Exploding MTH PS2 GG1

Is that the 5 volt board?  What shape was the battery in?  You talk litigation on an engine made in 2002. Get real.   No silent recall exists.  My guess is you might have still been running with a very out dated white battery.  You blew the board.  Nothing MTH did wrong.

Well said Marty!  Maybe the litigation is coming from the stranded passengers...

I feel bad for this guy.  On the real side, I added him to the list of people I do not want to be involved with.  Litigation for a 2002 locomotive??????????   

It's time for people like MTH to go after these manufacturers of faulty electronic components. It's time for them to pay for the grief their causing. I'm sure it hurts MTH sales. As to your appropriate question, Steve, is litigation possible, this is where it would have to begin. Maybe then the money would become available to have a recall.  That fishy smell takes a long time to leave the room and would probably never leave your memory.  Of all the caps in the electronics in our homes, in my life time, I never remember or experienced "that smell" til now. So it's not something that is normal and excepted. I'm sure MTH would have a strong case.

Get real!  He blew a capacitor. It happens in electronics all the time. Litigation? Come on . . . 

A while back, a friend brought a Lionel locomotive with a blown capacitor on the electronic e-unit board. It was easily changed to put the engine back to running.
Hopefully your loco can be repaired this way too.

Something happened to me - I must sue somebody. Good grief.

Paul

ps, my Postwar SF F3 wobbles - who can I sue?

"It happens in electronics all the time". Start saying your prayers when you smell that smell crossing the Atlantic on a Air Bus.

"It happens in electronics all the time". Start saying your prayers when you smell that smell crossing the Atlantic on a Air Bus.

A capacitor in my garage door opener exploded while I was running it repeatedly while I was tweaking the door limit adjustments. (They gave me a replacement motor).

Hopefully airplanes are built with redundant systems, and higher quality components.
Aren't toy trains expensive enough already?
There isn't much chance of someone being killed as a result of a toy train capacitor blowing.

Not taking care of something (following the maintenance) or being sloppy and careless is called contributory negligence.

Truthfully, if blowing capacitors happened all the time, they wouldn't be used. But in life, "stuff happens". Anyone ever get a flat tire? Did you sue the tire manufacturer because their was something on the road or a pothole? I actually once knew someone who burned out an engine because he didn't change or check his oil. Is that the manufacturer's fault? Take it back further, and think of the maintenance on a ZW (that great, reliable workhorse) that needs to occur over time to maintain it. Just part of life.

Gerry

I'm sure it happens in Airbus too. I work designing military electronics. If the part is used in a safety critical manner, there is a redundant circuit designed into the system so in case of failure, the backup circuit is used. As stated by CW, that is an expensive solution.

I burnt out a logic gate on a PS3 slave board last month, im not gonna sue MTH for a $0.48 part or for the $80 board I bought. If the fix I bought form digikey for 48 cents works fricken awesome, then I have a needed spare slave board in my inventory

Good points guys.  That engine was made about 15 years ago.   Would anyone expect a computer or TV to be operating that long.   Not time to go after anyone.  Old electronics.  My guess is it had an old battery in it.  Litigation--I think not.

Capacitors are devices that store charge. When voltage is first applied they are close to a short circuit (instantaneous ) until the charge builds to the supply voltage. If they are supplied a voltage greater than their design voltage then they punch thorough and can become a real short and sometimes blow up. If this cap was marked 35WVDC then it had about a 2x safety factor built in. Sometimes the isolator between the plates breaks down over time causing the cap to short. MTH did nothing wrong and no legal action can be taken. It is just age and use that caused the failure (14 years worth!).

I have lost two caps in recent times. One a few years ago in my lathe motor (used for starting) and yesterday in my swamp cooler motor. It happens! Nothing is forever! In aerospace circuits are analyzed for a reliability factor based on the individual parts' expected life. The worst reliability for a single part is any electro-mechanical part like a relay or switch. Caps of various types are usually not the driver of any aerospace system's reliability. One MTH engine I bought from new had a faulty switch from new.

LDBennett

Marty's overly hostile retort has hurt my feelings and I must therefore seek legal council and retreat to my safe place known as any college campus these days.  I would settle for 3 million dollars and a public apology and admission of bigotry along with a sizable donation to BLM.  Obama has, as a matter of fact, already weighed in on this and I have been invited to the White House to cry in front of the cameras right before he gives me a hug and tells me we are sending Marty to sensitivity  and inclusion training..... not that any of this is scripted or anything.   

P.S.  I agree with you whole heartedly Marty but my lawyer says I must keep up the charade as my future on the beach doing nothing with the only beach built O gauge layout in history depends on it!

exploding capacitor!

Well I certainly would like to run my new Ca1 caboose that I bought at York in April... but for fear of fire I have not! And no reply from MTH....

Also if you purchased the latest smoking tank car... return it for a refund... its a major liability.

The product above has been recalled.

Every manufacture has some issues, but I wish MTH would step up to the plate and offer a solution for the Ca1 cabooses. Obviously there needs to be some preliminary testing done before these products are released.

https://ogrforum.com/t...quality-alert?page=1

I've had a number of bulged capacitors on the 5V boards, it's usually the same capacitor location.

