American Flyer Smoking Caboose

Hope it was worth the wait.

.... and its a year past the warranty limitations!

well I took it out of the box and it looks good, reviewed the instructions and decided to try it out, well guess what it states to pull the smoke stack straight out, no way will it even move it looks like someone pushed it in to far I have tried every thing to try and get it out with no luck, not going to put any tools on it as it will damage the stack!

I am very disappointed on this after 4 years and this is what I get!

maybe if I waited another year the stack would come out!

When you have time, please show us a photo!

Is it a complicated disassembly?  If you can take a look inside you may have a better vantage point.  After 4 years that just sinks on ice!

Good luck with this!

Rich

The issue is the smoke stack is a t shape it has a hood on the stack it appears the hood has two tabs that protrude into the stack I guess you can bend them outward to remove once that is done I think you can slip the body off the frame by removing two screws on the ends. It is not that I cannot do this,the point is why should I.  having repaired every flyer I have owned and almost every accessory they made, I have a higher expectation on something new like this. however life goes on.

for those that missed the point of the Guess what, in 2011 Lionel/flyer offered for the first time a smoking Caboose for American Flyer, the guess what! was  it finally came today 4 years later, maybe some people think that is ok I do not, while I thank Lionel for offering it I think 4 years is a little to much, and then to receive it and you cannot remove the smoke stack, that is poor, maybe I am just to picky! oh well!

I went to the Charles Ro website and he shows them "In Stock" so he should be shipping too.  I hope I like mine. 

bill I would be interested to know if your stack comes out, I am thinking that it is possible that either the smoke fluid caused some stiction! or is it possible that the unit run hot and that is causing the issue I assume these units get tested at the factory.

mine came from Charles Ro, so your should be coming soon!

I will spend some time on it tomorrow stay tuned! 

I received mine and the instructions are wrong.  It talks to the fact that to avoid damage you that the caboose comes with the Smoke stack removed and you must insert it.   Mine came fully assembled.  All you need to do is add the smoke fluid (using the suggested in the instructions needle nose dropper) to put about 4  to 5 drops down the stack.  I have this type of dropper from Mega steam and it works just fine.  No need to remove the stack.

--Rocco--

the instructions states to remove the stack before adding smoke fluid!

what I do not know is what and how does the stack attach inside, without knowing this you could put fluid in and it does not all go into the smoke unit? 

today I tried to remove the stack with small pliers and it will not budge, so I am thinking it is not meant to be removed. I made an attempt to remove the body and it does not want to come off, do not want to damage it so I will leave it alone for now. I am just going to put fluid in and see what happens, I ordered another caboose so if all goes wrong  I will have a second.

you would think that someone proof reads this stuff and actually follows the instruction to make sure it works as the instructions state. 

my concerns are it is 4 years in the making you would think someone was on this it seem Lionel is just cutting corners, not a good sign for the long haul.

I have seen these signs many time in my life, they must be under financial pressure.

other signs shipping schedule does not reflect accurate info, product getting dropped, these are the tip of the ice burg!

I had my order ready for 2015 catalogue items it is around 3000k I just do not feel I want to continue down this road with Lionel I am going to wait and see what MTH comes out with before I make any decision for 2015!

just my feelings!

You forgot to mention buying two of what they make in case the first one does not work or work out.  What have we been conditioned to do and/or accept?  Would you do that with an appliance around the house?  Your phone?  An oil filter for your car?  Does that help to correct a quality problem or propagate it further?  

Have any of you guys called the Lionel customer service/technical people and asked for assistance?  This might be a good idea since you have the caboose.  586 949 4100

Hi when I get the second one I am sending the first one back to the Lionel service dept. after waiting 4 years I would like to have one in my collection.

I have two grandson who I have them running AF trains I usually buy 3 of the same cars so I give each one I usually do it around Christmas so I will get a 3rd one, one of these days.

The smoking caboose has 2014 date.

Informed correspondance can always find the right answer.

I emailed Mike Reagan, who is in charge of customer service at Lionel, and asked him about the caboose situation.  Here is his reply:

________________

Mark:  Thanks for your reply.  I understand your point about the directions being wrong.  The issue here is Lionel and the Chinese manufacturing group have communications problem now and in the past plus probably in the future.  But for three days people have been communicating about the issue here and not contacting Lionel.  In less than 10 minutes I had an answer, "Put the fluid in the stack".  I also had an answer about why the directions were wrong.

Before or after he turns in his "Real Man" membership card?

Rusty

The instructions were copied from a O scale caboose. Flyer the same way see page 4.

 My roof has some rub marks from the plastif packaging rubbing on it.

 Red showing through two yellow handrails.

 One wheelset have so much tension that the wheels won't even turn!

 Running TMCC it does work very well. In transformer control no smoke.

 Installed 24V lamp for TMCC control.

 Only a 4 year wait for this!

What kind of transformer did you use for conventional control?

MRC pure sine wave. Smoked at 15+V in neutral.

Thru powermaster =chopped sine wave

Since you've already found that the caboose only smokes well at high voltages it sounds like the similar condition noticed with recent production Lionel locomotives that prefer a chopped sine wave power supply when run in conventional mode.

Perhaps some other operators will chime in with results of operation of the smoking caboose with alternate power supplies for comparison.

EDIT: While poking around I discovered that smoking cabooses have been a problem since they were introduced. The most common complaint I see among the "O" gauge guys is that units that smoke OK in conventional tend to burn out (or melt the caboose body) when subjected to the full 18 volts of TMCC. Or, units that work fine with TMCC (or perhaps chopped sine wave) don't produce much smoke with a conventional full sine wave transformer. The exception seems to be the K-Line K612-2113 UP Police Smoking Bay Window Caboose (perhaps others in that line) that comes with a switch for TMCC/conventional to compensate for the differences in typical operating voltages. Seems like a Good Idea.

From Yahoo side.

Hello, everyone. I thought that the stack was just stuck, so I put a thin piece of foam packing material around the stack and pulled upward from the side with a needle nose pliers. Do not pull up from the top as you will break the flapping smoke deflector. Lay the jaws of the pliers flat on the catwalk and approach from the side. I got it off. Just a minor mark on the stack.  Now I realized that the picture on Page 4 had the stack opening on the wrong side. They want you to hold the caboose at an angle and then squirt up ( the flying Wallendas cought not get into this position LOL) If you flip the page upside down ( The page # 4 is now at the 12 O'clock position) , the illustration is now flipped and all you have to do is squirt down slightly towards the catwalk and you can fill this thing. I over filled it at first, and then sucked some out using a pipette and now it works.  Just a lazy  smoke stream , not a full blast like in the catalog. I used light smoke fluid (A1 Normal). I am going to hunt for some Seuthe Fluid to see if that works better. This caboose is best left on a siding as a display in a yard (to monitor the smoke) since it almost impossible to see when it needs more fluid on a moving train, the smoke output is that weak. Good luck people !!

I guess people aren't looking back on what was posted.  DO NOT TRY TO GET THE STACK OUT>  IT IS GLUED IN.

Read what I posed earlier after communication with Mike Reagan of Lionel.

I emailed Mike Reagan, who is in charge of customer service at Lionel, and asked him about the caboose situation.  Here is his reply:

________________

Boy, this thread does not bode well for the future of S scale. An item take years to be delivered, has issues with the packaging, and then perhaps is best left on a siding?

No thanks. If Lionel is to be one of just a very few main players left to supply the scale, then I don't see much of a future here...

Mark in Oregon

Well,maybe one last thought.

It seems to me that 1.5-2 minutes is a long time for smoke to develop. My post war Flyers will smoke almost as soon as power is applied...

OK,I'm done...

Mark in Oregon

Its not listed as "in stock" on the Ro website today.   

Charles Ro sent me my caboose and I received it today.  Here is my list of comments:

1. There were some packaging marks on the roof as others have noted.  I removed them by first using a metal polish I have used many times before on Gilbert New Haven and heavyweight cars to bring back a smooth shine.  I used Mothers Mag & Aluminnum polish.  Now, I use a cloth and rub softly then rubbed it with another cloth to remove the polish.  After the polish I applied Armorall and then wiped it dry.  No trace of the marks remained.

2. The top of the stack does shift to the side to put in fluid.  Mike Reagan did not tell me this so I will let him know.  

3. The smoke is just how he described it.  It is like smoke from a small coal stove in the tender, which it actually was.  It is not a fan driven smoke unit like the Diesel's have.  It is a wisp.  No, when the train flashes by it is not apparent.  Scale guys should love this because the smoke is to scale!

4. Like a Gilbery engine the more power to the track the heavier the smoke.  I hooked it to a Gilbert 8B transformer and tested it's smoke unit with varied power.  It still produced noticable smoke at half throttle.  For one of my Gilbert engines that is what I would expect.

All-in-all I am satisfied.  It is interesting to look at in operation.  It will be an good display piece on a siding as someone noted.

By the way, Ro sent a hard copy of the 2015 catalog with the caboose.  I am glad they did that as an extra.   

You are right Bill it is just a wisp coming out of the stack, which is fine for the caboose. I did notice if you put to much fluid in the stack it will run on the inside of the caboose and run under the bottom. I only use 6 to 8 drops of fluid. JT's MEGA-STEAM works good.

Lionel product warranty registration shows 6-48745 no products eligible for warranty!

4 years delivery Lionel lost track of product.

Lionel still should back up there products even after a 4 year wait for an item.

Hi Guys,

Back again re the Smoking Caboose.  I have had so many complaints on this unit and the inability to produce smoke that I first replaced the Lionel smoke wick with a AF wick with great results...but now I am helping other owners with a simple and DRAMATiC volume increase that doesn't require replacing the wick.  In Lionel engineering infinite wisdom they forgot that the smoke unit chamber has to "breathe" to produce smoke.  With Lionel engineering  the only way to get air to the unit is down the same stack where the smoke is coming up!!!!  OK, to remove the housing simply slightly bend both rail ends of the caboose back so you can remove the two end screws in the door.  Be careful to use the correct Phillips head..you don't want to burr the screw heads.  Lift the caboose shell off gently but firmly and the smoke stack will remove.  You will note the smoke unit is made in two halves - a top and bottom- held by two screws.  Remove the two screws and here is the big trick. Add spacer washers to separate the two halves by about 1/16" right at the screw sites.  You want to create a gap between the top and bottom halves. Fasten the top and bottom unit together and now the unit can "breathe" so vapor evaporation can take place.  YOU WILL LOVE THE RESULTS AND TELL ME HOW YOU MADE OUT OR GIVE ME A CALL.  We may want to pass this idea on to Lionel....it should have been tested and correctly made form the beginning. Den Cannon   302-239-9474

For those who are running conventional and for whom a 'bigger' effect is desired, smoke fluid intended for Seuthe(TM) smoke units should be tried because of its lower vapor pressure compared to other fluids. LGB smoke fluid is good candidate. For those of us running under Legacy/TMCC control at high constant voltage, the smoke effect when using Lionel Premium is quite satisfactory with the box-stock caboose, in my experience.

YMMV

Bob

Thanks Bob for the input.  It has been my experience that BOTH types of fluid are further enhanced by allowing the unit the "breathe".   I have created my own smoke fluid much like the original Flyer....like the scent and the output and with my modifications I am a very satisfied customer.  Den Cannon

I received American Flyer smoking caboose 6-48745 over three weeks ago. The owner's manual is not on Lionel web site where a addendum could be done. In product registrations you can register Clear smoking caboose 6-48759 canceled item not the 6-48745 smoking caboose. Picture from 3-rail side.

1. GOT MY AMERICAN FLYER 6-48745 SMOKING CABOOSE A COUPLE OF DAYS FROM CHARLES RO SUPPLY A COUPLE OF DAYS AGO, AND I'M SENDING IT BACK TOMORROW. "THOUGHLY DISCUSTED"... I'VE BEEN AN AMERICAN FLYER COLLECTOR, OPERATOR AND REPAIRER FOR OVER 60 YEARS.. FIRST RIGHT OUT OF BOX IT SMOKED FOR ABOUT ONE MINUITE THAN JUST STOPPED WORKING ALL TOGETHER. PLUS THE FRONT WHEELS WOULD NOT TURN, BECAUSE OF TOO MUCH TENSION FROM THE PICKUP FEELERS. DENNIS CANNON GOT IT RIGHT, THE UNIT HAS TO BREATHE OR THE SMOKE  WILL NOT PUFF OUT OF THE TOP OF THE STACK..I MAKE MY OWN SMOKING CABOOSES WITH GREAT SUCCESS USING HO BACHMANN SMOKE UNITS ORDERED RIGHT FROM BACHMANN CO. FOR ONLY ABOUT $5.00 A PIECE. THEY HAVE THEIR OWN RESERVOIR AT THE BOTTOM OF THEIR HEATING ELEMENT, SO THEY SMOKE FOR QUITE A LONG TIME, JUST USING THEIR OWN BACHMANN SMOKE FLUID. BUT DENNIS WAS ABBSOLUTLY RIGHT, IT HAS TO BREATHE, SO I MADE A SMALL VENT HOLE IN THE FRONT OF THE CABOOSE SO AS THE TRAIN WAS PULLING IT DOWN THE TRACK AIR FLOW COULD INTER THE INSIDE OF THE CABOOSE A FORCE THE SMOKE OUT OF THE STACK.. THEY WORK FLAWLESSLY.  I ALSO INSTALL TWO ALTERNATING 3MM RED BLINKING LEDS, USING A BLINKING CURCUIT I GET FROM A SUPPLIER ON LINE FOR ONLY $5.00 A CURCUIT...THIS 6-48745 CABOOSE WAS NOT WELL THOUGHT OUT, VERY POOR ENGINEERING AND SUB STANDARD WORKMANSHIP. I'M SENDING MINE BACK PRONTO!!!!  IF LIONEL IS GOING TO KEEP TURNING OUT JUNK LIKE THIS I WON'T BE BUYING IT!!  Carl