can we talk about the tinplate-esque BiPolar?

Someone used to sell a steel 3rail knuckle to latch coupler adapter. Would that work?

I actually like this set a lot and I might be in the market for both the set and the add on passenger car set.  Since delivery will probably be around Christmas or so, it'll give me time to save up for it.  I do have quite a few reservations that I won't mention here, so i guess I'm still on the fence for right now.

I love it.  Probably my favorite thing in the catalog.  It seems like one that will age well, like it'll be an heirloom.  I can envision it on a large circle under a Christmas tree, but would also give just a tad of whimsy to a hirail layout while still being scale proportioned  But I doubt I will order one because it is an expensive investment.

I would need to win the lotto. If I had the money, I would snap it up.

jhz563 posted:

It looks okay, although conspicuously missing cab doors, and is a whole lot of money for a whole lot of loco.

 

But if you are going to make a replica era engine available, why not at east include conversion kits for the couplers so you could run box coupler car behind it?  I am not in the market for this money - wish I was but oh well - but for those that are what are your impressions?

I took looks like the prototype for this exact model didn't have doors on the sides and the doors are out of view in the catalog pics.  Doors only on the fireman's side and forward facing? 

I dunno.  It seems to lack the "magic" of the S2 freight set of 2017.

Rusty

Rusty Traque posted:

I dunno.  It seems to lack the "magic" of the S2 freight set of 2017.

Rusty

It could be that the S2 set was laid out differently in the 2017 catalog.  There seems to be a little more action going on.

Plus the S2 set is smaller and can fit larger images on the page throughout the spread.

The state set is a much larger set.  Plus you see one 18" heavyweight passenger coach, you've seen them all.  There's a lot of them in this catalog.

Both are very nice set and would go together nicely, especially if you like to collect train sets.

BobbyD posted:

Someone used to sell a steel 3rail knuckle to latch coupler adapter. Would that work?

I have some, there not that great.  

It is a pretty set, being a die cast engine  I would snatch one if I could afford it 

Is this in the new Lionel catalog?

Steve

yeah it is

Steamer posted:

yeah it is

Just looked at it. Tinplatesqe like my S2 set for twice the price. 

Steve

What does this have to do with Tinplate ?  It's a die cast engine and won't come close to fitting on any kind of classic toy train layout.  

Many of us run tin and non tin on our layouts. The S2 set and this are somewhere in between and would fit in. The price is a bit of a turn off more than the material. I can get a full blown STD Gauge set for a few dollars more.

Steve

"esque" - anything does not make it for me.  Seems to me that Lionel has to come to grips w/ the expiration of the MTH tinplate deal, and they haven't, yet.

mlaughlinnyc posted:

What does this have to do with Tinplate ?  It's a die cast engine and won't come close to fitting on any kind of classic toy train layout.  

 

Lionel, Flyer, IVES, and Marx (and Boucher?) all used die-cast or cast engines with tinplate rolling stock.

Are these tinplate or plastic cars?

Regards

Fred

sncf231e posted:

Are these tinplate or plastic cars?

Regards

Fred

The cars are plastic with a tinplate finish to make them appear slightly shiny.

There is precedent in 'tinplate' for a die cast electric profile loco (e.g., Dorfan), but a set with plastic cars seriously lacks both the feel and a healthy respect of the history of what tinplate was and is. For a very clear counter example, the LCT Super 381 coupled with state cars is a far, far more valid entry to accomplish a similar result. And, the Lionel Corp. did actually build a one off Super 381. Modern Era trains painted bright green are just that ... Modern Era trains painted bright green. Folks can buy, run, and enjoy what they wish. Have fun!

But, sorry, calling something "tinplate inspired" does not make it tinplate, as the term is usually understood on this board and in the broader hobby in general.

Bob

I like it and have the s2 set,,,which I would of liked to had 15" cars to go with it or more freight cars,i'm sorta on the fence I do like it but not the 18" cars they are a tad to long,,but but I may cave 

For what it's worth, Lionel is calling this set tinplate inspired as they did with the S2 Freight Set from 2017.  They never said it was real tinplate.

jhz563 posted:

It looks okay, although conspicuously missing cab doors, and is a whole lot of money for a whole lot of loco.

 

But if you are going to make a replica era engine available, why not at east include conversion kits for the couplers so you could run box coupler car behind it?  I am not in the market for this money - wish I was but oh well - but for those that are what are your impressions?

I myself am not a scale nor a standard gauge collector. However, I feel as though Lionel is going in a very good direction with the Prewar Scale items. Those who grew up with the originals will now have the chance to own the most realistic, improved, and nostalgic version of the very same tinplate engine they once dreamed of owning (or if they were very lucky, owned). Its a nice addition to the freight set, and if Lionel keeps going this way I wouldn't be surprised to see a Prewar-inspired steam engine in a future catalog.

And now that Im thinking of it, don't forget about the Scale 746 that Lionel is making this year!

Phoebe Snow Route posted:

sncf231e posted:

Are these tinplate or plastic cars?

Regards

Fred

The cars are plastic with a tinplate finish to make them appear slightly shiny.

It looks like they will get brass plates similar to what they did with the S2 set.

Steve

I think besides the paint, the fact that the engine is metal, diecast vs formed sheet steel doesn’t necessarily matter to me, is something I really like.  Like the S2 set, I get some heartburn over plastic cars with an engine like this although I know its listed as tinplate “inspired “.  

By the way, was there ever previously a 281e moniker?

Another FAUX tinplate model which is something of a "wanna be", but will undoubtedly have its following. The price might be a deterrent to some. 

Tinplate Art posted:

Another FAUX tinplate model which is something of "wanna be", but will undoubtedly have its following. The price might be a deterrent to some.1

The price is no more a deterrent than the Pennsylvania passenger set that just hit dealer shelves from last years catalog or the NYC Pacemaker set from this catalog.  

In my opinion, I hope that Lionel continues to offer tinplate inspired sets in future catalogs.

I think perhaps there is a subtle point some are missing on this.  It is not tinplate.  Its supposed to be a scale model of a train that the classic tinplate trains were modeled after, but including the tinplate paint scheme and brass plates, etc.  To me, that is a really neat idea, I get it. 

Diecast and molded plastic are able to produce much more fine detail.  If it had tinplate cars, that would be a strange mishmash, imo, and such cars would go against the whole point. 

Its like the full 1:1 size Thomas engines you see around.  Its sort of like backward modeling, take a toy and make a prototype, or scale model thereof. 

If you are looking for a tinplate train, this is not it.   It really is something different.  Kudos to Lionel for this idea.  Will it sell though, IDK.  

I am a longtime fan of the original Lionel state cars and the equally fine Lionel Classics, MTH Tinplate Traditions, and the more recent LCT reproductions of the same. I have owned several of these fine repro sets over the last several decades, and never missed an opportunity to open the hinged roofs of these cars to show off the interior detailing to guests, particularly the movable commode seats! I am fortunate to still have three of the MTH Tinplate Traditions cars in service, including the inspired Maryland "solarium" car, with its awesome interior! I also owned, for a short period, the LCT "Brute" and its four matching "showroom" cars, without a doubt, the greatest state set ever, and at $3300, it certainly was! Alas, when I moved permanently back to Nashville, I had no room to operate or display this set so I sold it to a dear friend. It included a custom-built, cabinet-grade wood engine carry case with brass handles. The new, modern version (1953) that Lionel is currently offering is a nice diecast engine in its own right, with the proper wheel arrangement, but cannot compare to the TRUE, magnificent tinplate versions of the 381 locos and their awesome tinplate consists! When you pick up a tinplate state car at 21" long and with a weight of 6 1/2 pounds, you realize quite quickly you have one of the greatest toy trains ever made!

I do run Standard Gauge tinplate and modern O.  I think this is cool but I'm not really interested in owning it.  For some reason, it bothers me that it's numbered 281E.  If you're going to do a real homage, go all the way: 381E

BEACHHEAD2: I heartily agree: that is a bogus number!  😐 

As a Milwaukee Road collector I love it, but it's not tinplate! 

If Lionel really wanted to produce a "tinplate" O gauge BiPolar, they should have looked to RichArt's O gauge tinplate BiPolar for inspiration!  

Here's a picture of the prototype for RichArt's O gauge BiPolars.  

Below is a picture of the production run RichArt tinplate BiPolar after several changes have been made to the design.  The easiest to spot is the elimination of one side window and the movement of the door from the center to the right.  Another less obvious design change is the movement of the body attachment points from the sides on the prototype to the bottom on the production model.  Above, note the 6 brass screw heads along the side of prototype that are not seen on the production model below.  There are many other design differences.

Finally, here's picture of Dick in his workshop next to the O gauge RichArt tinplate BiPolar, which he custom painted for me in Milwaukee's UP livery.   To go this this engine I own several tinplate RichArt O gauge passenger car "kits", which someday I will get around to assembling and painting in Milwaukee's UP livery to go with this one-off BiPolar.   At the time of Dick's passing, he and I were in discussions  for him to make some special passenger cars which would be longer in length than any he had previously made.  Unfortunately he passed before he could make them.   Now the "kits" will have to do.

IMHO, Lionel's O gauge BiPolars in their 2019 catalog are fine for what the are but they are not "tinplate".  

Bob Nelson

Hello all 

Bob nice photos of Dick Mayer and his BiPolars ... thank you for posting 

Pierre Maurer made number of BiPolars  building atop a Lionel GG1 chassis ...  available in the late 60's and 70's 

Cheers Carey  

I just ordered the set and extra cars,,its a nice attempt to do something different,,,,,the key word is "inspired"yes its not tinplate,dosent claim to be,that works for me 

Gentlemen,

   I do like the engine, however it's way out of my budget, just after purchasing a new home.  Would fit in with my Tin Plate O Gauge without too much trouble.

PCRR/Dave

Interesting adaptation. The engine has no doors on the sides of the cab because it was modelled after the late modified Milwaukee Road bipolars, they rounded the ends and closed up some of the side windows and doors. Sure hope they center the '281E' markings on the center body (and use real brass plates).

Frankly, I like the Rich Art and the Maurer adaptations a lot better. Real tinplate. I won't be buying this set (actually just got a standard gauge set and a couple of extra cars, good enough)

Jim

hummmmmmmmmm,,,this quite possibly was the 1st tinplate inspired engine ???

I have to admit that tinplates have a beauty all their own.