Built Up Vintage Kits - Rolling Stock

I just managed to buy this lot of 11 old kit built cars.  I think maybe 1 or 2 Lobaugh or Faber cars, the IC reefer is and I think the 50 foot PFE may also be.  We will see when they  show up.  Also looks to include a couple of Athearn or All Nation boxcars  and I am not sure on the two PRR auto cars, might be Walthers or Wetsbrook or Hawk lol.  The hopper should be either another Scalecraft or Scale Models cast aluminum car.  The price of the lot made them about nine bucks each.  I could not resist..  Some of these cars are in too good a condition for me, I usually buy junk lol.

@Dennis Holler posted:

I just managed to buy this lot of 11 old kit built cars.  I think maybe 1 or 2 Lobaugh or Faber cars, the IC reefer is and I think the 50 foot PFE may also be.  We will see when they  show up.  Also looks to include a couple of Athearn or All Nation boxcars  and I am not sure on the two PRR auto cars, might be Walthers or Wetsbrook or Hawk lol.  The hopper should be either another Scalecraft or Scale Models cast aluminum car.  The price of the lot made them about nine bucks each.  I could not resist..  Some of these cars are in too good a condition for me, I usually buy junk lol.

I have been buying them the  same way with plans on restoring them

Dave, that’s generally how I try and buy them as well… till I crack and fall to temptation lmao.  It’s been a while since I have happened on a gooddeal like this. 5-10 years ago I was ableto pick up lots like this for $4-5 a car. I guess those days are gone lol.

or few and far between

@Dennis Holler posted:

I just managed to buy this lot of 11 old kit built cars.

I used to buy lots like this until I found myself inundated with a mountainous project work queue that took years to did out from under and sort into restore to keep, restore to sell, and salvage for parts and trash the rest. While that might have been fun, okay, some were a lot of fun, it also took a lot of time away from everything else that I wanted to be working on in my shop.  Resistance is not futile...

Here's one not often seen that I've just recently finished doing a rebuild of; Wabash Valley kit:

Nice, unusual, well done.

I finished another one of the All Nation hybrids. This one has plastic sides, a new doors and added details. I still have to weather it. I modeled it from a photo in my GN rolling stock book  by Four Ways West.

Wow Malcomb , That is fantastic !  Do yo have any pics of that during construction ?  just to see all the added details --I see you have the bracing exposed on the bottom just like the real thing.  I have a couple of these wood side AN kits and have been holding off because I felt the scribing looked bad .  Are those Chooch ladders & grabs ? they sure look good ! 

@mwb posted:

I used to buy lots like this until I found myself inundated with a mountainous project work queue that took years to did out from under and sort into restore to keep, restore to sell, and salvage for parts and trash the rest. While that might have been fun, okay, some were a lot of fun, it also took a lot of time away from everything else that I wanted to be working on in my shop.  Resistance is not futile...

I have reached the same point , but always looking for parts

Here’s another salvage job of an old kit build; this one’s a mystery to me; a 50' single door PS1-style boxcar built from a 1950's era kit that used pressed paper cemented to single laminate wood sheet sides and wood roof stock, somewhat similar to a JC Models kit in that the pressed paper has embossed rivets. The sides were not factory printed or silk screened etc. either but rather decaled.

One of my colleagues suggested it might be a Graceline, but then couldn't find it listed in any of his Graceline catalogs. Part of an old estate lot and not in very good condition as the sides had warped up /bubbled away from the laminate sheet and wood sub roof due to poor cementing and exposure to high humidity in long-term storage, the sub roof had bowed up as well.

The ends are very nice thin white metal castings attached to end blocks with screws and the underbody has a nicely fabricated "Athearnish”-like under frame stamped metal assembly along with the usual minimal cast brake hardware.

Roof paper suffered from poor cementing and sealing as well and has lifted or "Lipped Up" in numerous places. I almost scrapped this for parts but it's my impression 50' single door steel XM's are somewhat rare in 1:48 prior to the Atlas's PRC version of the last 20 years. I think one or more examples in the KTM/USH or Precision brass vein came through back in the sixties-seventies, a USH plastic kit comes to mind now too but you don't see them that often either. Anyone here recognize the manufacturer of the source kit for this mess? Dennis, Carey….?

