very curious to hear the impressions of first timers at York.
Bob C.
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Hi Robert
I will take the time to give you my personal opinion. They are free and that is why people have so many of them.
I had a absolutely wonderful time. I walked constantly all day Thursday with a brief 10 minute break for a sit down.
On Friday I only got to spend 2 and a half hours and it was in the orange hall .That's all the time I had in the Orange (A Dealers Hall).
I wish I could have spent a day in that hall. Hopefully I get to go a second time and do that. Heck I wish the halls were oped to 9PM. Of course the vendors probably want to shoot me for that remark LOL.
I had a great time and from the amount of things I brought home I probably need a bigger Truck next time.
Larry
Erwin, TN
Larry
I am glad you had a good time. And thank you very much for your input.
Bob C.
Larry, it was nice to meet you. Glad to hear you enjoyed your first York. 
Thanks Mike, same here.
It was definitely a good train experience with Dave, Marshall and Bob. I was supervised well .
Larry
Just curious, not to get into an "age debate" , but any sign of younger people at York, 40 or so and younger (not kids, but collectors)?
at York you should find a lot of younger collectors. we probably have many on the Forum.
Bob C.
mwax516 posted:Just curious, not to get into an "age debate" , but any sign of younger people at York, 40 or so and younger (not kids, but collectors)?
Present and accounted for
Present as well. My son is about to turn 8. I didn't bring him this York meet and I won't in October either. I'll probably try him out at next Aprils meet. He's already a tech junkie so I guess it's time to spend some money on Legacy and DCS.
Larry Sr. posted:... I had a great time and from the amount of things I brought home I probably need a bigger Truck next time.
...
Spoken like a true first-timer who had a terrific time!
As a first-time exhibitor I had a great time. I enjoyed the individual conversations about my products and especially the suggested improvements. I look forward to receiving photographs of buildings for my consideration to model and to returning in October with more items to offer!
Special thanks to the Somerset 4-H Trainmasters members, past and present, for stopping by and to those who talked be through the jitters of a newbie exhibitor.
Weighed in on this on different post earlier, but concur with others - fantastic experience. Bought way more stuff than I expected to but still plenty on the want to buy list to go. Will be going back in October and bringing my wife. Also going to go earlier to visit the museum in Strasburg. Beautiful area.
mwax516 posted:Just curious, not to get into an "age debate" , but any sign of younger people at York, 40 or so and younger (not kids, but collectors)?
Can't imagine many younger enthusiasts choosing York over buying trains. Although they may seem synonymous, York effectively charges $70 for just the right to get into the place to buy trains. Personally, I'd rather spend that money on actual trains and not a ticket to get into a place to buy trains!! And yes I've been there... Just won't likely be back due to the rediculous admission cost of membership plus ticket
One hell of long car ride but worth every minute. I will be back and stay for two day not just one.
NVOCC5 You can always catch the charter bus to York and save the driving. The bus has a pickup in the Bronx. The bus flyer is posted on the Eastern Divisons website. Lenny J
Hi LennyJ
I will consider that next time I go, thanks for the tip.
if you take the bus what will you do with all the stuff you may buy?
Bob C.
Robert Coniglio posted:if you take the bus what will you do with all the stuff you may buy?
Bob C.
Ask the guy sitting next to you to hold it on his lap. Seriously, most charter type buses have luggage compartments.
mwax516 posted:Just curious, not to get into an "age debate" , but any sign of younger people at York, 40 or so and younger (not kids, but collectors)?
Also present and accounted for.
Though the joke among friends is that I was one of the youngest people at York when I joined and started attending 19 years ago, and I'm still one of the youngest people at York! (I'm slightly further along on the bell curve distribution regarding ages, but nowhere near the average yet)
-Dave
BHalfway posted:mwax516 posted:Just curious, not to get into an "age debate" , but any sign of younger people at York, 40 or so and younger (not kids, but collectors)?
Can't imagine many younger enthusiasts choosing York over buying trains. Although they may seem synonymous, York effectively charges $70 for just the right to get into the place to buy trains. Personally, I'd rather spend that money on actual trains and not a ticket to get into a place to buy trains!! And yes I've been there... Just won't likely be back due to the rediculous admission cost of membership plus ticket
I paid fifteen dollars, I believe it was, a few weeks ago to buy a guest ticket on line. Where does the other fifty-five dollars come in ?
While I enjoyed myself at York, I found it overwhelming. I met a couple of fellows Navy Seabees and had some nice conversations with vendors. But I think I prefer smaller meets more local to my home. I didn't find the prices any better at York than I do at local meets.
mwax516 posted:Just curious, not to get into an "age debate" , but any sign of younger people at York, 40 or so and younger (not kids, but collectors)?