Edit: of course I can't spell.

As mentioned before, bulging caps are a problem. Had a Samsung monitor that failed, opened it up and saw the bulging caps, replaced all the electrolytic caps and the the monitor has been running for over a year and a half. If you service a engine or anything and have it apart or the shell off, always take note of the tops of the caps to see if the tops are starting to bulge.

When I get a 5V PS/2 board equipped engine in for service, I always check the caps.  You can reach a couple of them from the side of the board, if I see evidence of bulging, I replace them.  So far, none of the boards I've replaced the caps on have come back, and I've replaced them on two of my own and they're still running.

Those Capacitors do have life.  As they age they can leak, dryout, or burst.  There are other electronics that can fail and cause those capacitors to see an overload and cause them to burst.  So in most case that older PS-2 5V board has failed.  The engine can be repaired with an upgrade board.  These types of repairs are common for the older engines.   G

GGG posted:

Those Capacitors do have life.  As they age they can leak, dryout, or burst.  There are other electronics that can fail and cause those capacitors to see an overload and cause them to burst.  So in most case that older PS-2 5V board has failed.  The engine can be repaired with an upgrade board.  These types of repairs are common for the older engines.   G

So, if I wish to preserve my 5volt boards, at this point, I should inspect the caps and replace any suspicious ones.  This would prevent failure and future remorse.

Right?

Are the 3 volt boards susceptible to the same failure mode?

Cheryl, that's just one thing you can do, but only a couple of the electrolytic caps are possible to change, you can't reach most of them.  You can also make SURE you have a good battery, I get them in all the time with the old white battery still installed.

J DADDY, I haven't seen failed capacitors on the 3V boards, but then they're newer than the 5V boards.

That engine was made about 15 years ago.   Would anyone expect a computer or TV to be operating that long.

Yes.

John, your favorite explididng caps have me worried

Yep, the expliding caps are especially dangerous

Unlike many electronic components, electrolytic capacitors indeed have a rated/specified life, usually between 1000 and 10,000 operating hours. There are also a host of parameters that are usually overlooked in non-critical designs (temperature, ripple current, mounting position etc.) These have a great effect on capacitor life.

I dare say that electrolytic capacitor lifetime is the limiting factor in most consumer electronics today. Fortunately or unfortunately, modern technology usually becomes obsolete before the capacitors fail!

I still have a few 5V boards roaming around my layout.  I keep fresh green batteries in them.  Every time I fire one up, I keep my fingers crossed.  Whenever I have time (rare) I convert them to 3V boards.

I have a few 5V boards on my layout that are always in the back of my mind. I should just order the conversion parts so I can fix em when they do blow

I seem to remember early on a cap was used to bridge original TMCC components to make them function with PS1 and that cap was  shrink wrapped in case it blew.

Caps "go" all the time.  Mostly they just bulge, stop working and/or cause errant voltage fluctuations.  Had them go in video cards, my amps and can't remember what else.  Usually, it's just replace them and move forward.

Back in the 90's when electronics really started making headway into our trains, folks were wondering what that would mean to the future of the hobby.  Well, looks like the future is here.  Instead of rebuilding e-units, we're rebuilding the electronics. We just traded one form of maintenance for another.

I'm not making a judgement or complaining.

Fred

gunrunnerjohn posted:

Cheryl, that's just one thing you can do, but only a couple of the electrolytic caps are possible to change, you can't reach most of them.  You can also make SURE you have a good battery, I get them in all the time with the old white battery still installed.

 

I have replaced all white PB batteries (Peanut Butter, lol ) with green ones in any engine using a 9volt configuration.  So I should be momentarily safe

Thanks GRJ

I think there may be a law firm advertising on TV for a class action lawsuit involving electrolytic capacitors.

That's for price fixing, not exploding.

All kidding aside, we may want to wear safety glasses when working on our trains.

Rod Miller

I am a much greater danger to myself while holding an Xacto Knife than exploding caps ever will be. Im not trying to sue Xacto for my being dumb

I know they make a heck of a bang when they go off. We brought home several "new" old stock locos last October, and 2 of them let go.

We had replaced the batteries with BRC's before trying on track.

Seller took care of getting them repaired.

romiller49 posted:

All kidding aside, we may want to wear safety glasses when working on our trains.

Rod Miller

How about a "Hazmat Suit"

Wow.

Marty Fitzhenry posted:

Good points guys.  That engine was made about 15 years ago.   Would anyone expect a computer or TV to be operating that long ...

C W Burfle posted:

Yes.

Yes, I certainly agree with CW, but according to some that's too much to expect with MTH train electronics. And it's the owner's fault for not replacing the battery??

So, all MTH electronic locos should be retired after 10 - 15 years? Or have an expensive "upgrade" which might be good for another 10 - 15 years? Ask me why I favor postwar conventional power. I have locos 50 to 80 years old with no expliding parts.

Reverse polarity on a polarized capacitor can make a heck of a bang. Try it outdoors with some junk parts and suitable body protection for an education.

exploding capacitor on YouTube