Here's the “after” shots. I removed the sides and re-cemented them under approx. 20 lbs of weights to flatten them out, unfortunately it only partially worked, better looking than before but not completely flat either. I carefully removed the paper roof cover from the bowed sub roof and replaced it with a straight piece.

Soldiered up some details for the stamped brass doors. Re-assembled, painted with Tru-Color Box Car Red, decaled with this K4 Supply NdM 50' XM set. Still not a great model but certainly an improvement and opinion worth the effort if for nothing else the learning experience.       

Great salvage job and you've got a good looking car with an interesting history.

@Dennis Holler posted: ...snip...

I have one of those Roberval & Sagueney(sp) cars, I got it as it is an unusual roadname.

@mwb posted:

Here's one not often seen that I've just recently finished doing a rebuild of; Wabash Valley kit:

That reminds me of the Livesay Poultry Car that I have.

This is a brass KWR 3 dome tank car. It's marked on the bottom "Made in Occupied Japan", which dates it during or prior to 1952. It's a solidly assembled (though not absolutely straight) car with minimal detail. I added some additional frame cross members, platforms for brake gear, the brake gear, steps, grab rails, placards, and dump valves. The brass to brass soldering went OK, but I was unsuccessful in soldering anything to the cast metal end frames. Those didn't like drilling either; I broke multiple bits and dulled others. I finally gave up.

The prototype is a Union Tank Line car. I discovered Clover House made dry transfers for it - even matching the car number with the number on the original box. Two months ago a set was ordered. Despite every attempt I was unable to transfer a single letter to the car. Clover House's instructions have you heat the transfer next to a light bulb to soften the adhesive then apply to the car.  In ever increasing amounts of time next to the bulb and ever increasing heat, the letters would just not let go. I did get to the point of making a section I was trying to transfer look like a slice of fried bacon; then it transferred though with completely distorted letters. I have never had any luck making old dry transfers work. These Clover House transfers may be old - or maybe not. It's probably my fault.

So, the car is lettered with K4 decals as a Cosden car. The trucks are some unknown vintage spring plank Bettendorftrucks. The paint is Scalecoat, with Dullcote over.

Jim

Nice car! Great upgrade of the original too, despite your disappointment with the dry transfer attempt tI have to say those K4's look pretty good. Well done.

This C&NW 50'single door box car was built in 1984 from a Grace Line kit having its parts still wrapped in 1946 newspaper. While it was a double-door kit, it could easily be finished as a single door car.  The plastic surface laminated paper sheathing was named "Comprestic" in the instruction sheet.  Although the car end sheets have rather shallow detail, the rivet detail is actually true to scale.  They are not that easy to but most models have oversized rivet detail so it can be more easily seen.

The underbody is built with stamped metal parts similar to Athearn at the time. In this photo it is on Walthers trucks. But a pair of Athearn sprung trucks still await it. This model also has detailed brake rigging and piping under it.  I found that doing this helps slow down an accumulation of kit-built models!

I also have Grace Line 50' horizontal rib box car kit to do. Someday.  The car sides have express refrigerator doors on them which can be replaced with a set of box car doors in the kit. This enables finishing that kit for any of the 50' horizontal rib Milwaukee Road cars.   

S. Islander

Whoever thought of using printed (mostly) paper sides embossed with rivets was certainly innovative. The printing allowed for properly colored and often intricate designs. Backing the printed paper with cardboard or wood provided stiffness. Humidity was a sometimes problem though. I had a Pentrate boxcar with paper sides that had bulged and warped beyond salvage. So, it's nice to see excellent examples of these cars posted here.

I second that, I love seeing these old kits getting a good second life and lord knows Ed's a master at this.

Ed, your Graceline here has the same material "Comprestic" car ends as well as the sides and the roof?

@jjscott posted:

Whoever thought of using printed (mostly) paper sides embossed with rivets was certainly innovative.

I believe the famous O scale passenger car builder, Joe Fischer, in the 1940's, plus or minus, used this embossed/laminated paper/cardstock technique also.  I have never seen one of Joe's cars except in photos.  The detail, finesse, exterior and interior, is astounding.  Today we survivors are slack-jawed at skills like Joe Fischer had and of his incredible prolific output.  No 3D printing, no costly machines and equipment, no kits prepared for the masses as a starting point.  Lost talent and skills, indeed.  And, truly the patience of Job...IMHO.

