and operate trains as long as they behave.  Unfortunately, a bad experience is usually the last experience.  

This is a kid friendly group at the Orlando National Train show:

Here is a portion of their layout:

This friendly fellow was also at the show:

"I am confused. Was the field posted that it was for private (members only) use?
 
I belonged to a local model aviation club when my son was into model airplanes.
We rented a field on some vacant farmland.
There were lots of rules, most of which were related to safety. 
In order to maintain insurance, any person who entered the pit area had to be a member of the AMA. It didn't matter whether that individual was going to fly a plane or not, because there were plenty of ways to be injured by just being there."

There was no posting of "private use only"...The field was on state owned landed, managed by the club...and yes you should be a club member ($80 annual club dues and pay AMA dues $80) to fly there.  We previously flew at a public school field nearby and I thought it was too risky, so we headed to this field because it was much safer and isolated(one student said his dad was a member previously...so was I).  We went early so no one was there, and it was a much smaller plane (2 ft wingspan and two lbs wt) than anyone uses.  Yes I am very experienced at Radio control flying.   The students didn't want to spend the money ($160) to buy the membership for one flight  and they were running out of time.  The risk of damage/injury was very low.  So in the interest of helping the students complete their project, we used the field.  My point is that the club could have applauded the students for doing high tech aircraft engineering with a tiny 2ft wingspan airplane...or scold the students for following not the rules to the letter and spending $160 for an hour of flight...the students were elated that the airplane flew and its performance was live streamed to a laptop.  The club chose to chastise the students which left the students thinking that they didn't want anything to do with this club again...

No way am I sharing this hobby!!  The more people involved, the less trains there are to buy!!  So stay away and go do something else.  They're mine.  Mine I tell you!  Mine, mine, mine!!!