As a table-holder in Blue Hall, I saw a lot of people my age (soon-to-be-48) and younger walking around, and they seemed to be buying. I couldn't estimate the percentage, but they were there, and I also noticed a lot of guest badges as well. Hopefully those guests had a good enough time to want to join and come back.
Andy
Joe Hohmann posted:Robert Coniglio posted:if you take the bus what will you do with all the stuff you may buy?
Bob C.
Ask the guy sitting next to you to hold it on his lap. Seriously, most charter type buses have luggage compartments.
And if you buy more than your fair share of the luggage compartment, UPS is set up near the Silver Hall so that you can ship stuff home.
Andy
Dear Robert C
If I have too items I will mail to my house via USPS or UPS if it does not fit on the bus. I saw that UPS has a shipping center set up at one of the halls.
In general over all experience:
Pricing was all over the place. I found some great price and some pricing what where they thinking?
I do appreciate all the tips, suggests and comments I got from my thread in regards to tips. Getting the tickets in advance was a big help.
In regards to age: I believe I fall into the younger crowd. I did see a lot of face that seem to be in my age group late 40-early 50. Bell curve was favoring the older crowd.
Quick question. I did hear of the on one of the announcements that TCA had a table where you could bring your custom train and show the membership. Does any know more information about that? I would like to see what other members have built and what their think was behind their build.
Dear Dan
"While I enjoyed myself at York, I found it overwhelming." I agree with your statement but for me it felt more like sensory overload. A lot of stuff for sale and too little time to see everything. Next time I am coming for two days, not enough time to see everything in one day.
Dan Padova posted:BHalfway posted:mwax516 posted:Just curious, not to get into an "age debate" , but any sign of younger people at York, 40 or so and younger (not kids, but collectors)?
Can't imagine many younger enthusiasts choosing York over buying trains. Although they may seem synonymous, York effectively charges $70 for just the right to get into the place to buy trains. Personally, I'd rather spend that money on actual trains and not a ticket to get into a place to buy trains!! And yes I've been there... Just won't likely be back due to the rediculous admission cost of membership plus ticket
I paid fifteen dollars, I believe it was, a few weeks ago to buy a guest ticket on line. Where does the other fifty-five dollars come in ?
While I enjoyed myself at York, I found it overwhelming. I met a couple of fellows Navy Seabees and had some nice conversations with vendors. But I think I prefer smaller meets more local to my home. I didn't find the prices any better at York than I do at local meets.
It's my understanding you can only get that guest deal once. From here on out you would need to pay the membership cost ($50 annually) and the price of the ticket for York ($15-20)... IMO you should be able to get into the show w/o having to be a member. I have no interest in standard gauge or tin plate trains which is the primary focus of TCA. Therefore the TCA membership does absolutely nothing for me and I'm paying approx $70 to get into the show....
My home is in Sarasota, but my dad lives in Baltimore and me helping him out since my mom pasted it was a no brainier to attend York. This was my first visit and can't wait for Oct.'s show. I met a lot of people who I consider friends now. I briefly met you Alex and was great to meet you in person & congrats on selling a lot of your items. Nice to keep food on the table isn't Alex? Special shout out to very special now I call friends who most of you guys know; Dennis & Al. Had a great time meeting both you guys. Their experience, talent, and knowledge in this hobby is priceless, and so is their product. Not only did I buy Dennis's RH & Al's TT both guys made great tweaks to my layout. So much selections and really not much time, in October I will be more organized and prepare for more purchases. Great Show!
Dear Andy
Where in the Blue Hall?
KRIS
Sounds like you would be all ready for a bus trip.
Bob C.
mwax516 posted:Just curious, not to get into an "age debate" , but any sign of younger people at York, 40 or so and younger (not kids, but collectors)?
I was a guest and thought the experience was fantastic. As far as youth goes I bought my young son (36) with me. He also enjoyed it. I will most likely join this year so I can return.
BHalfway posted:It's my understanding you can only get that guest deal once. From here on out you would need to pay the membership cost ($50 annually) and the price of the ticket for York ($15-20)... IMO you should be able to get into the show w/o having to be a member. I have no interest in standard gauge or tin plate trains which is the primary focus of TCA. Therefore the TCA membership does absolutely nothing for me and I'm paying approx $70 to get into the show....
They're Heeeeeree.......... (never fails!)
You've already obviously made up your mind/agenda. So if it's not for you, don't join/go (what a concept!).
Some of the first timer's who have replied to this thread apparently enjoyed it, so it seems it can be a benefit to new people. They will likely attend at least a few more meets and make up their mind over the long run if it's a good deal for them.
The general public thing is never going to happen. Accept it and move on. If every person in the member halls had to have a PA tax number to attend, it's going to die sooner rather than later (I will not be starting a small business just to sell my excess stuff at a 6 foot table at York, I'm guessing a fair number of others are in the same boat).
nvocc5 posted:Dear Andy
Where in the Blue Hall?
By brother and I had tables in the alcove in the back of the hall. If you noticed the stuff made out of rail, spikes and horseshoes, that was my brother's stuff (he blacksmiths as a hobby). We had all 3 tables in that row.
Andy
I have no interest in standard gauge or tin plate trains which is the primary focus of TCA.
Not true. The TCA covers all brands, gauges, and ages. And has bent over backwards to be more welcoming to operators.
The articles that appear in the TCA Quarterly are written by members. If there appears to be a disproportionate number of standard gauge / tinplate articles, its because there are members who are willing to write meaningful articles on the subject. Articles on Modern era stuff tend to appear in the E-Train online magazine. The magazine is available to the public. (Which I think is a mistake, why buy the cow, when the milk is free)
Dave45681 posted:... The general public thing is never going to happen. Accept it and move on. If every person in the member halls had to have a PA tax number to attend, it's going to die sooner rather than later (I will not be starting a small business just to sell my excess stuff at a 6 foot table at York, I'm guessing a fair number of others are in the same boat).
Regarding York being "open" for the general public and the ensuing PA tax certificate burden issue -- just a few thoughts and questions:
For those selling in the member halls such as blue and silver who don't want the burden of getting a PA tax certificate, I wonder how many of them also sell at local TCA sponsored meets in PA throughout the year. Since those TCA local meets are open to the general public, aren't PA tax certificates required for TCA members selling at those TCA meets just as the Eastern Division York would have to require of sellers if the York meet were likewise open to the public? (And if not, why then an unfair double standard for those other PA TCA division sponsored meets?)
And since it's likely some TCA sellers in the member halls also sell at non TCA venues such as the Allentown regional meet as well as small "local" shows and flea markets in PA. I find it hard to believe the organizers of those shows don't require sellers to have PA tax certificates. Also, there are sellers in those member halls who already have PA tax certificates because they own local hobby shops or other retail businesses in PA.
Relating to my previous questions and points, I wonder what percentage of TCA members don't already have PA tax certificates because they only sell twice yearly at York and nowhere else in PA?
BHalfway posted:Can't imagine many younger enthusiasts choosing York over buying trains. Although they may seem synonymous, York effectively charges $70 for just the right to get into the place to buy trains. Personally, I'd rather spend that money on actual trains and not a ticket to get into a place to buy trains!! And yes I've been there... Just won't likely be back due to the rediculous admission cost of membership plus ticket
So now not only membership, you also have to buy an admission ticket to get in? I signed up for myself $35, and got two cards green for myself and white one for family (wife), but wonder if I will be dinged another $35 for her? Wow maybe I better rethink York and save a bunch of money. After all a train show is a train show, just more of everything, right? Know I will be dropping TCA membership after October York, as I just wanted to see what the hype was all about, and besides pretty expensive to drive from Iowa and staying in hotels. But that just me, your experience will be different, especially if you are within easy couple hour driving distance.
Noticed there was a thread saying York open to the public, but was deleted before I could read it. Must been misleading stuff. Too bad TCA is a "closed society". Wonder why York doesn't want the "riff raff public" to discover trains?
This was my first York and I really loved it. I will remain a member of the TCA whether or not I attend another York. I attended all 3 days though only about an hour on Saturday morning before heading home. I hope to go again though it will be difficult since I'm moving to Florida later this year.
RRMAN,
Whatever you were charged is all you will be charged before either: a) your membership year is up, or b) you register for another meet. You will not get "dinged" out of the blue for something you do not attend or sign up for. Neither the TCA National nor the TCA Eastern Division is out there haphazardly randomly charging people's credit cards!! (if that is not what you meant, I apologize, but your statement sure read that way to me)
You didn't have to join if you wanted to visit as a guest (once only). I'm sure many here would have registered you as their guest.
The quote you were responding to has much misinformation by omission.
Yes, if you want to continue to visit York, you need to pay TCA dues each year ($50 now, not sure where your $35 (old dues rate up until a bout one or 2 years ago) came from unless there was some sort of special offer).
You also need to pay the Eastern Division for admission to the York meet(each time), just like any other train meet/show, except it's about 5 times the size of most any other meet you will attend (less maybe 2-3 other large ones in other parts of the country).
The tax thing is why it's a "closed society" as you call it. The removal of the 2 signatures probably at least several years ago now removed any legitimate gripe about that.
As to other meets, you absolutely do need a tax number to have a table at the Allentown show!!! Or Greenberg/Worlds Greatest Hobby, etc.. It's right on the form to register for a table at Allentown, I'm pretty sure (don't have a form handy).
Dave45681 posted:RRMAN,
Whatever you were charged is all you will be charged before either: a) your membership year is up, or b) you register for another meet. You will not get "dinged" out of the blue for something you do not attend or sign up for. Neither the TCA National nor the TCA Eastern Division is out there haphazardly randomly charging people's credit cards!! (if that is not what you meant, I apologize, but your statement sure read that way to me)
Thanks Dave for "re-railing my engine!"
Dave45681 posted:As to other meets, you absolutely do need a tax number to have a table at the Allentown show!!! Or Greenberg/Worlds Greatest Hobby, etc.. It's right on the form to register for a table at Allentown, I'm pretty sure (don't have a form handy).
True. The tax people tend to go after the big shows and meets and ignore the small ones (for now), so sellers at some small shows and meets can get away with it, for now. PA's tax policies have killed flea markets and swap meets here in PA. 20-30 years ago, there were so many that you could hit 3-4 of them on a good day if you didn't linger too long at any one of them. Now, the few that still remain (because they are under the radar, or are too remote, or have paid the right people off) are far enough apart that you can do one or maybe two if you are up early enough.
The PA Revenue's deal with the TCA is that as long as it remains a private event, the revenue department will stay away and be content with the taxes they are collecting from the increased business to the local hotels, restaurants, stores, gas stations, etc. that all benefit from the influx of people from out of the area and out of state. And the businesses selling in the dealer halls still have to collect sales taxes and submit them to PA (you may not see it in dealings there unless you use a credit card, but it is there). The deal protects the member sellers in the member halls.
Andy
BOB C the charter buses have storage overhead and underneath. The buses are opened every hour for 10 minutes so you can store your purchases without carrying them all day. As others have mentioned UPS has a station in the silver hall if you want to ship item. Lenny J
Andy Hummell posted:The PA Revenue's deal with the TCA is that as long as it remains a private event, the revenue department will stay away and be content with the taxes they are collecting from the increased business to the local hotels, restaurants, stores, gas stations, etc. that all benefit from the influx of people from out of the area and out of state. And the businesses selling in the dealer halls still have to collect sales taxes and submit them to PA (you may not see it in dealings there unless you use a credit card, but it is there). The deal protects the member sellers in the member halls.
Andy
Kinda reminds me of Orwell's Animal Farm: "All [shows} are equal, but some [shows] are more equal than others" To me, you tax everyone or no one, don't pick and chose. As an example in Iowa EVERYONE pays the sales tax at any show no matter the size, only exception is garage sales where they expect you to be on the honor system, and agents have been known to stop at random sales to hand out tax forms. Granted this revenue is minuscule but serves to keep people honest when word gets around. But that's just my perspective, not to derail this thread.
Dave45681 posted:BHalfway posted:It's my understanding you can only get that guest deal once. From here on out you would need to pay the membership cost ($50 annually) and the price of the ticket for York ($15-20)... IMO you should be able to get into the show w/o having to be a member. I have no interest in standard gauge or tin plate trains which is the primary focus of TCA. Therefore the TCA membership does absolutely nothing for me and I'm paying approx $70 to get into the show....
They're Heeeeeree.......... (never fails!)
You've already obviously made up your mind/agenda. So if it's not for you, don't join/go (what a concept!).
Some of the first timer's who have replied to this thread apparently enjoyed it, so it seems it can be a benefit to new people. They will likely attend at least a few more meets and make up their mind over the long run if it's a good deal for them.
The general public thing is never going to happen. Accept it and move on. If every person in the member halls had to have a PA tax number to attend, it's going to die sooner rather than later (I will not be starting a small business just to sell my excess stuff at a 6 foot table at York, I'm guessing a fair number of others are in the same boat).
I don't intend to join/ go.... I'm fine with purchasing through other sources. And there are plenty of them! I've attended numerous time and, as you say, have made up my mind...
Your attitude towards my comment Dave45681 is the reason this hobby has little chance of having legs past the folks currently attending York. The question was asked about younger folks attending and the issue continues to be raised about youth getting involved. Although there are a few folks here under 40 who confirmed they attended, the majority (large large large majority) are over 50. I appreciate the knowledge I gain from being a part of this site but can certainly site my reasons (and reasons I believe represent my generation being under 40) for failing to see York as some super duper deal. Your attempt at a verbal slam demonstrates my point why the narrow minded, stuck-in-your-ways, psuedo-elitist membership will wither into oblivion. Without the approval and interest of MY generation (and large numbers of them to boot) younger generations will have no problem letting the TCA evaporate. So go on with your "Fine, we don't need you anyway!" attitude... we'll see what thing look like in 20 years!
You don't feel like getting a PA tax number to sell? Tough!! Don't sell there then!! People shouldn't be taxed with the cost of membership plus admission because you're too lazy to do something required for you to sell! You want to make money? Do your part!