KD

@atlpete posted:

I second that, I love seeing these old kits getting a good second life and lord knows Ed's a master at this.

Ed, your Graceline here has the same material "Comprestic" car ends as well as the sides and the roof?

Yes, even the car doors are Comprestic.  However, in place of the Comprestic running board and corner platforms, I made them with Northeastern strip wood.

Another kit maker that used printed and formed cardstock sides, roof and ends was Westbrook of the 1940's and Bob Peare following with that kit line in the 1950's.  Some car sides were printed from photos of a prototype car. Today's clear spray on coatings are a huge help in giving such sides a long life.

Below is a Westbrook car I built from a kit that had its wood body parts missing. I found a wooden Picard body (another old-time kit maker) that would fit. The two sides are slightly different in the shading of their colors due to being wrapped for 60 years or so in paper that was not acid free. I used artist paints for touching up the car side colors.  No worries. You can only see one side at a time.  The trucks from that kit were made by Varney before WW II.

Gerber owned four such cars for delivering its new baby food nation-wide, packed in little glass jars. They were insulated/ventilated box cars and did not have ice compartments. The hatches were for ventilation in hot weather.  Whether any were actual painted this way or not, I cannot say. Gerber sent its four insulated / ventilated box cars into pool service for the War effort in 1942.

S. Islander

@jjscott posted:

This is a brass KWR 3 dome tank car. It's marked on the bottom "Made in Occupied Japan", which dates it during or prior to 1952. It's a solidly assembled (though not absolutely straight) car with minimal detail. I added some additional frame cross members, platforms for brake gear, the brake gear, steps, grab rails, placards, and dump valves. The brass to brass soldering went OK, but I was unsuccessful in soldering anything to the cast metal end frames. Those didn't like drilling either; I broke multiple bits and dulled others. I finally gave up.

The prototype is a Union Tank Line car. I discovered Clover House made dry transfers for it - even matching the car number with the number on the original box. Two months ago a set was ordered. Despite every attempt I was unable to transfer a single letter to the car. Clover House's instructions have you heat the transfer next to a light bulb to soften the adhesive then apply to the car.  In ever increasing amounts of time next to the bulb and ever increasing heat, the letters would just not let go. I did get to the point of making a section I was trying to transfer look like a slice of fried bacon; then it transferred though with completely distorted letters. I have never had any luck making old dry transfers work. These Clover House transfers may be old - or maybe not. It's probably my fault.

So, the car is lettered with K4 decals as a Cosden car. The trucks are some unknown vintage spring plank Bettendorftrucks. The paint is Scalecoat, with Dullcote over.

Jim

Nice job with that car.  I believe it to be an International Model Products manufacture.  The firm did several steam locomotives and freight cars in the years just following WWII. 

@dkdkrd posted:

I believe the famous O scale passenger car builder, Joe Fischer, in the 1940's, plus or minus, used this embossed/laminated paper/cardstock technique also.  I have never seen one of Joe's cars except in photos.  The detail, finesse, exterior and interior, is astounding.  Today we survivors are slack-jawed at skills like Joe Fischer had and of his incredible prolific output.  No 3D printing, no costly machines and equipment, no kits prepared for the masses as a starting point.  Lost talent and skills, indeed.  And, truly the patience of Job...IMHO.

KD

1949 MR ran a 3 part series from Joe that detailed exactly how he made pass cars.

@Bill Chaplik posted:

  I believe it to be an International Model Products manufacture.

No; KWR was another importer from long ago that provided some tank cars that were far better than the IMP ones. Every so often you see one for sale.

MWB is correct; it is a KWR car. I do have the original box but can't post a picture as I am out of town for several days. One was listed on ebay just recently - complete with box and unmounted K brake gear and some other bits. My box contained the car only. A search should still show the listing. If I remember, it did not sell. Interestingly, the Clover House dry transfers were for a car with AB brakes.

KWR brass cars, I never heard of them before.

No one has posted here in a while now.  I hope everyone is well and working on a vintage kit to post here soon. I really enjoy this thread.

