Detroit & Mackinac Ry. Co. Box Car?

typically.

overlandflyer,

What, do you mean by typically?

Did the prototypical box car have NO markings on its' 'A' & 'B' ends, or is this a Lionel fantasy item?

Thank you,

Ralph

The National Model Railroad Association has a wealth of info:

http://www.nmra.org/member/sit...eets/Rolling/d5e.PDF

Railroad historical societies are also a good source:

http://www.michiganrailroads.com/dmhs/home.htm

Not all model railroad manufacturers letter the car ends.  It appears that some Lionel PS-1 boxcars have end lettering while others do not.

Maybe your car is a mfg fluke and worth mega $$$$$. 

An email to Lionel would answer your question. 

Thank you Old Goat, for the info. and suggestion.

I received the box car yesterday, saw the ends minus the markings, I checked online and saw Lionel's color photo. showing NO marking on its' 'B' end.

After, a further check online, I did not find the same box car with this light gray top half and maroon bottom half, but I did find three prototypical color photos. taken in Late '50's, to mid '60's of D&M box cars, with different paint schemes and in the three photos. the ends that are visible, in the photos., appear NOT to have any markings.

That, is why, I am asking for expert help, on this forum.

Ralph

Old Goat, again thank you, I just checked the 'D&M Historical Society,' as per your suggestion and there is a color photo., of said Lionel box car and the prototype car has markings on the top right corner of the 'A' end.

http://www.michiganrailroads.c...Cars/FreightCars.htm

Take care,

Ralph

You're welcome...and nice detective work. 

Prototype cars w/o end markings would be rare.  The car ends are subjected to wheel spray which adds layers of dirt and makes the markings difficult to see in photos.

Thank you Old Goat for this extra, valuable info.

So, far, I did not correspond with Lionel, as to this possible mistake, but even in their stock, color photo., the end farther away from the viewer, has the bottom half, under the ladder, white/light gray!!!!

The actual scale model has a light gray, top half and a maroon, bottom half, unlike Lionel's stock, color photo. and the D&M proto. photo., which clearly shows, for both, a white top, half and red, bottom half.

It, is an attractive color paint scheme, both prototype and scale model, even though the scale model has darker colors.

Ralph

well i'd hate to say every example, but typically the B end is the end with the mechanical brake wheel (what i was trying to indicate by the arrow).  it can also frequently be identified by the direction of the brake cylinder mounting and/or the location of the retainer valve.

Thank you overlandflyer for your answer.

Take care,

Ralph

Sorry to inform you but the D&M never owned a 40 ft PS-1 boxcar which is the basis for the Lionel model as compared to other boxcar design types such as the 1937 AAR.

So in terms of boxcar design features, the Lionel car is a fantasy car.

The paint scheme and road number is accurate for a 1937 AAR boxcar except for the lack of road numbers on the car ends.  As you discovered, these cars did have road numbers on the car ends.

would you really put this car in the same (fantasy) class as an M&M's hopper?

PRR #1,

Thank you for your useful info.

I usually try to purchase a model as close to the prototype, as possible, but this Lionel car is attractive and it does imitate the prototype, as you can see in one of my previous posts, that's why I bought it.

So, far I have not seen this car made by any other manufacturer.

The actual prototype car, as seen in my one previous post, though with the same scheme, does look differently built, than the Lionel famous PS-1 style box car.

As, for the missing markings on the 'A' & 'B' ends, at first I thought this to be a D&M 'HOME TRACK CAR,' but then I figured that this was another Lionel fantasy, or a goof.

Earlier today, I contacted Lionel in regards to this matter, but so far no reply.

Be Well,
Ralph

Ralph,

I think you have the perfect perspective on the matter.

The paint scheme for this car is very eye catching and Lionel chose to model it with the boxcar mold they already have.

I too have a few cars that are not exact replicas but serve as good stand-ins.

I have only been in O scale for 5 years but in looking back at old magazine advertisements dating back to the 80s and 90s, the hobby has come a very long way in terms of accurate, well painted and highly detailed models.  There will always be the inherent limitations in accuracy due to tooling costs, etc. but O scale is currently at a very good level in my opinion.

Enjoy your boxcar.

BTW, I didn't mean to bash your purchase choice in any way by using the term "fantasy" car.  You had used the term and I interpreted your definition applied to cars that are not quite accurate either in paint scheme and/or in detail features.  I just wanted to point out prototype characteristics vs. the model.

PRR #1,

Please, I did not take your advice as a insult, I welcome the helpful information.

Before, Old Goat provided the link with a color photo. of the actual D&M box car, with the same scheme, as my purchase, I had no idea, if a prototype car existed at all.

I searched the inter-net, but I did not find any D&M prototype car similar to my purchase.  Instead, I found three color photos. of D&M prototype box cars with different paint schemes and in each photo. it was difficult to visually see any end markings and that is what lead me to believe that these cars were either D&M 'Home Track' cars, or FAMOUS Lionel 'FANTASY' cars, or a Lionel goof-ball.

And, until Old Goat's link and your info. of D&M never owning PS-1, 40 ft. box cars, that  I did not know who the builder of the prototype car was.

I know, Lionel, also, is famous for their Pullman-Standard-1 box car designs, but due to the lack of prototype info., it might just have been possible that D&M had cars built by P.S., or used PS-1 building kits.

Thank you,

Ralph 

Ralph

All is good.

I didn't take your reply as a insult.

My previous post was meant to offer my opinion that you and I share the same viewpoint in terms of willingness to purchase a model based more on the appeal of its appearance than say on prototype fidelity.  In the same post, I also wanted to clarify at the end, more so due to overlandflyer's comment than anything you had written about, what constitutes a fantasy car.  I feel the use of the term "fantasy" car can vary greatly among people.  Again, I interpreted that you and I share the same view on the use of that term as well.  Some hard and fast rivet counters, won't purchase a model unless it is true to the prototype in every way from paint scheme to underbody brake gear so anything less is a fantasy car in their view; whereas, others like myself hold to a lesser standard which can change depending upon the situation making allowances knowing that model manufacturing has its limitations.  Sometimes I won't buy a model if it doesn't match the prototype well-enough other times I am less fussy.

I am glad Old Goat and I could offer some further insights on this particular boxcar.  That is one of the great values of this forum; the exchange of helpful and factual information.

PRR #1,

A BIG 10-04!!!

Ralph

Of, little importance!!!!!

After, no reply to my E-Mail, I telephoned Lionel yesterday and I was told that the D&M box cars are made up as is, without any end markings and that Lionel does NOT have any D&M box car end markings decals to give out and/or sell!!!!!
So, in addition to Lionel using their famous PS-1 body, dressed in the colorful D&M scheme, they also do NOT have any remedy for the naked 'A' & 'B' ends!!

GOOFED AGAIN!!!

Ralph