Flyer Chief Polar Express sets and add on cars shipping this week!

Same response I posted in the other thread:

As I read the response, it is up to the customer to call Lionel if the original brick won't power the basic set and Lionel will (likely) replace it with one that will still only run the basic set.

If the customer wants to run with the extra cars, they'll have to plunk down another 55 bucks for a 72 Watt brick.

I'm sure the non-model railroad purchasers will be glad to hear that.

Rusty

Rusty....I will put this here also.

_______________________________

"It is important to note that if your customers add the two separate sale American Flyer passenger cars to the base set that the included transformer will likely not power the set at the top end speeds."

________________________________

Mine runs OK with 5 cars just not top speed.

Lionel has confirmed that they are offering a complimentary 72 watt power supply for the Polar Express S gauge sets Charlie is wrong , I do not know who he is talking to.

Thanks

Pat

I just talked with the Lionel Service Department.  This situation is the same with O gauge "Ready to Run" sets including the O gauge Polar Express.  The wall power pack has enough power to run the original consist, but falls short if you add extra cars.  Not a great design parameter.    

Lionel has confirmed that they are offering a complimentary 72 watt power supply for the Polar Express S gauge sets Charlie is wrong , I do not know who he is talking to.

Thanks

Pat

Pat I am NOT wrong and here is my proof direct from Lionel;

Dear Value Added Dealers,

Please see below for a message from our Production Team regarding the recent concerns on the 6-49632 A/F Polar Express Sets:

We apologize for the delay in responding to our request to hold off on shipping the 6-49632 American Flyer Polar Express sets to your customers who have so patiently waited for these sets to arrive. We received some initial feedback from customers who were concerned the sets would not operate properly with the included power supply. We took the time to review the set once again and have determined that the set, as packaged operates fine using the included 18VDC wall transformer included with it. In the event any of your customers have any performance issues with one of these sets, please have them contact Lionel Customer Service directly at 586-949-4100.

It is important to note that if your customers add the two separate sale American Flyer passenger cars to the base set that the included transformer will likely not power the set at the top end speeds. This is due to the transformer having just enough current to handle the locomotive, tender and three cars in the set itself. In the event your customers plan to operate the set with 5 cars (the base set plus two add-on cars) they will need to purchase a transformer with more current, such as our 6-81603 72 Watt DC Transformer, which is currently available in stock.

We apologize for the delay in getting this information to you, but we wanted to ensure there was nothing that had slipped by us in delivering a world-class magical train to the S gauge community.

Thank you,

Lionel

If you have further questions or concerns, please contact your Lionel Sales Team and we will do everything we can to get you answers and resolution.

Thank you for your patience on this matter.

Look higher,  I posted the same thing here earlier.

crickets...................

The bottom line is Circle L screwed this up and should offer the larger power supply to all who purchased. Personally I don't care since I won't be using it anyway. And, contrary to their view of things, it is possible to get the supplied wall wart to overload with no add-ons. I've done it just by "gunning" the accelerator and blowing the whistle at the same time.

Hey, Guys

I will have the replacement power packs here by Friday. We stand behind our product and will always go the extra mile. I would hope all Dealers will be honest and fix this problem. 

Thanks

Pat

PATRICK'S TRAINS

Hey, All

I just got a message from Lionel and they stated they will deal with the Power Pack issue on a case by case basis. They will issue a new transformer if warranted. We will not be giving out these power packs, you have to contact Lionel Customer Service.

Sorry for the confusion.

Thanks

Pat

WWW.PATSTRAINS.COM

Charles Ro had to make the switch too.  First my friend was told by Charles Ro that they would ship him 9 of the bigger power pacts free as Lionel would provide them to Charles Ro. Yesterday Charles Ro called him back and said that Lionel had rejected Ro's request for the power packs.  Now he has to check all 9 power packs to see if any are faulty.  If faulty they will be replaced with the same model as was shipped in the set. 

Sorry to say but what a mess with the delivery of this particular Polar Express product by Lionel. In the rush to get this item out with a particular time frame. It seems the supply chain was pushed and thus it wasn't properly tested. Quality control missed the boat or train in this case. Just my opinion.

It sounds like the solution may be different depending on who you speak to at Lionel. With cases like this, why is there any wonder that the train hobby is in such decline. Most of the old timers probably won't care, because they are probably already using better transformers to run their layouts, but these are entry level sets, and problems like this can only discourage newcomers! The suits at Lionel need to get their heads out of the sand (or wherever else they may be stuck).

Bill in FtL

George:  It was properly tested.  Within its design frame it works fine.  Lionel plans for all of its "Ready to Run" sets to have a power pack that just runs wheat comes in the set box.  This is no matter the gauge.  To me the problem is that the design frame is off base. 

I have to say that I disagree here, I have the basic set here in the UK with the two add on cars.

Although I am using a step down transformer with the set transformer plugged in I am having problems with it cutting out as a basic set and with the add ons.

When I first set it up I specifically ran the engine first on its own and found that initially with the smoke on, it would cut out intermittently. It got better as I ran it and it then seemed to run fine. I then added the three cars from the set and found that it would run reasonably OK with the controller set at about the 60 degree setting, any more than that then it was cutting out about every 1.5 laps of the circuit. If I turned the dial to between the 120 to 150 degree setting then it cut out more frequently. I also found that once it had cut out and the setting was set high, then it would cut out within a few seconds, I guess this is down to it wanting to throttle up to a high setting from nothing after a cut out.

When I added the other two cars then everything just became more problematic and in reality the set can't be run in this combination.

It appears that for some people it may run in the basic set configuration OK from what seems to have been said and for others it is failing, so it seems that the transformer is on the top limit of having sufficlient current to power the basic set and any miniscule additional power drain just tips it over the edge and it gives up!

UKaflyer:  The two add on cars were not part of the set.  Lionel put in a power pack only for the engine and 3 cars. I don't know what power pack they sent to the UK.  It may be different because you don't use 110 voltage>

My previous post did say that I did the testing as the basic set of engine and three cars and I was getting power problems. 

In Europe the UK operates on 240V and mainland Europe operates on 220V. The EU beurocrats decided harmonisation was needed so they decided on a simple 230V across the board was the new standard to be adopted, truth is that in reality nothing changed, we operate on 240V +/-6% and the mainland of Europe still operates on 220V +/-6%,  it was just a paper exercise.

I know my house voltage can peek at 251V as I have had a voltage recorder installed for a week to check it for another reason.

My step down transformer is rated at 230V as per the dictat of the EU and it states it drops to 110V. The power supply that came with my set is the same as everyone else's.

The only difference there is between us is the frequency, we are at 50Hz and the US at 60Hz, this may be where the problem lies, as the power supply does say 60Hz. The power unit also states it can operate between 100-120V AC, so even if there was a higher voltage going into it then I think that I would still be within the working parameter, I will see if I can check the input voltage to the power supply later.

What would be interesting to know is how the basic set performs up an incline. If you set up a Fastrack circuit that mirrored the original Flyer gradient, will the set cut out,  because I would have thought the loco would draw more current, or will it be fine and the power unit be sufficient? Or is the set only meant to be run on the flat?

I also found that even if you just add one of the extra cars it still cuts out more frequently.

Apart from the power supply issue I am still pleased with the set and the way it performs with all the functions, good value for the money! It's real purpose is that management wanted a Christmas themed set under the tree and not just ordinary Flyer stuff, so this met the criteria perfectly.

The engine stopping is when it looses power from the track.  Read the manual as it explains the built in shut down situation.  The Berk found several places on my layout it didn't like.  I fixed them and all was OK.  Also, if you run too slow over switches it will shut down because of the frog.  I have Gilbert switches.

The reason is it picks up power from one track through the front truck, which has one wheel set.  The trailing truck picks up power from the other track, but has two wheel sets.