I finished 3 All Nation OB box car kits.  Two of these I repainted and assembled the B&M car as it came.  I added several details and reversed the diagonal braces on the two i painted.  I even used the KTM trucks and MDC couplers that came with the kits.  I recently purchased several kits for trainz and they were like new with trucks, couplers and some had metal roof walks.

I have been holding on to a photo of the C&EI car for a long time wanting to build it.  The AN kit is a pretty close match to the prototype.

@mwb posted:

1949 MR ran a 3 part series from Joe that detailed exactly how he made pass cars.

Martin...

Since I'm going to have to scrounge for this series, would you happen to know the specific months of 1949?

(Good grief!...I was 4 going on 5 in 1949!  Talk about "yore"!)

KD

@dkdkrd posted:

Martin...

Since I'm going to have to scrounge for this series, would you happen to know the specific months of 1949?

Buried on my computer............somewhere, but I'll be doing a full backup and reconciliation with all the externals shortly, so I'll look for it.  I do remember thinking that 1949 was a banner year for O scale when I was looking through those issues.  The Thomas 1, 3, and 6 dome tank cars were introduced and reviewed in MR that year.

That would be September and October 1949 for sure.

Hey Malcomb , those SS boxes look great,  particularly the S&EI  --funny how they put the diags in tension rather than compression ,,I mean it makes sense like a pin connected bridge . I think maybe until after WW1 , the properties of steel were not fully understood .

@oscaletrains posted:

That would be September and October 1949 for sure.

Yes - The Fischer articles are in the September and October issues of 1949.

Rail Craft hopper #1 before & after:

Martin...

1) Thanks to you and OScaleTrains for identifying the 1949 Fischer series MR issues!  The search begins.  (My wife thinks I may have those issues in the basement...in some dark cranny.  Won't that be a hoot...and indictment of human aging if she's right?

2) Your redo of the hopper is awesome.  Question: Do you do plastic surgery on the side?  (NOT Hollywood-style, though!)  You know, as in the reverse of...

???

...With sincere apologies to Art Fahey (Bar Mills) for usurping/reversing his depiction of my situation!

KD

@dkdkrd posted:

Martin...

1) Thanks to you and OScaleTrains for identifying the 1949 Fischer series MR issues!

I may have those scanned in and have them stored,

2) Your redo of the hopper is awesome.  Question: Do you do plastic surgery on the side?  (NOT Hollywood-style, though!)  You know, as in the reverse of...

Thanks!  Despite being a somewhat gifted amateur surgeon , no, no plastic surgery...

Just a torch and a Dremel, some brass, some other bits & bobs here & there, a can of paint, decals, and the usual foam and coal DIY load, etm...

fantastic hopper reresection !

@mwb posted:

Despite being a somewhat gifted amateur surgeon...

Wow!...You stay at Holiday Inn Express, too, when you travel!?!?!?

Received your scans of the Fischer article.  Many thanks, Martin!

"Meanwhile, back at the ranch"...that dark cranny in the basement was located.  There in all its moldy bouquet was a stack of HARD BOUND old MR's from the 40's-early 50's...the remnants of a collection we acquired from a rather eccentric tool maker.  Forgot all about those.  Right on top was the 1949 book!  (Need to check those dark crannies more often.)

Loved leafing through all 12 issues in that book.  Also in the October issue was the start of an article by Mel Thornburgh on how to hand build an HO model of a Pennsylvania K-4 loco.  Talk about a different generation of hobby skills and techniques!  Figure 8 in that article...

...reminded me of what pre-RTR was once all about.  HO locomotive pilot marker posts...in HO...3/32" rod chucked in a hand drill, turned with one hand while the other hand was holding a 'file' to 'shape' the part....in HO.  HOly-moly!  Not this Mr. Magoo!

Then there's the commitment to write it all up with sketches, art work, photos, et alia, for publication!

Think I'll go make some Humble Pie for din-din.

KD

The 2nd Rail Craft hopper...before:

and after:

I don't know if this will be of any interest, but here's an All Nation 46' fishbelly flat.  I got the kit partially completed, and finished and painted/lettered it.  It's of cast metal (feels too heavy to be aluminum), and a real door stop - heavier than a die-cast hopper.  Good thing the trucks are very free-rolling!  Please pardon my third rail...

And one more hopper car....

Before:

and after: