DCS Signal tanked on layout with solution (finished)

So, what was the solution?

 

Matt,

   Look like you got side tracked and never finished your post, what was the final out come and how did you fix the problem.  If your problem was with the RealTrax switches it really had nothing to due with your DCS.

 

PCRR/Dave

Has been a long time since I messed with this kind of stuff, an I see your credits so I am not sure if I am telling you anything you don't already know, but back in my day some of the things I found that messed up my signal like this could be for example, just one of the trains.

 

Basically if something went funky with one of the trains, or even too, when I used to have some of the TMCC ones that I had that was customed up like the one I described in my Polar Express post, those could wound my signal.

 

I remember even buying a brand new MTH train of which it was I cannot remember, an for all intensive purposes, it ran, but just never fed back the same signal all the others did, an I went over it a thousand times to Tuesday on every connection an anything that could cause its bad signal, but never was able to change it by much at all. Eventually I got MTH to send me a new board an it helped a good amount, but it was never all 10's like I could get from my other models if I made things spotless with all things.

 

An yes, it would also cause issues for my other trains an signals any time it was on the track.

 

Also I have herd of other things such as cars with CV light systems an other parts that can be a source for issues.

 

Basically I would get one train you suspect is good, an one piece of track an just one loop of the TIU an disconnect all else an see what you get, an if its good, then work your way out from there as there may have been something you put on recently, or something that happened to some part, an you just have to figure out what an where.

 

If you do find the same with the start of this, an several other trains feed back the same, my guess is something went bad in the TIU an will just have to contact MTH to see if you could get a replacement.

 

Hope that is of some help.

Sorry guys, while in the middle of writing this post the dog came back from playing with a huge cut on her leg requiring me to drop everything and get her to the vet. I didnt get sidetracked I got hijacked onto a more important issue

Oh good lord, hope it all worked out.

I'll let you know, right now she's having an allergic reaction to a tetanus shot. She's sll swelled up.

Hope the dog is OK.

 

You're right Matt, connecting two channels together is the kiss of death for the DCS signal, that really throws it for a loop!

Dogs fine but I was a bit worried til this morning. I cant believe i did it though. I'm usually much more careful about stuff like that. I'm sure Im not the only one that has accidentally done it. I told you i was getting RF out of range during a signal test, its not always a remote issue. I just didn't think id get that error any other way, that's why i was so stumped

Matt,

   Although I have not mis-wired in this particular manner I have reversed some wiring

under platforms from time to time, and learned the discipline of using color coded wiring

that is for sure.  Glad you got things straightened out.

PCRR/Dave

Ok getting it now,2 channels on the same block. Same thing can happen if an insulated center rail joint lets goes, or track expands making contact.  I like to push a lighted car  on track that is suppose to be dead.  If it lights up something  is wrong.

Matt hope your dogs doing well. Years ago the same thing happened to me. At a lift out bridge that isolated 2 channels. With the weather changing the track joints ended up touching ever so slightly. In my diagnosing. I started removing blocks one by one to see if the signal got better. The fact that a lighted caboose was still lit after removing the power feeds led to the problem of the center rails touching. Took a few hours to figure it out. Some quick trimming with a dremel and some Plastruct to insulate the joint fixed it for good.

Dave, it really wasn't a mis-wire so much as a forgot to cut the track. Problem was it happened so long ago I just missed it

Matt,

So that whole ripping it out rant was really caused by operator error!    Glad the dog is fine.  G

Sure was, but it's still to complicated. I do believe there is a 300 page book on how to run trains

I should be noted the mistake was made while wiring it specifically to meet the wiring requirements of DCS

Matt M,

   RJR and I have had discussions in threads about me advising people of the necessity of the DCS O Gauge companion book.  Because I am a Professional Engineer (PWE) DCS is right up my engineering alley, and yes mistakes like yours can be made, and often are.  For that reason when building a DCS layout I keep advising people to test as they build, if you would have tested more often as you built your layout, your operator error would have been caught when your 10 signal faded.  I also learned the hard way by not testing as much as I should have while building fortunately Barry was around to correct me back then.

I got to admit both Marty F and Barry taught me a lot right here on the OGR forum back in those days.  Back when the TIU was not quite the engineering piece of gear it is today, I probably would have been even more frustrated than you were with this problem.  However Marty's Magic lights cured problems back then that nothing else would, coupled with Barry's disciple for star wiring, things eventually worked out quite well on my fair sized FasTrack layout.  

We all learn!

PCRR/Dave 

Dave, it was actually an addition to the layout that the mistake was made. I simply got distracted and forgot to cut the rails to isolate the block. Most people dont understand my situration, I am building this layout for my uncle. He lives 5 hours form me so after working a 50 hour week, I get in the car and drive 5 hours spend 16 to 24 ours a weekend working on the layout and then drive 5 hours home and go to work for a 50 hour week the next day. My house rule is never leave the layout inoperable so when I leave every weekend I have to be able to run trains and the systems need to work. Prior to this I had more than enough error issues on the layout with engines not on track and out of RF range. This layout was wired with DCS in mind and Legacy was added later. I am very technically proficient and have a pretty serious grasp of what I am doing with a solid plan on  the end game however things get missed and despite popular believe the DCS system is a finicky thing and problems can arise just form the trains you are running

I have the same issue so now I know what to look for which is good But now I have to look for it which is bad. I hate wiring have I said that before. I run my tmcc engine more now because of it .

 

Im glad my thread could help point you in the right direction. I put off solving this issue for quite some time

Matt, thanks much for posting your solution.  It reminded me of the possibility and saved me a couple of hours trouble shooting.

Took me 9 hours to get to the solution

Matt,

    9 Hrs is not to bad, when DCS was in it's infancy and Barry had not written his book yet I use to call him on the phone and then try to rework or continue building our DCS layouts, and with the 1st TIU I remember resolving problems that seemed to go on for ever.  Thank God Marty F came up with the Magic light upgrade, I was about to take contract hits on the MTH DCS design engineers.  I know what you mean about being technically proficient, I often wonder what some poor guys does that has limited engineering skill, when building a DCS/Legacy combination layout.  No matter what anybody tells you Barry's book and his great technical writing is a serious addition to our hobby if you use the DCS/Legacy remote controls.  Now there are lot of guys running DCS/Legacy, however in the early days things were a lot more confusing and sometimes very frustrating.  The upgrades to the TIU, especially Rev L has been just fantastic and with the addition of Legacy the 2 systems actually work better together.

Building or adding on to our Christmas layout each year, keeps my engineering mind busy, I just love this stuff!  As much as I understand about our DCS & Legacy layouts this OGR forum is one of the greatest educational tools for our hobby I have ever seen.

PCRR/Dave 

DCS can be frustrating sometimes